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Based on when this product was created, I can almost guarantee they are just manually scraping LinkedIn (plus a few other places - Facebook, twitter, Bloomberg,

Based on when this product was created, I can almost guarantee they are just manually scraping LinkedIn (plus a few other places - Facebook, twitter, Bloomberg, maybe even Pitchbook). There are custom Google search portals you can use to search LinkedIn via keyword that not everyone knows about. From there one can use a bunch of services that will provide you (mostly)valid emails at various companies. I imagine he made a quick set of tutorials for his outsourced contractors and had his virtual assistant he found on oDesk do the hiring and setting up of those contractors. This quote from the article is wild: "Customers have to train their team and the billing is variable so your cost per lead ranges from $.50 to $5" You can beat that number paying people $20/hr to do this stuff, let alone exploiting people out in the Philippines on I'm sure the not livable wages he's paying them(Aka the fallacy of low rent/cost of living in developing economies). Sigh... you know we're at the end of the cycle when it's just a bunch of outsourcers with marketing backgrounds.

hnzix 8y ago
> the fallacy of low rent/cost of living in developing economies Let's say a knowledge worker in a developing country could survive on $1 USD a day, adjusting food and rent to local cost. If a local white collar job paid them $5 a day, and a remote "exploiting" job paid them $15 a day, but an American could earn $50 a day for the same task, is this really a moral hazard?
- deleted 8y ago
  [deleted]
- hawkice 8y ago
  No, ya see, it's wrong to pay people in poorer countries less because now you're talking to a poor person. If you hire an American, you never even spoke to a poor person, so it isn't your fault. If that sounds like a fever dream, you aren't alone, but it's my best guess at understanding what's happening. Obviously, my complete lack of employing people in central Africa is why they are all middle class Americans now, so I'm doing my part.
  - kokokokoko 8y ago
    Or, maybe pay people a living wage no matter what country they are from? Doesn't seem that unreasonable.
    - deleted 8y ago
      [deleted]
    - zorga 8y ago
      That is a living wage in their country.
    - vesak 8y ago
      Well, if a person is producing below a living wage, then it's difficult to pay that person a living wage.
      - kokokokoko 8y ago
        You realize, that the business we are talking about is performing arbitrage on labor. That the very definition of this business is that the workers are receiving less than the full amount of the value they are creating. Its literally how the business makes money. Paying them less than their output. This business cannot exist and at the same time not have more money to pay the people doing the work.
        conanbatt 8y ago
        > That the very definition of this business is that the workers are receiving less than the full amount of the value they are creating. Of any businesses, its necessary to also maintain the capital that gives them the productivity to generate all that value. Even under a marxist theory you cant pay someone what they produce exactly, cuz then they wouldnt be your employee.
    - PinkMilkshake 8y ago
      It seems reasonable until you realize you could completely wreck their local economy. If you start paying people to compile lists for you at a higher rate than they are paid performing important local services, then they will stop performing important local services and start compiling lists for you. What needs to happen is slower growth. So foreign businesses outsource to the Philippines, paying them low wages. Then other businesses see this as a good way to save and do the same, and then more businesses and so on. Soon the people in the Philippines have options, and their market starts to become competitive, and they start demanding more pay (which is good). During this whole process they are spending that foreign money into their local economy, allowing it to grow and keep up. China is a good example.
- unclebucknasty 8y ago
  Yes.
  - DATACOMMANDER 8y ago
    Because he should be employing Americans, or because he should be paying the developing-country worker $50/day? If the latter, how do you think that workers in developing countries are going to go from making $5/day to $50/day if they never make anything in between? Surely a 200% pay increase given immediately is better than a 900% pay increase that’s purely hypothetical?
    - kokokokoko 8y ago
      Because he should be paying human beings a living wage no matter where they are. Pretending that living costs in a developing nation is somehow magically non existent is immoral. Pay people a reasonable wage to live their lives and provide for their families. Just because someone lives in another country does not give a person the moral authority to pay them an amount that does not allow them to properly feed and care for themselves and their family.
      - strken 8y ago
        This point of view compares a marginal improvement with a massive improvement and concludes that bringing about a marginal improvement when you could cause a massive improvement is wrong. This is a false comparison because there's a third option, which is doing nothing. Doing nothing is worse than causing any size of improvement, and almost all of us are doing nothing. If we are to accept that paying Filipino workers slightly more than the local economy is offering is wrong, then we must also accept that not paying them anything is wrong, in which case we should be going after the hordes of people who aren't doing anything instead of the people who are only doing a tiny little bit.
        mbrock 8y ago
        That’s not the only possible ethical judgment. You’re assuming a kind of utilitarian perspective, but I think most people have at least an implicit virtue ethical perspective, which might come into play when evaluating the morality of a person who lives a life of leisure and freedom funded by maximizing the arbitrage from a third world labor force employed for repetitive and alienated tasks. Especially when the thesis that minimal wages now inexorably increase later seems on the surface like a neoliberal just-so story.
systematical 8y ago
This is the problem with articles like this, they never really go into specifics. Generally fluff. Look at me I did this, but I won't give any specifics how except for vague self-help pamphlet jargon like "Monetize your brain".
- coob 8y ago
  I don't think that's fair, there's detail in there. For example, his approach to sales calls.
- tootahe45 8y ago
  I just skip over them unless they provided proof of their xK/month revenue. There are so many people willing to lie to sell you something or just to get e-rep.

hnzix 8y ago

> the fallacy of low rent/cost of living in developing economies Let's say a knowledge worker in a developing country could survive on $1 USD a day, adjusting food and rent to local cost. If a local white collar job paid them $5 a day, and a remote "exploiting" job paid them $15 a day, but an American could earn $50 a day for the same task, is this really a moral hazard?

deleted 8y ago
[deleted]
hawkice 8y ago
No, ya see, it's wrong to pay people in poorer countries less because now you're talking to a poor person. If you hire an American, you never even spoke to a poor person, so it isn't your fault. If that sounds like a fever dream, you aren't alone, but it's my best guess at understanding what's happening. Obviously, my complete lack of employing people in central Africa is why they are all middle class Americans now, so I'm doing my part.
- kokokokoko 8y ago
  Or, maybe pay people a living wage no matter what country they are from? Doesn't seem that unreasonable.
  - deleted 8y ago
    [deleted]
  - zorga 8y ago
    That is a living wage in their country.
  - vesak 8y ago
    Well, if a person is producing below a living wage, then it's difficult to pay that person a living wage.
    - kokokokoko 8y ago
      You realize, that the business we are talking about is performing arbitrage on labor. That the very definition of this business is that the workers are receiving less than the full amount of the value they are creating. Its literally how the business makes money. Paying them less than their output. This business cannot exist and at the same time not have more money to pay the people doing the work.
      - conanbatt 8y ago
        > That the very definition of this business is that the workers are receiving less than the full amount of the value they are creating. Of any businesses, its necessary to also maintain the capital that gives them the productivity to generate all that value. Even under a marxist theory you cant pay someone what they produce exactly, cuz then they wouldnt be your employee.
  - PinkMilkshake 8y ago
    It seems reasonable until you realize you could completely wreck their local economy. If you start paying people to compile lists for you at a higher rate than they are paid performing important local services, then they will stop performing important local services and start compiling lists for you. What needs to happen is slower growth. So foreign businesses outsource to the Philippines, paying them low wages. Then other businesses see this as a good way to save and do the same, and then more businesses and so on. Soon the people in the Philippines have options, and their market starts to become competitive, and they start demanding more pay (which is good). During this whole process they are spending that foreign money into their local economy, allowing it to grow and keep up. China is a good example.
unclebucknasty 8y ago
Yes.
- DATACOMMANDER 8y ago
  Because he should be employing Americans, or because he should be paying the developing-country worker $50/day? If the latter, how do you think that workers in developing countries are going to go from making $5/day to $50/day if they never make anything in between? Surely a 200% pay increase given immediately is better than a 900% pay increase that’s purely hypothetical?
  - kokokokoko 8y ago
    Because he should be paying human beings a living wage no matter where they are. Pretending that living costs in a developing nation is somehow magically non existent is immoral. Pay people a reasonable wage to live their lives and provide for their families. Just because someone lives in another country does not give a person the moral authority to pay them an amount that does not allow them to properly feed and care for themselves and their family.
    - strken 8y ago
      This point of view compares a marginal improvement with a massive improvement and concludes that bringing about a marginal improvement when you could cause a massive improvement is wrong. This is a false comparison because there's a third option, which is doing nothing. Doing nothing is worse than causing any size of improvement, and almost all of us are doing nothing. If we are to accept that paying Filipino workers slightly more than the local economy is offering is wrong, then we must also accept that not paying them anything is wrong, in which case we should be going after the hordes of people who aren't doing anything instead of the people who are only doing a tiny little bit.
      - mbrock 8y ago
        That’s not the only possible ethical judgment. You’re assuming a kind of utilitarian perspective, but I think most people have at least an implicit virtue ethical perspective, which might come into play when evaluating the morality of a person who lives a life of leisure and freedom funded by maximizing the arbitrage from a third world labor force employed for repetitive and alienated tasks. Especially when the thesis that minimal wages now inexorably increase later seems on the surface like a neoliberal just-so story.

systematical 8y ago

This is the problem with articles like this, they never really go into specifics. Generally fluff. Look at me I did this, but I won't give any specifics how except for vague self-help pamphlet jargon like "Monetize your brain".

coob 8y ago
I don't think that's fair, there's detail in there. For example, his approach to sales calls.
tootahe45 8y ago
I just skip over them unless they provided proof of their xK/month revenue. There are so many people willing to lie to sell you something or just to get e-rep.