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(Disclaimer: I acknowledge that I was raised in a pretty liberal state) I was surprised to hear that the singular “they” was controversial. I had been using “th

(Disclaimer: I acknowledge that I was raised in a pretty liberal state) I was surprised to hear that the singular “they” was controversial. I had been using “they” to refer to hypothetical individuals of unknown gender pretty much my whole life. Extending this to specific people of unknown gender doesn’t seem like a far leap. It seems more like manufactured outrage, committed in varying degrees by both sides of the issue. Not everything in life needs to be a crisis of conscience.

crankylinuxuser 8y ago
"He is going to the store." "She is going to the store." "They is going to the store." That last one sounds like I don't know how to speak properly. "They" has been plural, and sounds appropriate in 'many, gender neutral' context. "It" is the singular gender neutral... But that pronoun sounds like you're demeaning someone. Like, "It is going to the store." That sentence is correct but seems pretty damn dehumanizing. I dunno.. Language is hard.
- beaconstudios 8y ago
  "They are going to the store" should be fine. Or you can go fancy "them'st is going to the store".
  - crankylinuxuser 8y ago
    > "They are going to the store" should be fine. Indeed, but the miscommunication here is implied plural. "They are ..." Who is going (expecting 2 or more)? I don't care that we use a gender neutral pronoun. Just using an existing word makes understanding hard.
    - beaconstudios 8y ago
      in most cases the plurality/singularity of the subject will be obvious from the surrounding context.
    - anthony_romeo 8y ago
      To be fair, “you” used to be plural, with “thou” used for second person singular. But the sort of “Royal We” honorifics of the past kinda muddied it’s usage and “you” eventually became singular and plural. So there precedent for this sort of thing
    - Firadeoclus 8y ago
      "You are going to the store" - exactly the same ambiguity, resolved by context.
    - mcphage 8y ago
      > Just using an existing word makes understanding hard. We've somehow figured it out for several hundred years, I think we'll be fine.
  - dingaling 8y ago
    Why should it be fine? It introduces ambiguity into an already complicated language. If he or she isn't appropriate, invent a new pronoun instead of overloading an existing word. Just like you'd do in a programming language instead of overloading 'if' to mean different things in different contexts.
    - Volundr 8y ago
      Does it? In the event of an unknown gender, "He is going to the store." implies (possibly falsely) that the target is male. At best, it leaves that ambiguous. On the other hand "They are going to the store" leaves the number of people going to the store ambiguous, but does not imply any false information. It seems to me at worst "they" is equally non-specific. Sure a clear, singular non-gendered pronoun would be better, but in the absence of such a thing existing, "they" actually seems better than "he" in this context. Edit: I'd also point out, singular "they" has existed since at least the 14th century, so it's not like anyone is attempting to modify the language by encouraging it's usage.

crankylinuxuser 8y ago

"He is going to the store." "She is going to the store." "They is going to the store." That last one sounds like I don't know how to speak properly. "They" has been plural, and sounds appropriate in 'many, gender neutral' context. "It" is the singular gender neutral... But that pronoun sounds like you're demeaning someone. Like, "It is going to the store." That sentence is correct but seems pretty damn dehumanizing. I dunno.. Language is hard.

beaconstudios 8y ago
"They are going to the store" should be fine. Or you can go fancy "them'st is going to the store".
- crankylinuxuser 8y ago
  > "They are going to the store" should be fine. Indeed, but the miscommunication here is implied plural. "They are ..." Who is going (expecting 2 or more)? I don't care that we use a gender neutral pronoun. Just using an existing word makes understanding hard.
  - beaconstudios 8y ago
    in most cases the plurality/singularity of the subject will be obvious from the surrounding context.
  - anthony_romeo 8y ago
    To be fair, “you” used to be plural, with “thou” used for second person singular. But the sort of “Royal We” honorifics of the past kinda muddied it’s usage and “you” eventually became singular and plural. So there precedent for this sort of thing
  - Firadeoclus 8y ago
    "You are going to the store" - exactly the same ambiguity, resolved by context.
  - mcphage 8y ago
    > Just using an existing word makes understanding hard. We've somehow figured it out for several hundred years, I think we'll be fine.
- dingaling 8y ago
  Why should it be fine? It introduces ambiguity into an already complicated language. If he or she isn't appropriate, invent a new pronoun instead of overloading an existing word. Just like you'd do in a programming language instead of overloading 'if' to mean different things in different contexts.
  - Volundr 8y ago
    Does it? In the event of an unknown gender, "He is going to the store." implies (possibly falsely) that the target is male. At best, it leaves that ambiguous. On the other hand "They are going to the store" leaves the number of people going to the store ambiguous, but does not imply any false information. It seems to me at worst "they" is equally non-specific. Sure a clear, singular non-gendered pronoun would be better, but in the absence of such a thing existing, "they" actually seems better than "he" in this context. Edit: I'd also point out, singular "they" has existed since at least the 14th century, so it's not like anyone is attempting to modify the language by encouraging it's usage.