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I can't comment on the quality of the library, but I did get a quick chuckle from the term "close to the metal" being used to describe a Javascript browser libr

I can't comment on the quality of the library, but I did get a quick chuckle from the term "close to the metal" being used to describe a Javascript browser library.

codeflo 8y ago
I think very soon, "low-level programming" will mean writing JavaScript directly without a transpiler.
- jayflux 8y ago
  Soon? I’ve already seen that described as low level JS
  - EGreg 8y ago
    Obligatory XKCD (albeit about editors) https://www.xkcd.com/378 https://www.xkcd.com/378
- bdcravens 8y ago
  It has been referred to as the "Assembly Language of the Web" https://www.hanselman.com/blog/JavaScriptIsAssemblyLanguageForTheWebSematicMarkupIsDeadCleanVsMachinecodedHTML.aspx https://www.hanselman.com/blog/JavaScriptIsAssemblyLanguageF...
- JustSomeNobody 8y ago
  Why Not? They appropriated “real time” already.
pkstn 8y ago
It’s a bit of a joke, really ;) As well as ”turboboosted”. Don’t take them too seriously :D
- anonytrary 8y ago
  No, it isn't. It's completely intentional marketing. That diction was specifically used to get people to think the library is better than other libraries.
  - pkstn 8y ago
    Believe me, I wrote the library ;)
    - anonytrary 8y ago
      I'm aware of that, but the two aren't mutually exclusive. When your "jokes" make your library sound better than it is, it becomes marketing. Don't brush off your attempts to sell your library as a "joke".
      - pkstn 8y ago
        Fair enough, of course it’s marketing as well. But it’s so common to say ”blazing fast”. Even FB developers argued React being fast even though it used to be really slow.
        Vinnl 8y ago
        It was fast compared to the primary framework in vogue back then (Angular.js v1).
        pkstn 8y ago
        It actually wasn’t, they didn’t use key with ng-repeat in benchmarks. Even Angular 1 was actually faster back then when used correctly: https://500tech.com/blog/all/is-reactjs-fast https://500tech.com/blog/all/is-reactjs-fast
        Vinnl 8y ago
        That post only invalidates* a specific measurement, but doesn't provide counter-measurements, especially not ones that say Angular.js was faster than React. Although I don't have alternative numbers, and will agree that VDOM comes with a performance penalty, Angular.js's method of change detection was pretty inefficient and required a lot of hand-holding. Still, I think either were sufficient for most use cases, and performance definitely isn't the main selling point for React (nor Angular.js). *Well, somewhat - it was still easier to shoot yourself in the foot, performance-wise, in Angular.js, but that's not really the point here, and React has its own issues there (e.g. `key`).
fold_left 8y ago
> I did get a quick chuckle from the term "close to the metal" being used to describe a Javascript browser library. This and "blazing fast" make me cringe every time.
entelechy 8y ago
For better or worse, we are not far from "bare metal javascript" There is wasmjit [1] a kernel module that enables execution of webassembly via the linux kernel. Furthermore there is AssemblyScript [2] that allows to transpile typed javascript to WebAssembly [1] https://github.com/rianhunter/wasmjit https://github.com/rianhunter/wasmjit [2] https://github.com/AssemblyScript/assemblyscript https://github.com/AssemblyScript/assemblyscript
- tengbretson 8y ago
  Good grief we've reached the point of a JS interpreter running in ring 0? Gary Bernhardt was a prophet. https://www.destroyallsoftware.com/talks/the-birth-and-death-of-javascript https://www.destroyallsoftware.com/talks/the-birth-and-death...
  - warent 8y ago
    Well, strictly speaking, WASM and JS are two different things, but basically yeah.
megaremote 8y ago
All you need is a full operating system and a >100mb full compliant browser. Doesn't get much closer than that./s
bigiain 8y ago
Yeah - I think the term "close to the metal Javascript" belongs to things like this: https://esp32.com/viewtopic.php?t=497 https://esp32.com/viewtopic.php?t=497

I can't comment on the quality of the library, but I did get a quick chuckle from the term "close to the metal" being used to describe a Javascript browser library.

codeflo 8y ago

I think very soon, "low-level programming" will mean writing JavaScript directly without a transpiler.

jayflux 8y ago
Soon? I’ve already seen that described as low level JS
- EGreg 8y ago
  Obligatory XKCD (albeit about editors) https://www.xkcd.com/378 https://www.xkcd.com/378
bdcravens 8y ago
It has been referred to as the "Assembly Language of the Web" https://www.hanselman.com/blog/JavaScriptIsAssemblyLanguageForTheWebSematicMarkupIsDeadCleanVsMachinecodedHTML.aspx https://www.hanselman.com/blog/JavaScriptIsAssemblyLanguageF...
JustSomeNobody 8y ago
Why Not? They appropriated “real time” already.

pkstn 8y ago

It’s a bit of a joke, really ;) As well as ”turboboosted”. Don’t take them too seriously :D

anonytrary 8y ago
No, it isn't. It's completely intentional marketing. That diction was specifically used to get people to think the library is better than other libraries.
- pkstn 8y ago
  Believe me, I wrote the library ;)
  - anonytrary 8y ago
    I'm aware of that, but the two aren't mutually exclusive. When your "jokes" make your library sound better than it is, it becomes marketing. Don't brush off your attempts to sell your library as a "joke".
    - pkstn 8y ago
      Fair enough, of course it’s marketing as well. But it’s so common to say ”blazing fast”. Even FB developers argued React being fast even though it used to be really slow.
      - Vinnl 8y ago
        It was fast compared to the primary framework in vogue back then (Angular.js v1).
        pkstn 8y ago
        It actually wasn’t, they didn’t use key with ng-repeat in benchmarks. Even Angular 1 was actually faster back then when used correctly: https://500tech.com/blog/all/is-reactjs-fast https://500tech.com/blog/all/is-reactjs-fast
        Vinnl 8y ago
        That post only invalidates* a specific measurement, but doesn't provide counter-measurements, especially not ones that say Angular.js was faster than React. Although I don't have alternative numbers, and will agree that VDOM comes with a performance penalty, Angular.js's method of change detection was pretty inefficient and required a lot of hand-holding. Still, I think either were sufficient for most use cases, and performance definitely isn't the main selling point for React (nor Angular.js). *Well, somewhat - it was still easier to shoot yourself in the foot, performance-wise, in Angular.js, but that's not really the point here, and React has its own issues there (e.g. `key`).

fold_left 8y ago

> I did get a quick chuckle from the term "close to the metal" being used to describe a Javascript browser library. This and "blazing fast" make me cringe every time.

entelechy 8y ago

For better or worse, we are not far from "bare metal javascript" There is wasmjit [1] a kernel module that enables execution of webassembly via the linux kernel. Furthermore there is AssemblyScript [2] that allows to transpile typed javascript to WebAssembly [1] https://github.com/rianhunter/wasmjit https://github.com/rianhunter/wasmjit [2] https://github.com/AssemblyScript/assemblyscript https://github.com/AssemblyScript/assemblyscript

tengbretson 8y ago
Good grief we've reached the point of a JS interpreter running in ring 0? Gary Bernhardt was a prophet. https://www.destroyallsoftware.com/talks/the-birth-and-death-of-javascript https://www.destroyallsoftware.com/talks/the-birth-and-death...
- warent 8y ago
  Well, strictly speaking, WASM and JS are two different things, but basically yeah.

megaremote 8y ago

All you need is a full operating system and a >100mb full compliant browser. Doesn't get much closer than that./s

bigiain 8y ago

Yeah - I think the term "close to the metal Javascript" belongs to things like this: https://esp32.com/viewtopic.php?t=497 https://esp32.com/viewtopic.php?t=497