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Google's initial investors included the CIA (InQTel). The internet itself was a defense (DARPA) project. The Bell Labs work on the transistor emerged from war-

Google's initial investors included the CIA (InQTel). The internet itself was a defense (DARPA) project. The Bell Labs work on the transistor emerged from war-time efforts to produce extremely pure germanium "crystal" mixer diodes, used in radar units. I can go on and on about the inventions spawned by defense funding. Silicon valley itself owes its existence to Northrop Grumman and their ilk, who were early tech employers seeding Intel, Xerox, HP, Apple, with crucial tech talent. Today's tech aversion to defense agencies is one of the most paradoxical philosophies to ever exist. Instead of demanding more accountability from defense agencies, they outright refuse to sell/engage with the very people providing national security, and hence allowing a civilized society with a stable government to exist.

skybrian 8y ago
There are certainly many people who work for defense contractors and they are necessary. But, other people don't want to do that. If they join a company that's not a defense contractor, and it becomes a defense contractor, it feels like a bait-and-switch. That's not what they signed up for. And it does seem like, in a large industry with many different kinds of jobs that need to be done, it's clearly not necessary for everyone to work in defense. On the other hand, the funny thing about large companies is that they do many things, but by reputation they're treated as a single entity. So you get into a somewhat weird situation where people care what some distant part of the company does that has almost nothing to do with their work day-to-day. I'm reminded of Paul Graham's classic essay, "Keep Your Identity Small" [1]. If you join a large company and identify with it, this is making your identity larger than it probably should be. For better or worse, many employees of these companies feel responsible for things they have little control over. They feel good when the company does something good and bad when the company does something they don't like. So they decide the problem is that they need to have more control and this results in a rather problematic kind of company politics. [1] http://www.paulgraham.com/identity.html http://www.paulgraham.com/identity.html
- deleted 8y ago
  [deleted]
- writepub 8y ago
  There's no bait and switch anywhere. Employment is primarily at-will, and anyone can walk out anytime. Also, companies have certain identities in certain time-windows. Apple was a computer company in the late 90s, by late 2000s it had already gone through 2 identities: a music player company, to primarily a phone company. Employers cannot guarantee what work and markets they will and won't chase. Being a cloud infrastructure and AI company, it's predictable for Google to decide to go after one of the largest spenders in the space, defense.
  - xiphias2 8y ago
    If you listened to the TGIFs made by Eric Schmidt 12 years ago, it was totally different. It looked like there's enough opportunities to make a lot of money without going to the war industry (I can't call defence what the U.S. is doing). What do you think ,,Don't be evil'' means? We (non-Americans) were all writing code and staying at Google in the late evenings, sometimes working on weekends because we really though that Google is different. Of course when 2008 happened, a lot of things changed, the optimism changed to being cautious and more frugal, which everybody understood. Since then Google changed it's motto, but the code and the network effect stayed with it.
    - writepub 8y ago
      > We (non-Americans) were all writing code and staying at Google in the late evenings You weren't really doing Google a favor, they were paying you well above market for your work. The fact that your nationality is a point for you to highlight is indicative of your warped expectations. You chose to move to America, no one forced it on you. And you chose to work for Google. If America welcomed you, allowed you to freely express yourself and thrive professionally, WHY is liking America, or supporting the defense establishment that protects your civil liberties and safety, and creates a stable socio-political environment for YOU and million others who immigrate and live here, such a toxic thing? America is the world's most sought after immigration destination for a reason, it's OK to acknowledge the positives, and like it for the same
      - 8y ago

skybrian 8y ago

There are certainly many people who work for defense contractors and they are necessary. But, other people don't want to do that. If they join a company that's not a defense contractor, and it becomes a defense contractor, it feels like a bait-and-switch. That's not what they signed up for. And it does seem like, in a large industry with many different kinds of jobs that need to be done, it's clearly not necessary for everyone to work in defense. On the other hand, the funny thing about large companies is that they do many things, but by reputation they're treated as a single entity. So you get into a somewhat weird situation where people care what some distant part of the company does that has almost nothing to do with their work day-to-day. I'm reminded of Paul Graham's classic essay, "Keep Your Identity Small" [1]. If you join a large company and identify with it, this is making your identity larger than it probably should be. For better or worse, many employees of these companies feel responsible for things they have little control over. They feel good when the company does something good and bad when the company does something they don't like. So they decide the problem is that they need to have more control and this results in a rather problematic kind of company politics. [1] http://www.paulgraham.com/identity.html http://www.paulgraham.com/identity.html

deleted 8y ago
[deleted]
writepub 8y ago
There's no bait and switch anywhere. Employment is primarily at-will, and anyone can walk out anytime. Also, companies have certain identities in certain time-windows. Apple was a computer company in the late 90s, by late 2000s it had already gone through 2 identities: a music player company, to primarily a phone company. Employers cannot guarantee what work and markets they will and won't chase. Being a cloud infrastructure and AI company, it's predictable for Google to decide to go after one of the largest spenders in the space, defense.
- xiphias2 8y ago
  If you listened to the TGIFs made by Eric Schmidt 12 years ago, it was totally different. It looked like there's enough opportunities to make a lot of money without going to the war industry (I can't call defence what the U.S. is doing). What do you think ,,Don't be evil'' means? We (non-Americans) were all writing code and staying at Google in the late evenings, sometimes working on weekends because we really though that Google is different. Of course when 2008 happened, a lot of things changed, the optimism changed to being cautious and more frugal, which everybody understood. Since then Google changed it's motto, but the code and the network effect stayed with it.
  - writepub 8y ago
    > We (non-Americans) were all writing code and staying at Google in the late evenings You weren't really doing Google a favor, they were paying you well above market for your work. The fact that your nationality is a point for you to highlight is indicative of your warped expectations. You chose to move to America, no one forced it on you. And you chose to work for Google. If America welcomed you, allowed you to freely express yourself and thrive professionally, WHY is liking America, or supporting the defense establishment that protects your civil liberties and safety, and creates a stable socio-political environment for YOU and million others who immigrate and live here, such a toxic thing? America is the world's most sought after immigration destination for a reason, it's OK to acknowledge the positives, and like it for the same
    - 8y ago