4 ms·

> I don't understand what the big deal is... "When Lamson tells people that she's sober, they sometimes get uncomfortable, she said, and assume she's judging t

> I don't understand what the big deal is... "When Lamson tells people that she's sober, they sometimes get uncomfortable, she said, and assume she's judging them if they choose to drink." "Catherine Medici [...] avoids drinks because of medical issues. But refusing a drink at a reception sometimes leads to questions, which means disclosing her condition." "...she didn't want people to assume that because she was without a drink, she might be pregnant. A mentor advised her that people could make that assumption" > we should ban alcohol at these events because some people don't like it? "These scholars don't want everyone to become teetotalers, or for conferences to ban alcohol altogether."

andonisus 8y ago
The question remains: how is this a big deal? So what if she thinks people are judging her. Acknowledge it, ignore it, and move on with your time. We cannot seek to universally police the behavior of others, but we can control our own reactions to it. If she is uncomfortable with answering questions about why she doesn't wish to drink, she can just respond that she doesn't want to. It really does seem that simple to me.
- PhasmaFelis 8y ago
  These aren't casual social events, they're important industry networking opportunities. Being judged there can negatively impact your career. Also, some of the people mentioned are recovering alcoholics who just want to be able to get a drink of water without having to go up to the bar. All of this is in the article.
  - andonisus 8y ago
    The article speaks about feeling judged, not actually being judged. I am quite certain that no one at these conferences (or at social networking events of any kind which involved alcohol) cares if someone is abstaining from alcohol.
    - eesmith 8y ago
      How are you certain that no one at these conferences makes these sorts of judgments? One of the examples from the article is: > When she was a graduate student looking for a job, Medici was especially aware of the conclusions that people might draw from her choices. She's married, and she didn't want people to assume that because she was without a drink, she might be pregnant. A mentor advised her that people could make that assumption, and passed along the club-soda trick. I can how someone might infer that if a woman is not drinking then she is likely pregnant. I also know that pregnancy discrimination in hiring is a thing - illegal in the US, but still a real thing. This seems like the sort of judgement that you says doesn't happen. I can't see how you can be sure that no one at academic conferences makes this sort of inference.
    - PhasmaFelis 8y ago
      The world is really a much simpler place if you assume that any concerns you haven't personally experienced are imaginary.
      - andonisus 8y ago
        It's not the the concerns are imaginary, it's that they are inconsequential. Everyone will have an opinion about everything they interact with; this is the human experience. You can't control the fact that others will form opinions about you and your actions, but you can control how you react regarding this.
subjectHarold 8y ago
Yep, and thinking that everyone is judging you is often not a rational thought (it is probably the most common thought within a general social anxiety). The other person doesn't have to disclose anything...you just say "I don't drink"...feeling like you "have" to tell someone anything is not a thing. If someone has your testicles hooked up to a car battery then consider it but no-one is forcing her to say anything, she is forcing herself. I come from the UK, I went to uni at a time when the drinking culture was still big...I never had a problem...at uni...in a country where it is fairly normal to get destroyed every weekend. Not once, out of (probably) hundreds of times (I did study theology briefly, the only time I remember it getting weird was with devout people thinking they had found someone with similar views). Perhaps more to the point though: assume that someone did have a huge problem with me drinking, why do I care? Someone else thinking that I have to drink seems like an irrational belief on their part. It is never about someone saying they have a problem with someone not drinking, it is about people who don't drink thinking they can read minds. What you are saying is that everyone else should be forced to change their behaviour so that one or two people stop making themselves feel uncomfortable. As someone who has been in this position: this doesn't work. If you feel uncomfortable and drinking is banned, you will start attributing those feelings to something else. The reason I came to that conclusion (that banning alcohol is the solution) is that, based on the beliefs in the article, banning alcohol is the only actual solution. Presumably if something else was attempted like banning people asking each other for drinks, then they would worry about people looking at their drink.
- PhasmaFelis 8y ago
  > Perhaps more to the point though: assume that someone did have a huge problem with me drinking, why do I care? Because, again, these are career networking events, not casual get-togethers. > The reason I came to that conclusion (that banning alcohol is the solution) is that, based on the beliefs in the article, banning alcohol is the only actual solution. Really? "Stop judging people who don't drink" seems like it would help a lot. Also "make it possible for recovering alcoholics to get a glass of water without going to the bar."

andonisus 8y ago

The question remains: how is this a big deal? So what if she thinks people are judging her. Acknowledge it, ignore it, and move on with your time. We cannot seek to universally police the behavior of others, but we can control our own reactions to it. If she is uncomfortable with answering questions about why she doesn't wish to drink, she can just respond that she doesn't want to. It really does seem that simple to me.

PhasmaFelis 8y ago
These aren't casual social events, they're important industry networking opportunities. Being judged there can negatively impact your career. Also, some of the people mentioned are recovering alcoholics who just want to be able to get a drink of water without having to go up to the bar. All of this is in the article.
- andonisus 8y ago
  The article speaks about feeling judged, not actually being judged. I am quite certain that no one at these conferences (or at social networking events of any kind which involved alcohol) cares if someone is abstaining from alcohol.
  - eesmith 8y ago
    How are you certain that no one at these conferences makes these sorts of judgments? One of the examples from the article is: > When she was a graduate student looking for a job, Medici was especially aware of the conclusions that people might draw from her choices. She's married, and she didn't want people to assume that because she was without a drink, she might be pregnant. A mentor advised her that people could make that assumption, and passed along the club-soda trick. I can how someone might infer that if a woman is not drinking then she is likely pregnant. I also know that pregnancy discrimination in hiring is a thing - illegal in the US, but still a real thing. This seems like the sort of judgement that you says doesn't happen. I can't see how you can be sure that no one at academic conferences makes this sort of inference.
  - PhasmaFelis 8y ago
    The world is really a much simpler place if you assume that any concerns you haven't personally experienced are imaginary.
    - andonisus 8y ago
      It's not the the concerns are imaginary, it's that they are inconsequential. Everyone will have an opinion about everything they interact with; this is the human experience. You can't control the fact that others will form opinions about you and your actions, but you can control how you react regarding this.

subjectHarold 8y ago

Yep, and thinking that everyone is judging you is often not a rational thought (it is probably the most common thought within a general social anxiety). The other person doesn't have to disclose anything...you just say "I don't drink"...feeling like you "have" to tell someone anything is not a thing. If someone has your testicles hooked up to a car battery then consider it but no-one is forcing her to say anything, she is forcing herself. I come from the UK, I went to uni at a time when the drinking culture was still big...I never had a problem...at uni...in a country where it is fairly normal to get destroyed every weekend. Not once, out of (probably) hundreds of times (I did study theology briefly, the only time I remember it getting weird was with devout people thinking they had found someone with similar views). Perhaps more to the point though: assume that someone did have a huge problem with me drinking, why do I care? Someone else thinking that I have to drink seems like an irrational belief on their part. It is never about someone saying they have a problem with someone not drinking, it is about people who don't drink thinking they can read minds. What you are saying is that everyone else should be forced to change their behaviour so that one or two people stop making themselves feel uncomfortable. As someone who has been in this position: this doesn't work. If you feel uncomfortable and drinking is banned, you will start attributing those feelings to something else. The reason I came to that conclusion (that banning alcohol is the solution) is that, based on the beliefs in the article, banning alcohol is the only actual solution. Presumably if something else was attempted like banning people asking each other for drinks, then they would worry about people looking at their drink.

PhasmaFelis 8y ago
> Perhaps more to the point though: assume that someone did have a huge problem with me drinking, why do I care? Because, again, these are career networking events, not casual get-togethers. > The reason I came to that conclusion (that banning alcohol is the solution) is that, based on the beliefs in the article, banning alcohol is the only actual solution. Really? "Stop judging people who don't drink" seems like it would help a lot. Also "make it possible for recovering alcoholics to get a glass of water without going to the bar."