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Watch the Fed up documentary, explains it so well that no matter how much we try, exercising and eating less wont work. Our environment is saturated with produc

Watch the Fed up documentary, explains it so well that no matter how much we try, exercising and eating less wont work. Our environment is saturated with products now which almost all have added sugar, only way is to look at ingredients and change your environment, dont bring these things home and instead bring better stuff home thats not got added sugar.

chrisseaton 8y ago
> no matter how much we try, exercising and eating less won't work How can that be? If you burn more calories and you take in less calories, then surely at some point your body must start to lose mass. At very least is the equation that you're breathing out carbon and you're not getting that mass back from anything apart from what you eat.
- rhcom2 8y ago
  Logically it's the answer, just like drug addiction is solved by stopping the use of drugs but of course knowing that alone doesn't really help.
- danans 8y ago
  > How can that be? All else equal, you are right, but practically, for most people who aren't young, or athletes, hard endurance physical exercise triggers eating behavior that overcompensates for the number of calories burned. Sure, if you force exercise upon and deny the extra calories to someone, they will lose weight, but that's not a desirable solution for most, sustainable for the individual, or scalable in today's society. Solutions that acknowledge the existence of and work with human eating behaviors are needed. IMO that would involve reconfiguring our society to enable people to have quotidian implicit forms of exercise (vs dedicated gym sessions), like walking as part of their commutes, or gardening, and of course reducing the amount of sugar in the food environment. But that's a challenge because the current environment that most people inhabit is configured to encourage the opposite. There certainly appears to be a statistical correlation between car based commute frequency and obesity rates in a given area: https://www.fastcompany.com/1679157/mapping-the-link-between-obesity-and-car-driving https://www.fastcompany.com/1679157/mapping-the-link-between...
- graeme 8y ago
  Because all of this is regulated by hunger. If you move more, you get hungrier. The issue in the case of most overweight people is that their body is trying to maintain a set point at a high level of body fat. Hunger serves to maintain this weight set point. The way to sustainable weight loss is to eat in such a way that the body starts to target a lower set point and decreases hunger. Obviously this also results in less calories taken than expended, but if it were as simple as a math formula most people would have six packs.
  - deleted 8y ago
    [deleted]
- aantix 8y ago
  I think weight loss is less of the issue - you're right, that is solved. Long term weight loss is the big issue. Let's be honest, anything that you have to maintain indefinitely - relationship, business, health/weight/muscle mass, finances - will eventually fail at some point. And food does have that unique component of that it can't be totally avoided. You can't just cut it out of your life to become healthier (unlike say alcohol). They're all hamster wheels. And then we die.
- amriksohata 8y ago
  I'm taking about sustainable living not crash dieting as one offs which most people can't maintain
paulcole 8y ago
> that no matter how much we try, exercising and eating less won't work Definitely disagree here. These are the only things that work. How else can you lose weight other than by moving more and eating less?
- jki275 8y ago
  The key is that people actually don't eat less. They feel more hungry when they exercise, which drives them to eat more, which pushes the vicious cycle even further.
  - paulcole 8y ago
    That's like saying, "Cars don't work on roads" but conveniently forgetting to add, "...if you don't step on the gas." I am speaking as someone who has lost about 75-100 pounds (no clue I was too ashamed to step on a scale) and kept it off for 10+ years. I can guarantee you that exercising more and eating less works even if it's not what anyone wants to hear.
  - crysin 8y ago
    There's also eating less and actually eating less. You can eat less food, but if the food you're eating is higher in calories then you're not going to lose weight. Part of the problem with eating less, is the size / portion of what you eat matters just as much as what you are actually eating. As an extreme example: The size of a slice of cheesecake is roughly equivalent to the size of a breast of chicken however eating the slice of cheesecake is eating a lot "more" than eating that breast of chicken.
    - SketchySeaBeast 8y ago
      That's why if you're going to lose weight you gotta focus on the information and know that what you just ate was x calories / x% of your daily intake and act upon that knowledge.
  - wenc 8y ago
    There's one way out of this vicious cycle. I substituted the prodigious amounts of refined carbs I used to eat (pasta, rice) with meat, vegetables and a reduced amount of carbs. The proteins definitely helped with the hunger (and being a carnivore, it didn't take much to convince me to eat more meat -- though for me it's mostly white meat and eggs). I actually ended up eating more I also started lifting weights. Exercising increases appetite for sure, but proteins satiates it. I didn't lose that much weight (10 lbs), but I managed to convert what used to be flab to muscle. Exercise + protein/vegetable diet (even if eating more) = body shape change.
Carlton87 8y ago
Exercising and eating less is the only thing that works for losing weight. For the most part an individual is personally responsible for calories in and calories out. Being morbidly obese is a choice and it will kill you.
- kazinator 8y ago
  I would say that this is true in cases when neglecting to exercise and eat appropriately is the cause of excess weight in a normally functioning body. In severe cases of obesity, something else may be going on. In a nutshell, the bodies of some of these sufferers could be on some sort of fat storage rampage. The fat cells extract an "energy tax" and store it; the body then has to do with what is left. If there is a broken, runaway fat storage mechanism at play, such that a percentage of your intake is stored as fat, and not easily released again, it will be difficult to overcome the accumulation of fat with diet and exercise. But, yeah, diet and exercise work for many people. And in many cases when they are reported as not working, they weren't given the proper effort. Excercise that works is probably 2-3X more voluminous and intense than exercise people think ought to work, damn it! And sane eating plans have to be adhered to forever, not just for a couple of weeks. If you stick with exercise and become a long-term dedicated athlete, it will change how the body works. You have to change your self-image into one that includes you as an athlete. A durable, self-image that persists even if you take a break from sport which gives you confidence to get back into the game.
  - chrisseaton 8y ago
    Then how come in famine situations there is nobody for whom the restricted calorie intake and exercise does not cause weight loss? Nobody in those situations stays overweight due to 'some sort of fat storage rampage' do they?
    - kazinator 8y ago
      Well, firstly, "famine" isn't the same thing as "diet and exercise regime" Even if famine does work, and does so for everyone, that still plausibly leaves regular diet and exercise not equally effective for everyone. > Nobody in those situations stays overweight due to 'some sort of fat storage rampage' do they? I actually have no idea. Does there exist anyone who died at close to zero fat and muscle in a death camp, or due to famine, who had been confirmed to have been a 450 pounder? It's imaginable that in such a predicament, such an obese person will die of starvation long before losing the fat; that it simply won't be metabolically available to sustain them. Without any actual data, "nobody came out fat out of Auschwitz" is just a dumb Internet meme. There are cases of incredible body transformation from people quite severely obese to basically skin-over-muscle; yet that doesn't prove it's possible for everyone.
maxxxxx 8y ago
Totally agree. We have to start with better quality of food. Most Americans eat basically only crap with a lot of sugar, carbs and other stuff.

chrisseaton 8y ago

> no matter how much we try, exercising and eating less won't work How can that be? If you burn more calories and you take in less calories, then surely at some point your body must start to lose mass. At very least is the equation that you're breathing out carbon and you're not getting that mass back from anything apart from what you eat.

rhcom2 8y ago
Logically it's the answer, just like drug addiction is solved by stopping the use of drugs but of course knowing that alone doesn't really help.
danans 8y ago
> How can that be? All else equal, you are right, but practically, for most people who aren't young, or athletes, hard endurance physical exercise triggers eating behavior that overcompensates for the number of calories burned. Sure, if you force exercise upon and deny the extra calories to someone, they will lose weight, but that's not a desirable solution for most, sustainable for the individual, or scalable in today's society. Solutions that acknowledge the existence of and work with human eating behaviors are needed. IMO that would involve reconfiguring our society to enable people to have quotidian implicit forms of exercise (vs dedicated gym sessions), like walking as part of their commutes, or gardening, and of course reducing the amount of sugar in the food environment. But that's a challenge because the current environment that most people inhabit is configured to encourage the opposite. There certainly appears to be a statistical correlation between car based commute frequency and obesity rates in a given area: https://www.fastcompany.com/1679157/mapping-the-link-between-obesity-and-car-driving https://www.fastcompany.com/1679157/mapping-the-link-between...
graeme 8y ago
Because all of this is regulated by hunger. If you move more, you get hungrier. The issue in the case of most overweight people is that their body is trying to maintain a set point at a high level of body fat. Hunger serves to maintain this weight set point. The way to sustainable weight loss is to eat in such a way that the body starts to target a lower set point and decreases hunger. Obviously this also results in less calories taken than expended, but if it were as simple as a math formula most people would have six packs.
- deleted 8y ago
  [deleted]
aantix 8y ago
I think weight loss is less of the issue - you're right, that is solved. Long term weight loss is the big issue. Let's be honest, anything that you have to maintain indefinitely - relationship, business, health/weight/muscle mass, finances - will eventually fail at some point. And food does have that unique component of that it can't be totally avoided. You can't just cut it out of your life to become healthier (unlike say alcohol). They're all hamster wheels. And then we die.
amriksohata 8y ago
I'm taking about sustainable living not crash dieting as one offs which most people can't maintain

paulcole 8y ago

> that no matter how much we try, exercising and eating less won't work Definitely disagree here. These are the only things that work. How else can you lose weight other than by moving more and eating less?

jki275 8y ago
The key is that people actually don't eat less. They feel more hungry when they exercise, which drives them to eat more, which pushes the vicious cycle even further.
- paulcole 8y ago
  That's like saying, "Cars don't work on roads" but conveniently forgetting to add, "...if you don't step on the gas." I am speaking as someone who has lost about 75-100 pounds (no clue I was too ashamed to step on a scale) and kept it off for 10+ years. I can guarantee you that exercising more and eating less works even if it's not what anyone wants to hear.
- crysin 8y ago
  There's also eating less and actually eating less. You can eat less food, but if the food you're eating is higher in calories then you're not going to lose weight. Part of the problem with eating less, is the size / portion of what you eat matters just as much as what you are actually eating. As an extreme example: The size of a slice of cheesecake is roughly equivalent to the size of a breast of chicken however eating the slice of cheesecake is eating a lot "more" than eating that breast of chicken.
  - SketchySeaBeast 8y ago
    That's why if you're going to lose weight you gotta focus on the information and know that what you just ate was x calories / x% of your daily intake and act upon that knowledge.
- wenc 8y ago
  There's one way out of this vicious cycle. I substituted the prodigious amounts of refined carbs I used to eat (pasta, rice) with meat, vegetables and a reduced amount of carbs. The proteins definitely helped with the hunger (and being a carnivore, it didn't take much to convince me to eat more meat -- though for me it's mostly white meat and eggs). I actually ended up eating more I also started lifting weights. Exercising increases appetite for sure, but proteins satiates it. I didn't lose that much weight (10 lbs), but I managed to convert what used to be flab to muscle. Exercise + protein/vegetable diet (even if eating more) = body shape change.

Carlton87 8y ago

Exercising and eating less is the only thing that works for losing weight. For the most part an individual is personally responsible for calories in and calories out. Being morbidly obese is a choice and it will kill you.

kazinator 8y ago
I would say that this is true in cases when neglecting to exercise and eat appropriately is the cause of excess weight in a normally functioning body. In severe cases of obesity, something else may be going on. In a nutshell, the bodies of some of these sufferers could be on some sort of fat storage rampage. The fat cells extract an "energy tax" and store it; the body then has to do with what is left. If there is a broken, runaway fat storage mechanism at play, such that a percentage of your intake is stored as fat, and not easily released again, it will be difficult to overcome the accumulation of fat with diet and exercise. But, yeah, diet and exercise work for many people. And in many cases when they are reported as not working, they weren't given the proper effort. Excercise that works is probably 2-3X more voluminous and intense than exercise people think ought to work, damn it! And sane eating plans have to be adhered to forever, not just for a couple of weeks. If you stick with exercise and become a long-term dedicated athlete, it will change how the body works. You have to change your self-image into one that includes you as an athlete. A durable, self-image that persists even if you take a break from sport which gives you confidence to get back into the game.
- chrisseaton 8y ago
  Then how come in famine situations there is nobody for whom the restricted calorie intake and exercise does not cause weight loss? Nobody in those situations stays overweight due to 'some sort of fat storage rampage' do they?
  - kazinator 8y ago
    Well, firstly, "famine" isn't the same thing as "diet and exercise regime" Even if famine does work, and does so for everyone, that still plausibly leaves regular diet and exercise not equally effective for everyone. > Nobody in those situations stays overweight due to 'some sort of fat storage rampage' do they? I actually have no idea. Does there exist anyone who died at close to zero fat and muscle in a death camp, or due to famine, who had been confirmed to have been a 450 pounder? It's imaginable that in such a predicament, such an obese person will die of starvation long before losing the fat; that it simply won't be metabolically available to sustain them. Without any actual data, "nobody came out fat out of Auschwitz" is just a dumb Internet meme. There are cases of incredible body transformation from people quite severely obese to basically skin-over-muscle; yet that doesn't prove it's possible for everyone.

maxxxxx 8y ago

Totally agree. We have to start with better quality of food. Most Americans eat basically only crap with a lot of sugar, carbs and other stuff.