3 ms·

Reading the changelog, one entry catch my eye: "Switched core decoding library from Libav to FFmpeg" Do anyone know who won the fight of this fork?

by bratao 8y ago

th0ma5 8y ago
I don't know anyone "won" but I believe ffmpeg has remerged.
m45t3r 8y ago
Considering that mpv[1] recommends FFmpeg I would say FFmpeg won. I say that because mpv is one of the projects that mostly use parts of FFmpeg internals and also one of the first projects to use modern futures (and deprecate older versions too). [1]: https://github.com/mpv-player/mpv#ffmpeg-vs-libav https://github.com/mpv-player/mpv#ffmpeg-vs-libav
- m-p-3 8y ago
  YouTube-DL also uses FFmpeg to remux or convert data streams when needed too.
- m45t3r 8y ago
  modern futures -> modern features
hannob 8y ago
It's been a while that ffmpeg has effectively "won". A couple of linux distros that used to default to libav have switched back years ago. I'm surprised it took handbrake so long.
rndgermandude 8y ago
There is of course no official winner, but as of right now libav essentially withered and mostly died. Maybe the project will become more lively again in the future, but probably not. Of those downstreams who ever switched to libav, most have switched back to ffmpeg, incl Debian and now Handbrake. The development of libav slowed to essentially a halt with next to no activity in their git, and their latest release was 11 months ago, while ffmpeg had two major releases (4.0, 4.1) and numerous point releases in that period. libav, in my humble opinion, also suffered from NIH where they sometimes - with what looked to me like religious zealotry - insisted on doing stuff own their own, while ffmpeg at the same time happily merged tons of changes from libav. This gave ffmpeg, in addition to their brand recognition and associated network effects, yet another advantage. It also didn't help that libav created a lot of bad publicity for themselves, starting with them trying to take over ffmpeg in a hostile manner initially instead of forking, or when their debian packages (maintained by a libav member IIRC) started telling users that ffmpeg is "deprecated". Or when one of their folks sent ffmpeg a "cease and desist" letter claiming copyright of the logo they had been using for quite a while, insisting ffmpeg stop using it. (That's why libav still uses the 2d zigzag logo, while ffmpeg switched to a 3d zigzag one).
- icelancer 8y ago
  > religious zealotry This describes the entirety of the libav initiative from birth to death. Good riddance.
  - hitekker 8y ago
    Agreed. The maintainers were awful at leadership, and generally seemed like a bunch of venomous folks.
j1elo 8y ago
Ubuntu 14.04 (Trusty) was shipping libav, but since 16.04 (Xenial) it went back to ship ffmpeg instead. So for Ubuntu LTS users at least, FFmpeg had "won" since at least 2016

Reading the changelog, one entry catch my eye: "Switched core decoding library from Libav to FFmpeg" Do anyone know who won the fight of this fork?

by bratao 8y ago

Reading the changelog, one entry catch my eye: "Switched core decoding library from Libav to FFmpeg" Do anyone know who won the fight of this fork?

th0ma5 8y ago

I don't know anyone "won" but I believe ffmpeg has remerged.

m45t3r 8y ago

Considering that mpv[1] recommends FFmpeg I would say FFmpeg won. I say that because mpv is one of the projects that mostly use parts of FFmpeg internals and also one of the first projects to use modern futures (and deprecate older versions too). [1]: https://github.com/mpv-player/mpv#ffmpeg-vs-libav https://github.com/mpv-player/mpv#ffmpeg-vs-libav

m-p-3 8y ago
YouTube-DL also uses FFmpeg to remux or convert data streams when needed too.
m45t3r 8y ago
modern futures -> modern features

hannob 8y ago

It's been a while that ffmpeg has effectively "won". A couple of linux distros that used to default to libav have switched back years ago. I'm surprised it took handbrake so long.

rndgermandude 8y ago

There is of course no official winner, but as of right now libav essentially withered and mostly died. Maybe the project will become more lively again in the future, but probably not. Of those downstreams who ever switched to libav, most have switched back to ffmpeg, incl Debian and now Handbrake. The development of libav slowed to essentially a halt with next to no activity in their git, and their latest release was 11 months ago, while ffmpeg had two major releases (4.0, 4.1) and numerous point releases in that period. libav, in my humble opinion, also suffered from NIH where they sometimes - with what looked to me like religious zealotry - insisted on doing stuff own their own, while ffmpeg at the same time happily merged tons of changes from libav. This gave ffmpeg, in addition to their brand recognition and associated network effects, yet another advantage. It also didn't help that libav created a lot of bad publicity for themselves, starting with them trying to take over ffmpeg in a hostile manner initially instead of forking, or when their debian packages (maintained by a libav member IIRC) started telling users that ffmpeg is "deprecated". Or when one of their folks sent ffmpeg a "cease and desist" letter claiming copyright of the logo they had been using for quite a while, insisting ffmpeg stop using it. (That's why libav still uses the 2d zigzag logo, while ffmpeg switched to a 3d zigzag one).

icelancer 8y ago
> religious zealotry This describes the entirety of the libav initiative from birth to death. Good riddance.
- hitekker 8y ago
  Agreed. The maintainers were awful at leadership, and generally seemed like a bunch of venomous folks.

j1elo 8y ago

Ubuntu 14.04 (Trusty) was shipping libav, but since 16.04 (Xenial) it went back to ship ffmpeg instead. So for Ubuntu LTS users at least, FFmpeg had "won" since at least 2016