5 ms·

They would make the roads safer if they weren't used so often as money machines. Do they stand at schools? Nope. They stand at the bottom of the hill at the exi

They would make the roads safer if they weren't used so often as money machines. Do they stand at schools? Nope. They stand at the bottom of the hill at the exit of a town.

rikkus 8y ago
They used to be positioned like this in the UK but all the ones I’ve seen like this have been removed or moved over the years to places where they could be regarded as more for safety than easy money making.
- suvelx 8y ago
  This was intentional, the chief of police wanted to stop them being used as revenue generation, and actually used as a safety device. As such, they're now bright yellow.
  - Reelin 8y ago
    As someone who hates speed cameras, I would actually like them if they were more like what you've described. * Clearly marked, by law. * Placed for safety, with some clearly defined legal criteria. * No data retention, by law.
  - Balero 8y ago
    They also have abundant signs pointing to where they are. I even saw one that had a blue flashing light on top, with a large speed limit sign next to it. If you get caught by that, you really need to pay more attention.
  - emileokada 8y ago
    If I recall correctly, they are now also only allowed to be placed where road accidents have happened before.
- cs02rm0 8y ago
  I've never seen a UK camera moved or removed.
TomK32 8y ago
Those are also the places where you find those little crosses and similar markers at the side. The deadliest stretches of road are the most remote ones which are mistaken for race tracks...
- Aaargh20318 8y ago
  > Those are also the places where you find those little crosses and similar markers at the side. Usually next to a tree. I would prefer them to be used to prevent kids from being killed rather than to prevent some idiot from auto-darwinating himself.
  - TomK32 8y ago
    Sticking to the speed limit or asking the tree to move aside, what's easier?
    - cs02rm0 8y ago
      A chainsaw.
  - adrianN 8y ago
    They're not fantastically expensive devices. We can have enough of them to protect children and idiots.
    - Aaargh20318 8y ago
      They are €43.000 s piece, not exactly cheap.
      - adrianN 8y ago
        Seems to be on the same order as a traffic light, so not particularly expensive compared to other street infrastructure.
fwn 8y ago
Known and well-signposted speed camera on dangerous turns, close to schools or kindergartens would vastly improve street safety. Unfortunately most German(!) street cameras are placed to surprise the driver, causing nearly continuous disruption even for those who don't speed. Their destabilizing effect on traffic can be observed quite easily as people suddenly brake, make light signs to warn others, surprisingly change lanes (because of the sudden speed reduction), etc. This is because in Germany the money goes to the local authorities. It doesn't help that placing and maintaining them is pretty expensive (and often outsourced with profit-sharing). Local authorities and private partners have little incentive to reduce their income per device just to increase road safety.
- chrisper 8y ago
  Same in Switzerland. I honestly believe a true speed limit enforcement system would not be based on money, but rather points and after a certain amount of points you would not be allowed to drive for a month or something.
Xylakant 8y ago
There's a truly simple trick that makes you invisible for the attempt to use them as money machine. It's incredibly simple. Do not exceed the speed limit. I tried it. It works!
- chrisper 8y ago
  Your view is so naive that I won't even try to argue against it. Your argument only works if cameras weren't set up as traps. Tricky speed cameras make people drive like robots. Some people even drive 20 below the speed limit "just because there could be a camera lurking." This problem isn't easily solved by "just sticking to the speed limit" because many cameras are set up such that they catch you when it isn't natural to drive at exact speed limit (For example shortly before a town ends, or driving up a steep hill etc.).
  - Xylakant 8y ago
    No, my argument even works if the cameras are set up as traps. The speed limit at any stretch of the road is well known. It's visibly posted at the sides if it deviates from the expected. You're are arguing in favor of "everybody exceeds the speed limit, so we shouldn't punish it." I'm arguing in favor of "everyone should drive at the speed limit." Have you tried lately to drive 30 in a posted 30kmh zone? 50kmh in a city center? You'll be regarded as a traffic obstacle. And that's the problem. > when it isn't natural to drive at exact speed limit (For example shortly before a town ends, or driving up a steep hill etc.). Why isn't it "natural" to drive at the posted speed limit until you're at the end of the down? How many seconds do you gain? Is it "natural" to not be able to keep your impulse to put the pedal to the metal in check? The sign "this is the end of the town" exactly signifies that border. People not observing that might be exactly the reason why there's a speed trap - not making money, enforcing the rule. Why is it "natural" to not observe the speed limit going up a steep hill? Especially on a steep hill it's hard to see what's happening behind the crest. Are you arguing with "nature" or just "I don't see the use of that rule, so it doesn't apply to me"? Is that your nature? If so, I'd prefer if you gave up driving.
    - 8y ago
chewz 8y ago
In Poland speed cameras had been used by various municipalities to extract revenue from passing cars. They had been hidden in some deliberately deceptive places. One municipality had been making 1/3 of their budget from the national road passing through. There had been private companies leasing cameras and servicing them in revenue-sharing schemes. It had been forbidden by law few years ago. To make clear we still have speed cameras and perhaps more now but there is a process for deciding where they are and why...

They would make the roads safer if they weren't used so often as money machines. Do they stand at schools? Nope. They stand at the bottom of the hill at the exit of a town.

rikkus 8y ago

They used to be positioned like this in the UK but all the ones I’ve seen like this have been removed or moved over the years to places where they could be regarded as more for safety than easy money making.

suvelx 8y ago
This was intentional, the chief of police wanted to stop them being used as revenue generation, and actually used as a safety device. As such, they're now bright yellow.
- Reelin 8y ago
  As someone who hates speed cameras, I would actually like them if they were more like what you've described. * Clearly marked, by law. * Placed for safety, with some clearly defined legal criteria. * No data retention, by law.
- Balero 8y ago
  They also have abundant signs pointing to where they are. I even saw one that had a blue flashing light on top, with a large speed limit sign next to it. If you get caught by that, you really need to pay more attention.
- emileokada 8y ago
  If I recall correctly, they are now also only allowed to be placed where road accidents have happened before.
cs02rm0 8y ago
I've never seen a UK camera moved or removed.

TomK32 8y ago

Those are also the places where you find those little crosses and similar markers at the side. The deadliest stretches of road are the most remote ones which are mistaken for race tracks...

Aaargh20318 8y ago
> Those are also the places where you find those little crosses and similar markers at the side. Usually next to a tree. I would prefer them to be used to prevent kids from being killed rather than to prevent some idiot from auto-darwinating himself.
- TomK32 8y ago
  Sticking to the speed limit or asking the tree to move aside, what's easier?
  - cs02rm0 8y ago
    A chainsaw.
- adrianN 8y ago
  They're not fantastically expensive devices. We can have enough of them to protect children and idiots.
  - Aaargh20318 8y ago
    They are €43.000 s piece, not exactly cheap.
    - adrianN 8y ago
      Seems to be on the same order as a traffic light, so not particularly expensive compared to other street infrastructure.

fwn 8y ago

Known and well-signposted speed camera on dangerous turns, close to schools or kindergartens would vastly improve street safety. Unfortunately most German(!) street cameras are placed to surprise the driver, causing nearly continuous disruption even for those who don't speed. Their destabilizing effect on traffic can be observed quite easily as people suddenly brake, make light signs to warn others, surprisingly change lanes (because of the sudden speed reduction), etc. This is because in Germany the money goes to the local authorities. It doesn't help that placing and maintaining them is pretty expensive (and often outsourced with profit-sharing). Local authorities and private partners have little incentive to reduce their income per device just to increase road safety.

chrisper 8y ago
Same in Switzerland. I honestly believe a true speed limit enforcement system would not be based on money, but rather points and after a certain amount of points you would not be allowed to drive for a month or something.

Xylakant 8y ago

There's a truly simple trick that makes you invisible for the attempt to use them as money machine. It's incredibly simple. Do not exceed the speed limit. I tried it. It works!

chrisper 8y ago
Your view is so naive that I won't even try to argue against it. Your argument only works if cameras weren't set up as traps. Tricky speed cameras make people drive like robots. Some people even drive 20 below the speed limit "just because there could be a camera lurking." This problem isn't easily solved by "just sticking to the speed limit" because many cameras are set up such that they catch you when it isn't natural to drive at exact speed limit (For example shortly before a town ends, or driving up a steep hill etc.).
- Xylakant 8y ago
  No, my argument even works if the cameras are set up as traps. The speed limit at any stretch of the road is well known. It's visibly posted at the sides if it deviates from the expected. You're are arguing in favor of "everybody exceeds the speed limit, so we shouldn't punish it." I'm arguing in favor of "everyone should drive at the speed limit." Have you tried lately to drive 30 in a posted 30kmh zone? 50kmh in a city center? You'll be regarded as a traffic obstacle. And that's the problem. > when it isn't natural to drive at exact speed limit (For example shortly before a town ends, or driving up a steep hill etc.). Why isn't it "natural" to drive at the posted speed limit until you're at the end of the down? How many seconds do you gain? Is it "natural" to not be able to keep your impulse to put the pedal to the metal in check? The sign "this is the end of the town" exactly signifies that border. People not observing that might be exactly the reason why there's a speed trap - not making money, enforcing the rule. Why is it "natural" to not observe the speed limit going up a steep hill? Especially on a steep hill it's hard to see what's happening behind the crest. Are you arguing with "nature" or just "I don't see the use of that rule, so it doesn't apply to me"? Is that your nature? If so, I'd prefer if you gave up driving.
  - 8y ago

chewz 8y ago

In Poland speed cameras had been used by various municipalities to extract revenue from passing cars. They had been hidden in some deliberately deceptive places. One municipality had been making 1/3 of their budget from the national road passing through. There had been private companies leasing cameras and servicing them in revenue-sharing schemes. It had been forbidden by law few years ago. To make clear we still have speed cameras and perhaps more now but there is a process for deciding where they are and why...