5 ms·

That is correct! Google, Amazon, and Apple despite having vast resources don't have the ability/desire to pay for the bandwidth, storage, and processing needed

by lotu 8y ago

That is correct! Google, Amazon, and Apple despite having vast resources don't have the ability/desire to pay for the bandwidth, storage, and processing needed to have 24/7 recording and analysis from every smart device, especially when you realize that includes cell phones. Also it is ironic because all modern cellphones have the whole smart speaker thing built into them but people aren't freaking out about that in the same way. (Probably because they haven't realized it. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯)

runeb 8y ago
Couldn't the device use voice-to-text and upload the text, possibly tagged with which voice profile said what? The same goes for phones, obviously.
- jdietrich 8y ago
  That would either increase the cost of the device or degrade the performance of the speech-to-text. In the case of your phone, you'd get about an hour of battery life. Reasonably accurate speech recognition requires several orders of magnitude more computation than wake word detection.
  - reaperducer 8y ago
    That would either increase the cost of the device On-chip speech-to-text has been around since the 80's. It's not expensive to implement, especially with modern manufacturing. or degrade the performance of the speech-to-text How accurate does it need to be? All the spy corporations need is a stream of keywords.
- partiallypro 8y ago
  I was going to say this, the only real cost would be the cognitive service to transcribe, storing a text version would be nothing.
ttul 8y ago
This is similar to the issue of people being scared of radiation from cell towers but somehow not freaking out that they have a transmitter in their pocket that uses the same range of frequencies but at vastly higher power (due to the proximity).
- homero 8y ago
  Like the people that attack smart electric meters while they talk on their cell phone
  - g45y45 8y ago
    Cell phones don't leak precise power signals that identify exactly what a home user is doing. Smart Electric meters are absolutely part of the surveillance capitalism equation. Power Analysis is a leaky side channel.
- Arelius 8y ago
  I know a few people who only talk via wired headset for this reason.
reaperducer 8y ago
Also it is ironic because all modern cellphones have the whole smart speaker thing built into them but people aren't freaking out about that in the same way Actually, they are. The majority of "ordinary" people I interact with believe Facebook is listening to their conversations 24/7. It's been brought up multiple times on HN.
- bduerst 8y ago
  >The majority of "ordinary" people I interact with believe Facebook is listening to their conversations 24/7. Which is to their point because this is more an example of dunning-krugers with technology than anything else. Those "ordinary" people are data dumb, and project their own explanations onto data joining, which in this case they can only explain as 24/7 microphone recording.
- jethro_tell 8y ago
  >The majority of "ordinary" people I interact with believe Facebook is listening to their conversations 24/7. It's been brought up multiple times on HN. I see this a bunch when people say, they talked about an item with someone then google showed them an ad. Sure, perhaps all that data is being processed, but more likely, it's predictive and they know who in your social circle knows about this item. Your friend read a story about it, searched for it on amazon. People are still in this mode where they don't realize how much info leaks without capturing any conversation, and how good prediction is/can be at this point. So the only explanation is that we're being spied on all the time because I don't think people can wrap their minds around prediction models that are this good. There are stories from 10 years ago of advertising agencies knowing that someone is pregnant before they did and ten years later, the general public assumes they have to have the original thought first so FAAMG knows what to sell them.
glitchc 8y ago
Google Photos allows users unlimited storage when storing photos in their proprietary format. I see a 90-day buffer per user consuming roughly the same amount of storage. Also disingenous to consider the smart speaker that works without cell reception in the same category. Those that require cell reception to work are just as circumspect as Alexa/Google.
pseudalopex 8y ago
My experience with pocket dialing and speakerphone calls leads me to believe my phone is a much less capable listening device. Many people still have phones where constant listening would supposedly drain the battery.

by lotu 8y ago

runeb 8y ago

Couldn't the device use voice-to-text and upload the text, possibly tagged with which voice profile said what? The same goes for phones, obviously.

jdietrich 8y ago
That would either increase the cost of the device or degrade the performance of the speech-to-text. In the case of your phone, you'd get about an hour of battery life. Reasonably accurate speech recognition requires several orders of magnitude more computation than wake word detection.
- reaperducer 8y ago
  That would either increase the cost of the device On-chip speech-to-text has been around since the 80's. It's not expensive to implement, especially with modern manufacturing. or degrade the performance of the speech-to-text How accurate does it need to be? All the spy corporations need is a stream of keywords.
partiallypro 8y ago
I was going to say this, the only real cost would be the cognitive service to transcribe, storing a text version would be nothing.

ttul 8y ago

This is similar to the issue of people being scared of radiation from cell towers but somehow not freaking out that they have a transmitter in their pocket that uses the same range of frequencies but at vastly higher power (due to the proximity).

homero 8y ago
Like the people that attack smart electric meters while they talk on their cell phone
- g45y45 8y ago
  Cell phones don't leak precise power signals that identify exactly what a home user is doing. Smart Electric meters are absolutely part of the surveillance capitalism equation. Power Analysis is a leaky side channel.
Arelius 8y ago
I know a few people who only talk via wired headset for this reason.

reaperducer 8y ago

Also it is ironic because all modern cellphones have the whole smart speaker thing built into them but people aren't freaking out about that in the same way Actually, they are. The majority of "ordinary" people I interact with believe Facebook is listening to their conversations 24/7. It's been brought up multiple times on HN.

bduerst 8y ago
>The majority of "ordinary" people I interact with believe Facebook is listening to their conversations 24/7. Which is to their point because this is more an example of dunning-krugers with technology than anything else. Those "ordinary" people are data dumb, and project their own explanations onto data joining, which in this case they can only explain as 24/7 microphone recording.
jethro_tell 8y ago
>The majority of "ordinary" people I interact with believe Facebook is listening to their conversations 24/7. It's been brought up multiple times on HN. I see this a bunch when people say, they talked about an item with someone then google showed them an ad. Sure, perhaps all that data is being processed, but more likely, it's predictive and they know who in your social circle knows about this item. Your friend read a story about it, searched for it on amazon. People are still in this mode where they don't realize how much info leaks without capturing any conversation, and how good prediction is/can be at this point. So the only explanation is that we're being spied on all the time because I don't think people can wrap their minds around prediction models that are this good. There are stories from 10 years ago of advertising agencies knowing that someone is pregnant before they did and ten years later, the general public assumes they have to have the original thought first so FAAMG knows what to sell them.

glitchc 8y ago

Google Photos allows users unlimited storage when storing photos in their proprietary format. I see a 90-day buffer per user consuming roughly the same amount of storage. Also disingenous to consider the smart speaker that works without cell reception in the same category. Those that require cell reception to work are just as circumspect as Alexa/Google.

pseudalopex 8y ago

My experience with pocket dialing and speakerphone calls leads me to believe my phone is a much less capable listening device. Many people still have phones where constant listening would supposedly drain the battery.