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It's not about UX, it's about how awful people are. Hacker News is an amazing place, and it's not because of the UX, which is certainly of a piece with the Old
by cwyers 8y ago
It's not about UX, it's about how awful people are. Hacker News is an amazing place, and it's not because of the UX, which is certainly of a piece with the Old Internet. It's because there are people who put a lot of effort into making it a not a giant cesspool. And even then, it can be incredibly difficult to discuss some topics here because discussion becomes overrun by bad actors. If you want to get a sense of what the Internet would be like without an amazing amount of curation, go read the comments on basically any story run on a local newspaper or TV station, where they don't have the resources to do content moderation. Read up on the people who get PTSD having to filter content off Facebook so that an unsuspecting user doesn't run across child porn or a snuff film. The walled gardens exist because the places outside of the walls are <em>awful.</em> And they're a lot more awful if you exist outside of the band of college-to-middle-aged white men who makes up the bulk of the people who experienced the old Internet or who post here on HN. If you're in a lot of more socially vulnerable positions, Twitter is far more a fenced garden than a walled garden. But that fence is still a lot more protection than you'd get on a platform that doesn't have to do that kind of moderation to be viable to advertisers. Monetizing the Internet has had a lot of knock-on effects, but one of those effects is that it's really really hard to monetize open neo-Naziism and a lot of other awful things, so the big players clean up their platforms. Recent years have shown that it's easy to monetize a lot of racist dog-whistling, though. It's not perfect. But an alternative to what we have now needs to start from a point of how do you reduce harassment and social harms, not ignoring how the big commercial players have made things better than they were before.
- indigochill 8y ago>not ignoring how the big commercial players have made things better than they were before. In my book, they're moderately worse. I entered the internet around the time of free web forums, where anyone could run one for any reason. I moderated a couple moderately sized ones, mostly oriented around computer games. Overall it wasn't too bad. Certainly nothing compared to what I've seen in larger communities. I suspect the larger the community, the worse the garbage. But the main reason I say commercial players have made it worse is that they've also commercialized content moderation. Which is to say, they employ people to sit at a desk looking at the absolute worst humanity has to offer for 8 straight hours a day for barely better than minimum wage. That's like a job straight out of Black Mirror. Forum moderation, by contrast, was/is a volunteer position. You were only in it for as long as you chose to be, and you could leave at any time without any effect on your livelihood. So I'd argue the "community watch" model of amateur forum moderators was closer to the greater good than the commercial walled gardens.
- ska 8y agoThey've made some things better, and some things worse. Which I think was the point.