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Universities shouldn't be worried about racial quotas or anything like that -- but they should be worried about homogeneity (at least, private universities). Th

Universities shouldn't be worried about racial quotas or anything like that -- but they should be worried about homogeneity (at least, private universities). There's a very good point to be made that a university should be a place where people of different backgrounds and cultures can come together in a collective environment. If you have 60% 'Asian students who want to major in math or science and play the violin' that's an issue, just as 60% white business major lacrosse-players is an issue. I do have to say, one area where I'm concerned is graduate international admission. In my experience the TOEFL is clearly not cutting it with some people and knowing English is not optional as a graduate student -- you NEED to be able to easily communicate with your fellow grads and, perhaps most importantly, the undergrads you TA. Similarly, strong accent should definitely be a factor in choosing who can lecture classes. I don't care how good a researcher someone is if no one can understand them. This isn't even a complaint about Asian students and professors, either. The person I'm thinking of is Brazilian.

alextp 16y ago
I kind of agree; it annoys me to meet people who emigrated and after years still speak with a thick accent and make strong grammar mistakes. I'm brazillian, and I observe this phenomenon both with foreign people in brazil (who apparently refuse to learn some vowels and gendered nouns) and brazillians who emigrate to english-speaking countries and still have crappy english. I wonder why this is, though. First time I went to london (I was young) I was shocked that I, just out of movies and internet and some classes, spoke a better english than most working people I met in the streets who seemed to have emigrated there years ago.
- stcredzero 16y ago
  Sone people are just better at some things than others. I know some "musicians" who can't play a steady rhythm even after years. It's also connected with exposure as a child. (Works both for music and language.) It's less common for someone to achieve the high fluency level of a native speaker starting as an adult.
- nick_dm 16y ago
  It doesn't surprise me that learning from movies and the internet would make you more proficient than someone who learnt by living in the UK. When people are forced to speak a language that they do not know well they often end up reinforcing bad habits. Once someone has developed bad pronunciation or inadvertently trained themselves to ignore certain grammatical features it takes a lot of effort to correct the habits. Of course a committed learner can offset this to some degree, but most immigrants aren't willing to put in the effort and are only partially aware of the mistakes they are making. After three years they then speak in much the same way as they did after six months, but with a larger vocabulary.
jchonphoenix 16y ago
Universities don't care. It is naive to believe that a research university's purpose is to educate its undergrads. If you speak to any professor, they will tell you that the purpose of a university is to create ground breaking innovation on the bleeding edge of their fields. The undergrads are there just because they have to deal with it. Given the option of teaching and research, most professors wouldn't think twice.

alextp 16y ago

I kind of agree; it annoys me to meet people who emigrated and after years still speak with a thick accent and make strong grammar mistakes. I'm brazillian, and I observe this phenomenon both with foreign people in brazil (who apparently refuse to learn some vowels and gendered nouns) and brazillians who emigrate to english-speaking countries and still have crappy english. I wonder why this is, though. First time I went to london (I was young) I was shocked that I, just out of movies and internet and some classes, spoke a better english than most working people I met in the streets who seemed to have emigrated there years ago.

stcredzero 16y ago
Sone people are just better at some things than others. I know some "musicians" who can't play a steady rhythm even after years. It's also connected with exposure as a child. (Works both for music and language.) It's less common for someone to achieve the high fluency level of a native speaker starting as an adult.
nick_dm 16y ago
It doesn't surprise me that learning from movies and the internet would make you more proficient than someone who learnt by living in the UK. When people are forced to speak a language that they do not know well they often end up reinforcing bad habits. Once someone has developed bad pronunciation or inadvertently trained themselves to ignore certain grammatical features it takes a lot of effort to correct the habits. Of course a committed learner can offset this to some degree, but most immigrants aren't willing to put in the effort and are only partially aware of the mistakes they are making. After three years they then speak in much the same way as they did after six months, but with a larger vocabulary.

jchonphoenix 16y ago

Universities don't care. It is naive to believe that a research university's purpose is to educate its undergrads. If you speak to any professor, they will tell you that the purpose of a university is to create ground breaking innovation on the bleeding edge of their fields. The undergrads are there just because they have to deal with it. Given the option of teaching and research, most professors wouldn't think twice.