6 ms·

The offputting tone wouldn't be quite as objectionable (imo) if the argument wasn't so FUCKing wrong. > Most "ugly" produce gets turned into soups, sauces, sal

The offputting tone wouldn't be quite as objectionable (imo) if the argument wasn't so FUCKing wrong. > Most "ugly" produce gets turned into soups, sauces, salsa, jam, ice cream, etc. You think that stuff gets made from the pretty fruit & veggies?! jeebus, think about it for a minute I've thought about it, and yes, that stuff gets made from the pretty fruit & veggies. Sure, a LOT of it gets made from the rejected "ugly" fruit from other supply chains, and—also—even in cases where it's being made from the pretty ones, they're not filtering out the "ugly" ones, so generally all the food is used in those cases. BUT, no, we don't have a perfect interoperable system where every ag supplier has equal and complimentary arrangements with supermarkets and salsa factories. Not every packing house is the same (not every one separates out the uglies), and not every one supplies salsa makers. There is PLENTY of waste in between. > The amt of produce wasted bc of labor problems (can't get a crew to harvest) & bad weather (melons that rot in the field bc it's too hot & wet, etc) WAY outstrips produce thrown out bc it's "ugly." She may be right here (would like to see some data, but still—the statement seems plausible), but in what way does that nullify the fact that plenty of produce is still thrown out? In what way does labour/weather-problem-related waste mean we shouldn't also try to reduce waste in areas where we very easily can? > IT GOES TO THE GROCERY STORES THAT POOR PEOPLE SHOP AT This sentence from the same person who just used the phrase "classist as fuck"!?

ryanlol 8y ago
>This sentence from the same person who just used the phrase "classist as fuck"!? There's nothing classist about acknowledging the fact that poor and rich people often shop in different stores.
- krustyburger 8y ago
  The notion that frugality implies poverty is classist, not to mention inaccurate.
  - TeMPOraL 8y ago
    Do you deny that there are both rich people and poor people? Do you deny that there are high-end, expensive grocery stores, and low-end, cheap grocery stores? Do you believe poor people shop at those high-end stores? If you answered 3x NO, then nitpicking this point as being "classist" is, to paraphrase, dumb as fuck.
    - jarcane 8y ago
      Not to mention the effect of neighborhood re: nearby shopping options. I've lived in very poor and fairly rich neighborhoods, and the difference in quality of local grocery stores is dramatic. There are chains I didn't realize even existed, because they targeted different class neighborhoods. And even within a chain, the level of effort put into a given franchise location can vary pretty dramatically as well. And that's in the states. In the UK, it's a running joke that the different supermarket chains are subdivided along class lines.
- zuzun 8y ago
  The claim is odd though. In my experience, the selection of fruits and vegetables differs mostly in variety, not quality. If there is a quality difference, then it might be the other way around, because supermarkets targeting well-off customers tend to have more organic produce, which is almost always grade B.
  - mosselman 8y ago
    Fancy supermarkets probably want 'fancy' fruits and vegetables. 'Fancy' often meaning fancy-looking rather than fancy tasting.
  - Haga 8y ago
    Quality usually differs by region? West vs East Europe Chocolat comes to mind.
- philliphaydon 8y ago
  Wrong. Rich people don’t shop. They aren’t even aware of how their fridge gets stocked. They got too many helpers! Those helpers shop at the same stores us regular folks shop at! (But seriously, is there really such stories that exist as poor/rich or are these just the same stores in different areas?)
  - mosselman 8y ago
    > (But seriously, is there really such stories that exist as poor/rich or are these just the same stores in different areas?) I wouldn't say poor vs rich stores, but there are supermarkets which compete on pricing and others that compete on 'experience'. The first would have low prices, put out produce in the boxes it came in, employ less workers, etc (ALDI where I am from) and the latter will focus on all the food looking pretty, have nice looking displays, have people in the store making sushi, etc (AH where I am from). Where I live there is a shopping center with 1 of each of these types of stores in it. So no, it is not a matter of geography.
    - philliphaydon 8y ago
      I've honestly never noticed things like that when at supermarkets, while living in Australia or Singapore. I'm gonna watch out now see if I notice any of these sort of things. Thanks.
      - majewsky 8y ago
        In Germany, there is still a divide between regular "supermarkets" and "discounters". The latter focus on price at the expense of selection and customer service. Aldi defined the discount grocery segment in the 60s with their focus on vertical integration and cost savings. In the 90s, all Aldi stores notably used the same sort of ugly tiles for their floors and walls, probably because they got a bulk price on them and they're easy to clean etc. When Aldi stocks new items, the process consists of placing a pallet onto the shop floor and removing the foil around it. For smaller items, they just open up the box and put the entire box in the shelf instead of shelfing items one-by-one. At the checkout, there is no bagger; you're supposed to pack your bags while the cashier is scanning the items. Aldi also waited much longer than anyone else before introducing barcode scanners at their checkouts. Since they stocked only one of every type of item (e.g. only one type of sugar, one type of flour, etc.), there were so few items that cashiers could just memorize the codes for each product. It was quite impressive to see a cashier punching codes into the register at a rapid pace while the flood of items scrolls past them. I may misremember it, but it may have been faster than scanning barcodes. When Aldi introduced barcodes in the early 2000s, they modified the packaging of items so that barcodes were not only placed at one corner, but instead stretched across the whole side, so that the items could be scanned more reliably. The divide between supermarkets and discounters is blurring, though. The Aldi store next door just got a redesign and now looks confusingly welcoming. Kind of un-German. I always think of Aldi as a place where shopping is done efficiently first and foremost, and the new design does not really reflect that. It makes it look like a regular supermarket (although still at the size of a discounter).
spiderfarmer 8y ago
> offputting tone Says the guy that uses FUCK in his comment. Hi pot, meet kettle. > Not every packing house is the same (not every one separates out the uglies), and not every one supplies salsa makers. That's not how the system functions. Most produce is auctioned off with strict quality ratings. No contracts needed. > In what way does labour/weather-problem-related waste mean we shouldn't also try to reduce waste in areas where we very easily can? The ugly fruit movement claims that: > About 20-40% of Produce is Wasted Worldwide, this is mostly due to strict cosmetic standards from large grocers that dictate exactly how their fruit and veggies should look This is the point she's refuting and you're right: she may be right here. > This sentence from the same person who just used the phrase "classist as fuck"!? There are poor people. There are businesses focussing on this demographic. Simply stating those facts doesn't make you classist.

ryanlol 8y ago

>This sentence from the same person who just used the phrase "classist as fuck"!? There's nothing classist about acknowledging the fact that poor and rich people often shop in different stores.

krustyburger 8y ago
The notion that frugality implies poverty is classist, not to mention inaccurate.
- TeMPOraL 8y ago
  Do you deny that there are both rich people and poor people? Do you deny that there are high-end, expensive grocery stores, and low-end, cheap grocery stores? Do you believe poor people shop at those high-end stores? If you answered 3x NO, then nitpicking this point as being "classist" is, to paraphrase, dumb as fuck.
  - jarcane 8y ago
    Not to mention the effect of neighborhood re: nearby shopping options. I've lived in very poor and fairly rich neighborhoods, and the difference in quality of local grocery stores is dramatic. There are chains I didn't realize even existed, because they targeted different class neighborhoods. And even within a chain, the level of effort put into a given franchise location can vary pretty dramatically as well. And that's in the states. In the UK, it's a running joke that the different supermarket chains are subdivided along class lines.
zuzun 8y ago
The claim is odd though. In my experience, the selection of fruits and vegetables differs mostly in variety, not quality. If there is a quality difference, then it might be the other way around, because supermarkets targeting well-off customers tend to have more organic produce, which is almost always grade B.
- mosselman 8y ago
  Fancy supermarkets probably want 'fancy' fruits and vegetables. 'Fancy' often meaning fancy-looking rather than fancy tasting.
- Haga 8y ago
  Quality usually differs by region? West vs East Europe Chocolat comes to mind.
philliphaydon 8y ago
Wrong. Rich people don’t shop. They aren’t even aware of how their fridge gets stocked. They got too many helpers! Those helpers shop at the same stores us regular folks shop at! (But seriously, is there really such stories that exist as poor/rich or are these just the same stores in different areas?)
- mosselman 8y ago
  > (But seriously, is there really such stories that exist as poor/rich or are these just the same stores in different areas?) I wouldn't say poor vs rich stores, but there are supermarkets which compete on pricing and others that compete on 'experience'. The first would have low prices, put out produce in the boxes it came in, employ less workers, etc (ALDI where I am from) and the latter will focus on all the food looking pretty, have nice looking displays, have people in the store making sushi, etc (AH where I am from). Where I live there is a shopping center with 1 of each of these types of stores in it. So no, it is not a matter of geography.
  - philliphaydon 8y ago
    I've honestly never noticed things like that when at supermarkets, while living in Australia or Singapore. I'm gonna watch out now see if I notice any of these sort of things. Thanks.
    - majewsky 8y ago
      In Germany, there is still a divide between regular "supermarkets" and "discounters". The latter focus on price at the expense of selection and customer service. Aldi defined the discount grocery segment in the 60s with their focus on vertical integration and cost savings. In the 90s, all Aldi stores notably used the same sort of ugly tiles for their floors and walls, probably because they got a bulk price on them and they're easy to clean etc. When Aldi stocks new items, the process consists of placing a pallet onto the shop floor and removing the foil around it. For smaller items, they just open up the box and put the entire box in the shelf instead of shelfing items one-by-one. At the checkout, there is no bagger; you're supposed to pack your bags while the cashier is scanning the items. Aldi also waited much longer than anyone else before introducing barcode scanners at their checkouts. Since they stocked only one of every type of item (e.g. only one type of sugar, one type of flour, etc.), there were so few items that cashiers could just memorize the codes for each product. It was quite impressive to see a cashier punching codes into the register at a rapid pace while the flood of items scrolls past them. I may misremember it, but it may have been faster than scanning barcodes. When Aldi introduced barcodes in the early 2000s, they modified the packaging of items so that barcodes were not only placed at one corner, but instead stretched across the whole side, so that the items could be scanned more reliably. The divide between supermarkets and discounters is blurring, though. The Aldi store next door just got a redesign and now looks confusingly welcoming. Kind of un-German. I always think of Aldi as a place where shopping is done efficiently first and foremost, and the new design does not really reflect that. It makes it look like a regular supermarket (although still at the size of a discounter).

spiderfarmer 8y ago

> offputting tone Says the guy that uses FUCK in his comment. Hi pot, meet kettle. > Not every packing house is the same (not every one separates out the uglies), and not every one supplies salsa makers. That's not how the system functions. Most produce is auctioned off with strict quality ratings. No contracts needed. > In what way does labour/weather-problem-related waste mean we shouldn't also try to reduce waste in areas where we very easily can? The ugly fruit movement claims that: > About 20-40% of Produce is Wasted Worldwide, this is mostly due to strict cosmetic standards from large grocers that dictate exactly how their fruit and veggies should look This is the point she's refuting and you're right: she may be right here. > This sentence from the same person who just used the phrase "classist as fuck"!? There are poor people. There are businesses focussing on this demographic. Simply stating those facts doesn't make you classist.