5 ms·
I've worked in the ancient DNA field but left (at least for now). I haven't worked with David but have with competing labs. I have mixed feelings about the NYT
by snackematician 8y ago
I've worked in the ancient DNA field but left (at least for now). I haven't worked with David but have with competing labs. I have mixed feelings about the NYT piece -- on the one hand it has a lot of valid criticisms and brings sorely needed critical eye to this hyped field; on the other hand it is sensationalistic, too long, and very unfair to David -- I guess they needed a villain for the piece.
The industrial ancient DNA publication machine is real. A few giants control the vast majority of ancient DNA samples behind a wall, and these giants decide when and where to release these samples. I was part of a study, that got mashed together with a totally unrelated study at the last minute, for the sake of another hyped headline in Nature/Science, which reviewed and accepted the article very quickly. The whole process felt sloppy & rushed, and I was left with a bitter taste that ultimately led me to move on to other areas.
On the other hand, I have immense scientific respect for David. In population genetics, there are a whole host of methods used to infer demographic history that are very biased and ignore important forces like natural selection. David's group has pioneered statistical methods that are more robust and less biased, that make less sweeping claims but are on much sounder scientific footing, and used these methods to derive important insights on human history.
- whatshisface 8y ago>The industrial ancient DNA publication machine is real. A few giants control the vast majority of ancient DNA samples behind a wall, and these giants decide when and where to release these samples. Who controls the samples? That sounds like a sci-fi thriller plot in the making.
- dpflan 8y agoAgreed. This interesting. How does one get access to these samples? Do the custodians have a website with order requests -- something like that? Is there a bidding process for access?
- snackematician 8y agoI should have been more precise. The vast majority of unpublished samples are controlled by a few. Of course, once they are published they are open. To gain access to unpublished samples, you need to form collaborations with the gatekeepers, who decide the ultimate form of publication -- usually, a big Nature/Science paper with 100 authors. I liked this twitter thread about some of the challenges of smaller groups in obtaining samples: https://twitter.com/paleogenomics/status/1086402894641971204 https://twitter.com/paleogenomics/status/1086402894641971204
- dpflan 8y agoThanks for clarifying and sharing that tweet. Who is the owner of the samples when they are discovered? Does the nation authorize/grant ownership to the discoverer? Where are the financial incentives in this "supply chain"?
- leggomylibro 8y agoJasper Fforde's Thursday Next series aren't quite 'thrillers', but one of the recurring plotlines is the existence of Neanderthals who were cloned from ancient DNA samples. And one of the largest moral issues in the books is that they are owned by the company that synthesized them; it's fiction, but you can see why people are extremely concerned about the concept of companies owning both genetic sequences and their end products. What happens when genetic treatments start to fix birth defects in unborn children? Will we allow the companies which produce those treatments to lay claim to the child's organs which would not have otherwise existed? I sure hope not, but I could definitely see it happening in this day and age. It'd be a whole new kind of vertical integration.
- sangnoir 8y agoWindup Girl (Paolo Bacigalupi) is that sci-fi thriller. Granted, it's not about ancient DNA - but about dystopian corporate control of crop seed DNA (think Monsanto/Roundup writ large).