4 ms·

"You sit down, review a prefilled filing from the government. If it’s accurate, you sign it. If it’s not, you fix it or ignore it altogether and prepare your re

"You sit down, review a prefilled filing from the government. If it’s accurate, you sign it. If it’s not, you fix it or ignore it altogether and prepare your return yourself. It’s your choice. You might not have to pay for an accountant, or fiddle for hours with complex software. It could all be over in minutes." This is exactly how it works in Chile...since 2005!

labster 8y ago
That's the difference between a democracy and an oligarchy. In Chile, the government tells the people and companies how much to pay in taxes. In the United States, the corporations tell the government how much they will pay in taxes.
- bovermyer 8y ago
  Not to be pedantic, but... both the US and Chile are representative democratic republics, not democracies. Neither is an oligarchy, either. And while corporations and individuals of means have a disproportionate amount of influence in American politics, Chile is not immune from the same phenomenon; it just takes a different form. But I agree with you in spirit - wealth should not be a factor in how much influence someone has in a democratic system.
  - thefringthing 8y ago
    This is not what anyone has meant by the term "democracy" for a thousand years.
    - asark 8y ago
      To back you up, I can confirm that people who spend their time thinking a lot about this stuff (political scientists and those in related fields) spend zero time quibbling over the use of the term "democracy" as it's commonly used, and are likely to eye-roll and attempt to disengage from conversation should someone push their glasses up their nose and "well, actually..." the issue. In most contexts they use democracy as an umbrella term, the same way everyone else does. Doing otherwise marks one as an outsider to the field, or a novice—any in teaching positions get to correct plenty of "clever" freshmen on the issue every year.
      - bovermyer 8y ago
        I am an outsider to the field. I'll just disengage entirely from political discussion and leave it to the experts.
- rayiner 8y ago
  They don’t have rich people or corporations in Chile?
perl4ever 8y ago
Something that is not clear to me - suppose that the government in one of these countries that makes it easy to file your taxes doesn't do it correctly and you sign it and file it. Who is liable? If the taxpayer can relieve their obligation by filing a government provided return, with the option to correct it, that sounds great. But if the onus is on the taxpayer to correct mistakes by the government, then all that is really happening is free government provided tax prep which may have a value of zero or less.
- andyroid 8y ago
  The actor most likely to make mistakes is the one reporting the numbers in the first place, i.e. the employer. And yes they would be held accountable for that just as the government, could you show that the numbers your employer reported is not what shows up on your tax report. This is how it’s like in many European countries and it pretty much just works.
  - deleted 8y ago
    [deleted]
- simonh 8y ago
  In the UK you don’t have to sign anything unless you are going your own taxes. If you are charged too much you can claim a refund, not sure if there is a time limit but if so I think it’s pretty long. The revenue service is audited and there are independent consumer protection groups that can help people who need it. Also the online tax forms are actually really good. The government has a web team that has radically simplified and unified all sorts of government web forms and made a huge difference. Wrong thread, but so far as I’m aware, we don’t pay 75% tax in the UK.
  - perl4ever 8y ago
    That sounds reasonable. So if you are charged too little, the worst that can happen is they send you another bill?

labster 8y ago

That's the difference between a democracy and an oligarchy. In Chile, the government tells the people and companies how much to pay in taxes. In the United States, the corporations tell the government how much they will pay in taxes.

bovermyer 8y ago
Not to be pedantic, but... both the US and Chile are representative democratic republics, not democracies. Neither is an oligarchy, either. And while corporations and individuals of means have a disproportionate amount of influence in American politics, Chile is not immune from the same phenomenon; it just takes a different form. But I agree with you in spirit - wealth should not be a factor in how much influence someone has in a democratic system.
- thefringthing 8y ago
  This is not what anyone has meant by the term "democracy" for a thousand years.
  - asark 8y ago
    To back you up, I can confirm that people who spend their time thinking a lot about this stuff (political scientists and those in related fields) spend zero time quibbling over the use of the term "democracy" as it's commonly used, and are likely to eye-roll and attempt to disengage from conversation should someone push their glasses up their nose and "well, actually..." the issue. In most contexts they use democracy as an umbrella term, the same way everyone else does. Doing otherwise marks one as an outsider to the field, or a novice—any in teaching positions get to correct plenty of "clever" freshmen on the issue every year.
    - bovermyer 8y ago
      I am an outsider to the field. I'll just disengage entirely from political discussion and leave it to the experts.
rayiner 8y ago
They don’t have rich people or corporations in Chile?

perl4ever 8y ago

Something that is not clear to me - suppose that the government in one of these countries that makes it easy to file your taxes doesn't do it correctly and you sign it and file it. Who is liable? If the taxpayer can relieve their obligation by filing a government provided return, with the option to correct it, that sounds great. But if the onus is on the taxpayer to correct mistakes by the government, then all that is really happening is free government provided tax prep which may have a value of zero or less.

andyroid 8y ago
The actor most likely to make mistakes is the one reporting the numbers in the first place, i.e. the employer. And yes they would be held accountable for that just as the government, could you show that the numbers your employer reported is not what shows up on your tax report. This is how it’s like in many European countries and it pretty much just works.
- deleted 8y ago
  [deleted]
simonh 8y ago
In the UK you don’t have to sign anything unless you are going your own taxes. If you are charged too much you can claim a refund, not sure if there is a time limit but if so I think it’s pretty long. The revenue service is audited and there are independent consumer protection groups that can help people who need it. Also the online tax forms are actually really good. The government has a web team that has radically simplified and unified all sorts of government web forms and made a huge difference. Wrong thread, but so far as I’m aware, we don’t pay 75% tax in the UK.
- perl4ever 8y ago
  That sounds reasonable. So if you are charged too little, the worst that can happen is they send you another bill?