5 ms·

On the plus side, other automakers do not have remote access as such. All the other automakers "hacks" have required physical access as a result, although a few

On the plus side, other automakers do not have remote access as such. All the other automakers "hacks" have required physical access as a result, although a few researchers (2 teams only) have managed remote attacks.

close04 8y ago
Unfortunately most other manufacturers also still heavily rely on the woefully outdated and insecure CAN bus. Which means remotely hacking the poorly secured infotainment system can give you access to critical systems. Random example [0]. Your thought shouldn't be a comforting one. [0] https://www.wired.com/2016/08/jeep-hackers-return-high-speed-steering-acceleration-hacks/ https://www.wired.com/2016/08/jeep-hackers-return-high-speed...
- SEJeff 8y ago
  Absolutely no idea why you're being downvoted here when this is in fact the truth. Virtually all automotive computers use the CAN bus in literally ever modern car in existence.
  - antoinealb 8y ago
    It might be because Tesla also uses CAN bus, whereas the parent post implies that only "other automakers" do it. Plus, CAN bus is just layer 2/3, you could build secure extensions on top of it, but I agree it is insecure by default.
    - close04 8y ago
      That's wasn't what I intended to imply. Rather that it's not like other manufacturers found the secret recipe and we should somehow feel safer in their cars. Added an "also" for clarity.
    - SEJeff 8y ago
      Hence "virtually all". You're absolutely correct
  - stcredzero 8y ago
    Absolutely no idea why you're being downvoted here when this is in fact the truth. Because some people value the pro-Tesla narrative more than the truth. This is too bad, because one can value the pro-Tesla narrative and the truth at the same time. (Putting the truth first, of course.)
- xchaotic 8y ago
  as others are saying - you are correct - CAN is a shared bus so inherently insecure and physical access becomes a lot easier.
- PinguTS 8y ago
  CAN is as insecure as Ethernet as both are layer 2 protocols. So its like the smart home.
  - close04 8y ago
    Perfectly correct. This is why IoT is a big deal, anyone hacking your poorly secured IoT device has access to the network it's in. Two major differences though: 1) There are accessible ways for you to secure your home network, not so much when it comes to the car network. 2) Someone taking control of your car poses a more immediate risk to your life and the lives of others on the road around you than having your home network hacked.
deleted 8y ago
[deleted]

close04 8y ago

Unfortunately most other manufacturers also still heavily rely on the woefully outdated and insecure CAN bus. Which means remotely hacking the poorly secured infotainment system can give you access to critical systems. Random example [0]. Your thought shouldn't be a comforting one. [0] https://www.wired.com/2016/08/jeep-hackers-return-high-speed-steering-acceleration-hacks/ https://www.wired.com/2016/08/jeep-hackers-return-high-speed...

SEJeff 8y ago
Absolutely no idea why you're being downvoted here when this is in fact the truth. Virtually all automotive computers use the CAN bus in literally ever modern car in existence.
- antoinealb 8y ago
  It might be because Tesla also uses CAN bus, whereas the parent post implies that only "other automakers" do it. Plus, CAN bus is just layer 2/3, you could build secure extensions on top of it, but I agree it is insecure by default.
  - close04 8y ago
    That's wasn't what I intended to imply. Rather that it's not like other manufacturers found the secret recipe and we should somehow feel safer in their cars. Added an "also" for clarity.
  - SEJeff 8y ago
    Hence "virtually all". You're absolutely correct
- stcredzero 8y ago
  Absolutely no idea why you're being downvoted here when this is in fact the truth. Because some people value the pro-Tesla narrative more than the truth. This is too bad, because one can value the pro-Tesla narrative and the truth at the same time. (Putting the truth first, of course.)
xchaotic 8y ago
as others are saying - you are correct - CAN is a shared bus so inherently insecure and physical access becomes a lot easier.
PinguTS 8y ago
CAN is as insecure as Ethernet as both are layer 2 protocols. So its like the smart home.
- close04 8y ago
  Perfectly correct. This is why IoT is a big deal, anyone hacking your poorly secured IoT device has access to the network it's in. Two major differences though: 1) There are accessible ways for you to secure your home network, not so much when it comes to the car network. 2) Someone taking control of your car poses a more immediate risk to your life and the lives of others on the road around you than having your home network hacked.

deleted 8y ago

[deleted]