7 ms·

How to Live Well Without a Job and with (almost) no Money

35 points by smanek 18y ago

eru 18y ago
I'd still have to work with that advise.
edw519 18y ago
"raising and slaughtering rabbits" "catching and cooking fish and turtles" "distilling your own moonshine" Those late night coding sessions with macaroni & cheese and Milwaukee's Best are looking better and better.
- smanek 18y ago
  Milwaukee's Best? Really? Buy some real beer - it isn't that much more expensive ;-)
  - edw519 18y ago
    Just a joke. Would you rather drink Milwaukee's Best or home distilled moonshine? <fumbles for Braille keyboard after a bad batch>
    - smanek 18y ago
      Home Distilled Moonshine for the win!
      - kajecounterhack 18y ago
        ...or trade the rabbits you killed for miller instead ;)
        pg 18y ago
        It would be a losing trade: http://www.janusmuseum.org/panabasis/nov05.htm http://www.janusmuseum.org/panabasis/nov05.htm
  - johnrob 18y ago
    I find that lite/macro beer is easier to code with. This is probably because it has less alcohol in it. All it takes is one 6% craft-ale and my coding is done for the night.
    - anonym 18y ago
      They call 'em session beers for a reason. (He says, surrounded by empty cans of Old Style ($5.99 the 12-pack) and the husks of half-written late-night defuns.)
  - mattmaroon 18y ago
    IDK. Sam Adams is $7 for a 6 pack. I once bought 30 of the Beast for less than that. Was a long time ago though.
- mattmaroon 18y ago
  In fairness, I don't think they had lean cuisine and Ramen noodles when this was written.
- omouse 18y ago
  Physical work vs. mind work. Hmm, yeah, tough choice.
jobeyonekenobi 18y ago
Can you guess what 'Long Pork' is?
- letmecomment 18y ago
  Google says it is 'human flesh'
ejs 18y ago
This was written in 1978, although I find it a bit bizarre it would be interesting to see where this girl is now since she would be about 30 years older. [edited to fix math mistake]
- smanek 18y ago
  Apparently, you aren't the first to wonder: http://www.grannymillerblog.blogspot.com/2007/05/where-are-you-dolly-freed.html http://www.grannymillerblog.blogspot.com/2007/05/where-are-y... But I think your arithmetic is a bit off. It says she was 19 in 1978, so that would make her closer to 50 (49).
justindz 18y ago
This has always been a topic of interest to me. The "System" (as much as/if there is one) is designed to facilitate a certain objective. In our case, economic growth and individual wealth. For brevity's sake, I'll skip the digression about clustering, distributing and distributing unevenly. So, if that systemic objective does not make your life meaningful, what do you do? The way of the world is towards this objective because it's the best progress we've made so far towards meeting most people's basic human needs. Escaping to a different country with human rights and a different objective is not very feasible. Changing the system isn't a good option because for most people the system is fine. There are also tons of people for whom it's not fine, but they don't notice and it's not necessarily our business to try to wake them up unless they ask. So I think the best option is, like the author is suggesting, to opt out as best you can. Find what makes you happy and base your life around that, while minimizing your conflict with the governing body (e.g. they pay property taxes, rather than bury a bus full of guns and plan to resist--that would be un-lazy and make them miserable). Had I not gotten married (which I don't regret, btw), I would have continued to work to fuel my desire to buy up a big plot of land that I don't have to mow and building a minimal but fully livable tree house. Since I still find that interesting, I'll keep designing and hacking and do it when the kids are off to college and my wife's making enough money to pay for her shoe fetish. Works for me.
- briansmith 18y ago
  "Changing the system isn't a good option because for most people the system is fine. There are also tons of people for whom it's not fine, but they don't notice and it's not necessarily our business to try to wake them up unless they ask." I bet if you went and made friends with a few of those people, you wouldn't feel that way.
mynameishere 18y ago
The thought of living off rabbits, when beans cost 50 cents a pound and are easy to grow is just irrational. I'll stick to my serious survivalist tracts, thanks.
- mwmanning 18y ago
  Don't knock it 'till you've tried it. Rabbits are decent eating.
  - steveplace 18y ago
    The eyeballs are chock full of electrolytes and other micronutrients.
  - mattmaroon 18y ago
    They are pretty tasty, but they're so abundant in the wild that I don't see why you'd bother farming them. My dogs catch them all the time.
  - alexfarran 18y ago
    Just don't eat nothing but rabbit http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rabbit_starvation http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rabbit_starvation
redorb 18y ago
I've always thought about dropping out of the system; I think it parallels with the "I could rob this bank"thought that every man has. My favorite articles are below http://www.innerexplorations.com/catsimple/2.htm http://www.innerexplorations.com/catsimple/2.htm (simple living) http://www.ranprieur.com/essays/dropout.html http://www.ranprieur.com/essays/dropout.html (dropping out) http://www.zenzibar.com/articles/worksucks.asp http://www.zenzibar.com/articles/worksucks.asp (work sucks) as far as where I'm at, I'm currently living in a studio barn apartment that was built out for me for around $5k my rent is $50/mo plus electricity for the whole barn ($100) I plan to live there for at least 5 years it is about 600 sqFt. I drive an old truck to my job that is paid for, and I try to save as much as I can; when I see things going south I will build a dome on the farm (150k) w/ 1 acre of land included and then move out there with expenses of <$500 month and live for 10-20 years
- hugh 18y ago
  What will you do after 10-20 years in a dome?
  - mattmaroon 18y ago
    Be single, that's for sure.
    - jk4930 18y ago
      But he coded on his windpowered PC two new UNIX and six Lisp flavors. And he had the time to read all the books recommended here. Do you think that's nothing?!
    - redorb 18y ago
      (of course I haven't given up on the opposite sex) I'm waiting on a soul mate (aren't we all) she of course would have to have the same values I try for -money + integrity + honesty + transparency. Finding that is probably like hitting the lottery but better
      - 18y ago
babul 18y ago
With the recent dramatic rise in food prices it doesn't sound so bad. Here in UK rice is up 100%, cooking oil up 80%, flour up #40%, gas/electricity up ~70% etc. We are lucky though, at least there are no food riots like in south/south-east asia at the moment.
icey 18y ago
Any how-to with the word "Rassle" in one of the chapter titles is an immediate win in my book.
hugh 18y ago
My favourite bit is the bit about the "coming age of shortages". This was written in 1978. I think I'll stick to doing stuff I enjoy and earning money for it, and then spending that money on stuff I want.
- mattmaroon 18y ago
  I think that all throughout history, man has expected the future to be far worse than the present. And all throughout history, the future has turned out to be better.
  - danohuiginn 18y ago
    "all throughout history, the future has turned out to be better" splutter Just...no. 1913? 1928? 14th-century Europe before the Black Death turned up? Rome at its height? Yes, things are pretty damn good right now (in Europe and North America, at least). But history isn't a stately progress of life getting better - there have been plenty of times when things have fallen apart. As for expectations: there are always some waiting for the end-times with barely-concealed glee. But equally there are usually some expecting continuity, or gradual progress, or imagining cycles of historical recurrance.
    - mattmaroon 18y ago
      They've almost never been the cataclysms people have expected. Global cooling, thermonuclear war, never materialized. The ones that get us are never seen coming.
      - danohuiginn 18y ago
        There we agree totally.
        justindz 18y ago
        Java? Just kidding.
okeumeni 18y ago
One thing is always funny to me about people living out of the ‘system’: They all forget that they still depend on the ‘system’. Remember the dad working for short terms? She is working for neighbors for little pay? They even buy fuel! lol how about electricity? They read books and enjoy them. Without the ‘system’ they will mot live the little revolution of living out of the ‘system’.
- michaelneale 18y ago
  I guess there comes a point where if there is no society - would you really want to live? What is the point if you are the only person left in your "dome" ? I know some people that would be fine with that. I try to put as much distance between them and myself. I am a social creature, and always will be.
aswanson 18y ago
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Christopher_McCandless http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Christopher_McCandless
- not_will 18y ago
  Romanticized suicide (essentially) is one way out of the chains of 'modern' life.
iamdave 18y ago
Living with no job? I do it everyday.

35 points by smanek 18y ago

eru 18y ago

I'd still have to work with that advise.

"raising and slaughtering rabbits" "catching and cooking fish and turtles" "distilling your own moonshine" Those late night coding sessions with macaroni & cheese and Milwaukee's Best are looking better and better.

smanek 18y ago
Milwaukee's Best? Really? Buy some real beer - it isn't that much more expensive ;-)
- edw519 18y ago
  Just a joke. Would you rather drink Milwaukee's Best or home distilled moonshine? <fumbles for Braille keyboard after a bad batch>
  - smanek 18y ago
    Home Distilled Moonshine for the win!
    - kajecounterhack 18y ago
      ...or trade the rabbits you killed for miller instead ;)
      - pg 18y ago
        It would be a losing trade: http://www.janusmuseum.org/panabasis/nov05.htm http://www.janusmuseum.org/panabasis/nov05.htm
- johnrob 18y ago
  I find that lite/macro beer is easier to code with. This is probably because it has less alcohol in it. All it takes is one 6% craft-ale and my coding is done for the night.
  - anonym 18y ago
    They call 'em session beers for a reason. (He says, surrounded by empty cans of Old Style ($5.99 the 12-pack) and the husks of half-written late-night defuns.)
- mattmaroon 18y ago
  IDK. Sam Adams is $7 for a 6 pack. I once bought 30 of the Beast for less than that. Was a long time ago though.
mattmaroon 18y ago
In fairness, I don't think they had lean cuisine and Ramen noodles when this was written.
omouse 18y ago
Physical work vs. mind work. Hmm, yeah, tough choice.

jobeyonekenobi 18y ago

Can you guess what 'Long Pork' is?

letmecomment 18y ago
Google says it is 'human flesh'

ejs 18y ago

This was written in 1978, although I find it a bit bizarre it would be interesting to see where this girl is now since she would be about 30 years older. [edited to fix math mistake]

smanek 18y ago
Apparently, you aren't the first to wonder: http://www.grannymillerblog.blogspot.com/2007/05/where-are-you-dolly-freed.html http://www.grannymillerblog.blogspot.com/2007/05/where-are-y... But I think your arithmetic is a bit off. It says she was 19 in 1978, so that would make her closer to 50 (49).

justindz 18y ago

This has always been a topic of interest to me. The "System" (as much as/if there is one) is designed to facilitate a certain objective. In our case, economic growth and individual wealth. For brevity's sake, I'll skip the digression about clustering, distributing and distributing unevenly. So, if that systemic objective does not make your life meaningful, what do you do? The way of the world is towards this objective because it's the best progress we've made so far towards meeting most people's basic human needs. Escaping to a different country with human rights and a different objective is not very feasible. Changing the system isn't a good option because for most people the system is fine. There are also tons of people for whom it's not fine, but they don't notice and it's not necessarily our business to try to wake them up unless they ask. So I think the best option is, like the author is suggesting, to opt out as best you can. Find what makes you happy and base your life around that, while minimizing your conflict with the governing body (e.g. they pay property taxes, rather than bury a bus full of guns and plan to resist--that would be un-lazy and make them miserable). Had I not gotten married (which I don't regret, btw), I would have continued to work to fuel my desire to buy up a big plot of land that I don't have to mow and building a minimal but fully livable tree house. Since I still find that interesting, I'll keep designing and hacking and do it when the kids are off to college and my wife's making enough money to pay for her shoe fetish. Works for me.

briansmith 18y ago
"Changing the system isn't a good option because for most people the system is fine. There are also tons of people for whom it's not fine, but they don't notice and it's not necessarily our business to try to wake them up unless they ask." I bet if you went and made friends with a few of those people, you wouldn't feel that way.

mynameishere 18y ago

The thought of living off rabbits, when beans cost 50 cents a pound and are easy to grow is just irrational. I'll stick to my serious survivalist tracts, thanks.

mwmanning 18y ago
Don't knock it 'till you've tried it. Rabbits are decent eating.
- steveplace 18y ago
  The eyeballs are chock full of electrolytes and other micronutrients.
- mattmaroon 18y ago
  They are pretty tasty, but they're so abundant in the wild that I don't see why you'd bother farming them. My dogs catch them all the time.
- alexfarran 18y ago
  Just don't eat nothing but rabbit http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rabbit_starvation http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rabbit_starvation

redorb 18y ago

I've always thought about dropping out of the system; I think it parallels with the "I could rob this bank"thought that every man has. My favorite articles are below http://www.innerexplorations.com/catsimple/2.htm http://www.innerexplorations.com/catsimple/2.htm (simple living) http://www.ranprieur.com/essays/dropout.html http://www.ranprieur.com/essays/dropout.html (dropping out) http://www.zenzibar.com/articles/worksucks.asp http://www.zenzibar.com/articles/worksucks.asp (work sucks) as far as where I'm at, I'm currently living in a studio barn apartment that was built out for me for around $5k my rent is $50/mo plus electricity for the whole barn ($100) I plan to live there for at least 5 years it is about 600 sqFt. I drive an old truck to my job that is paid for, and I try to save as much as I can; when I see things going south I will build a dome on the farm (150k) w/ 1 acre of land included and then move out there with expenses of <$500 month and live for 10-20 years

hugh 18y ago
What will you do after 10-20 years in a dome?
- mattmaroon 18y ago
  Be single, that's for sure.
  - jk4930 18y ago
    But he coded on his windpowered PC two new UNIX and six Lisp flavors. And he had the time to read all the books recommended here. Do you think that's nothing?!
  - redorb 18y ago
    (of course I haven't given up on the opposite sex) I'm waiting on a soul mate (aren't we all) she of course would have to have the same values I try for -money + integrity + honesty + transparency. Finding that is probably like hitting the lottery but better
    - 18y ago

babul 18y ago

With the recent dramatic rise in food prices it doesn't sound so bad. Here in UK rice is up 100%, cooking oil up 80%, flour up #40%, gas/electricity up ~70% etc. We are lucky though, at least there are no food riots like in south/south-east asia at the moment.

icey 18y ago

Any how-to with the word "Rassle" in one of the chapter titles is an immediate win in my book.

hugh 18y ago

My favourite bit is the bit about the "coming age of shortages". This was written in 1978. I think I'll stick to doing stuff I enjoy and earning money for it, and then spending that money on stuff I want.

mattmaroon 18y ago
I think that all throughout history, man has expected the future to be far worse than the present. And all throughout history, the future has turned out to be better.
- danohuiginn 18y ago
  "all throughout history, the future has turned out to be better" splutter Just...no. 1913? 1928? 14th-century Europe before the Black Death turned up? Rome at its height? Yes, things are pretty damn good right now (in Europe and North America, at least). But history isn't a stately progress of life getting better - there have been plenty of times when things have fallen apart. As for expectations: there are always some waiting for the end-times with barely-concealed glee. But equally there are usually some expecting continuity, or gradual progress, or imagining cycles of historical recurrance.
  - mattmaroon 18y ago
    They've almost never been the cataclysms people have expected. Global cooling, thermonuclear war, never materialized. The ones that get us are never seen coming.
    - danohuiginn 18y ago
      There we agree totally.
      - justindz 18y ago
        Java? Just kidding.

okeumeni 18y ago

One thing is always funny to me about people living out of the ‘system’: They all forget that they still depend on the ‘system’. Remember the dad working for short terms? She is working for neighbors for little pay? They even buy fuel! lol how about electricity? They read books and enjoy them. Without the ‘system’ they will mot live the little revolution of living out of the ‘system’.

michaelneale 18y ago
I guess there comes a point where if there is no society - would you really want to live? What is the point if you are the only person left in your "dome" ? I know some people that would be fine with that. I try to put as much distance between them and myself. I am a social creature, and always will be.

aswanson 18y ago

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Christopher_McCandless http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Christopher_McCandless

not_will 18y ago
Romanticized suicide (essentially) is one way out of the chains of 'modern' life.

iamdave 18y ago

Living with no job? I do it everyday.