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This is sexism. People should avoid labels such as "masculine" or "feminine". How would we react if they said, for example, "traditional jewishness" (is conside
by js8 8y ago
This is sexism. People should avoid labels such as "masculine" or "feminine". How would we react if they said, for example, "traditional jewishness" (is considered harmful)?
I think feminist movement is actively hurting itself by adopting divisive labels such as "toxic masculinity", "patriarchy" or even "feminism". We have gender neutral way of talking about these phenomena, there is no need to invoke gender.
- lithos 8y agoSocietal pressures? Role conformity? Edit: Though looking at other discussions, it looks like people are more interested in playing blame games somehow.
- js8 8y agoI am not sure what is the question here.
- lithos 8y agoAsked for a gender neutral way to label gender roles.
- Majestic121 8y agoYou might want to specify this in your first message : I did not really understand your propositions in context before this message
- js8 8y agoYou just used the gender neutral way - "gender role". I am not sure why you need to talk specifically about male or female roles, unless you are sexist? For example. In India, there was a caste system. Why would you in a modern society, need to talk about traditional role for a member of a caste? You can talk about discrimination, for example, this and this person was denied to be employed as such and such, and it is discriminatory. But whatever the "traditional role" was, it doesn't actually matter at all. It doesn't matter why the racist thinks that someone is inferior.
- orasis 8y agoIf the labels describe an interesting pattern then we shouldn’t fear them.
- js8 8y agoI disagree. Mainly because I don't think patterns based on someone gender are very interesting, I think they lead to bias and ultimately divide people. Again, consider how it would look like if the pattern was based on race. We simply don't want to pattern people like that. You can judge by behavior, but you shouldn't judge by gender.
- orasis 8y agoI think feminine & masculine, yin & yang are extremely fascinating and practically useful. When I run into a problem where the yang approach isn’t working I try switching to yin. Meditation & psychedelics have me utterly convinced that yin & yang, chaos & order are fundamental to conscious experience. But, who knows.
- smhost 8y agothe formula for small "c" conservative language-policing among post-critical folk seems to be: 1) identify a criticism of some traditional power structure (masculinity) 2) hijack the critical language and turn it on itself into a contradiction (anti-sexism is itself sexist) it's the same formula for everything from "atheism is itself a religion" to "anti-racism is racism against white people". to me it just seems like a very childish defense mechanism, like if nobody is allowed to talk about the problem then the problem will just go away.
- js8 8y agoThis is a big misunderstanding. You can criticize power structures in gender-neutral way. You can say, for example, "social hierarchy" instead of "patriarchy". You can talk about "movement for gender equality" instead of "feminism". You can talk about "being asshole" or "taking too much risks" or other trait instead of "toxic masculinity". I actually agree with the feminist critique (for the most part), I think where they are wrong is putting people into gender boxes. And I don't think other movements for equality (for example, movements for racial and sexual equality) do this to such extent.