3 ms·

Goodhart's law: "When a measure becomes a target, it ceases to be a good measure." If it is just training to become better at the test to measure ADHD (I don't

Goodhart's law: "When a measure becomes a target, it ceases to be a good measure." If it is just training to become better at the test to measure ADHD (I don't know enough about the game to be sure) than it would be a classic application of that "law".

WhompingWindows 8y ago
I don't know much about the product either, but there are not good quantitative tests to measure ADHD. ADHD is a multifactorial diagnosis that can present with myriad symptoms, and it's diagnosed by examining a list of symptoms and their effect on the patient's life. For instance, do you lose things you need, are you attentive to details, do you daydream or space out to your own detriment, do you fidget or move when it's inappropriate, etc. It'd be very lackluster for a single test, or a single person, to judge these symptoms. The gold standard ADHD diagnosis would involve examining the child (or adult) in multiple settings with multiple people's evidence, and then comparing symptoms against those for anxiety, depression, and other MH diagnoses. If they have enough symptoms from the official list, and they've been carefully examined, they may qualify. A simple game/test will never be able to replace that process.
- maceurt 8y ago
  Furthermore, many tests for adhd also work as IQ tests, meaning if you have a loq iq you are more likely to get a lower score, and bice versa. I remember one of the tests for adhd involved response time to visual stimuli and how fast a person responded. Response time has a direct correlation to IQ.
- paulie_a 8y ago
  I generally agree but there are circumstances where you can just tell. My experience as an adult being rediagnosed was honestly answering a survey of questions. Half way through the psychiatrist already knew it. There was no question. I was originally diagnosed in college. And have managed it with a combo of effort and medication. Life has been good. Now I have two family member adolescents. One was diagnosed, and I knew he absolutely did not have it. It took two years before the psychiatrist admitted it was anxiety. Meanwhile the younger one definitely does, but personally I feel he is too young for medication or even be diagnosed. He will eventually be properly diagnosed and be prescribed. I know there is a lot of misdiagnosis, but sometimes it's incredibly obvious even on a first interaction. I am not a psychiatrist but sometimes you just recognize your people.
- ThrustVectoring 8y ago
  One of the big issues with these distress-based diagnosis metrics is that it fails to diagnose people whose social environments are particularly well suited for their mental health issues. If an autistic child has parents who manage their sensory sensitivities and work well with their communicative difficulties, the system sees a child who isn't experiencing a lot of the distress-based symptoms used to diagnose autism. So like, your gold standard diagnosis ends up depending a lot on the organizational and attention demands the patient is required to meet. A business analyst who is required to sit at a desk for eight hours a day and pay attention to boring numbers on a business spreadsheet is much more likely to get diagnosed with ADHD, while a barber that hangs out and does short haircuts while interacting with clients is much less likely to merit such diagnosis.

WhompingWindows 8y ago

I don't know much about the product either, but there are not good quantitative tests to measure ADHD. ADHD is a multifactorial diagnosis that can present with myriad symptoms, and it's diagnosed by examining a list of symptoms and their effect on the patient's life. For instance, do you lose things you need, are you attentive to details, do you daydream or space out to your own detriment, do you fidget or move when it's inappropriate, etc. It'd be very lackluster for a single test, or a single person, to judge these symptoms. The gold standard ADHD diagnosis would involve examining the child (or adult) in multiple settings with multiple people's evidence, and then comparing symptoms against those for anxiety, depression, and other MH diagnoses. If they have enough symptoms from the official list, and they've been carefully examined, they may qualify. A simple game/test will never be able to replace that process.

maceurt 8y ago
Furthermore, many tests for adhd also work as IQ tests, meaning if you have a loq iq you are more likely to get a lower score, and bice versa. I remember one of the tests for adhd involved response time to visual stimuli and how fast a person responded. Response time has a direct correlation to IQ.
paulie_a 8y ago
I generally agree but there are circumstances where you can just tell. My experience as an adult being rediagnosed was honestly answering a survey of questions. Half way through the psychiatrist already knew it. There was no question. I was originally diagnosed in college. And have managed it with a combo of effort and medication. Life has been good. Now I have two family member adolescents. One was diagnosed, and I knew he absolutely did not have it. It took two years before the psychiatrist admitted it was anxiety. Meanwhile the younger one definitely does, but personally I feel he is too young for medication or even be diagnosed. He will eventually be properly diagnosed and be prescribed. I know there is a lot of misdiagnosis, but sometimes it's incredibly obvious even on a first interaction. I am not a psychiatrist but sometimes you just recognize your people.
ThrustVectoring 8y ago
One of the big issues with these distress-based diagnosis metrics is that it fails to diagnose people whose social environments are particularly well suited for their mental health issues. If an autistic child has parents who manage their sensory sensitivities and work well with their communicative difficulties, the system sees a child who isn't experiencing a lot of the distress-based symptoms used to diagnose autism. So like, your gold standard diagnosis ends up depending a lot on the organizational and attention demands the patient is required to meet. A business analyst who is required to sit at a desk for eight hours a day and pay attention to boring numbers on a business spreadsheet is much more likely to get diagnosed with ADHD, while a barber that hangs out and does short haircuts while interacting with clients is much less likely to merit such diagnosis.