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Linkbait trolling tier for sure. Slams LaTeX for being a markup language, then suggests we use org mode instead (org mode being a markup language which only pro

Linkbait trolling tier for sure. Slams LaTeX for being a markup language, then suggests we use org mode instead (org mode being a markup language which only produces interesting LaTeX output when you embed LaTeX in it). FWIIW I do use org mode as a sort of higher level LaTeX for note taking, mostly because the latex bits get compiled as I type, but when it comes time to turn my thoughts into something more organized, it gets turned into pure LaTeX. There are a real reasons academics and quasi-academics (aka me) use LaTeX instead of something like libreoffice. Equations are basically impossible without it. I can't write down a complicated relation in LaTeX as fast as I can think of it, but it's a lot closer to that speed than laboriously constructing a relation in the equation editor of any word processor. If you do something like physics, machine learning or topology, trying to write a paper in libreoffice or whatever they call Word now is sort of like trying to write a novel on an iphone. The author never mentions equations. Yeah, it's more difficult for a n00b to construct, say, a letter to the editor in LaTeX than it is in Libreoffice -that's not what it's for! Though of course once you have paid the toll of learning the thing, it's pretty quick and in fact lives up to its promise of not getting in the way of writing the content. Beyond that, my equations will be accessible for decades and will be completely platform independent. If you have an academic career, this is probably reasonably important. There's other reasons besides "equations" and "long term stability" (BibTex is probably top third reason) -but those are the big ones. Edit add: beamer mode is also a good reason to use it once you know it. Take your paper; turn it into a presentation -never leave the same application.

gota 8y ago
Microsoft Word's equation editor has improved a lot over the last years. I'm not saying it meets LaTeX at its strenghts but it is very unfair to call it "hell". Also, I haven't used it but newer versions recognize handwritten equations and formulae and automatically transcribe them to the equation format.
- kevindong 8y ago
  My experience with the Word equation editor is that it causes the entire program to stutter, hang, and lag horribly if you have non-trivial equations. No idea why. On the flip side, LaTeX definitely takes longer to write, but it's less frustrating than having to deal with Word's (well intentioned) autoformatting.
  - asdff 8y ago
    That is because ANYTHING on word beyond typing, italics, underline, and bold causes that. Try importing a citation from something like endnote or Zotero, I have time to take my hands off the keyboard and crack my knuckles before I can get back to typing.
- xattt 8y ago
  Word 2016 and above on Windows allow the use of LaTeX to write equations. On OS X, later versions of Pages do the same thing.
  - scottlocklin 8y ago
    As the proverb goes; now you have two problems. Depending on proprietary stuff which changes all the time, or even complex FOSS software with single point of failure developers (I dunno, TeXmacs or something) is a huge risk which went away when I bought a cheap Leslie Lamport book on LaTeX. Doesn't really matter if a new feature in proprietary application-X allows me to also use it with LaTeX. I can just use LaTeX! I wrote my dissertation in 2004, can still trivially use the LaTeX in it, and I sometimes do. Libreoffice, Word ... pretty sure I'd have a harder time of it. Heck Libreoffice was probably called StarOffice back then!
  - zrobotics 8y ago
    I was forced to submit a lab report in Word. I'd tried to use the LaTeX feature, and I couldn't even get it to properly understand limits of integration. After ~5 minutes, I just gave up and used the annoying Gui interface, since at least it worked. This was last year, and I haven't tried again (since if I need to typeset math, I'll just use LaTeX). Word has its advantages, mostly ease of use, but it just can't handle math and bibliographies as easily as LaTeX.
    - xattt 8y ago
      I haven’t actually used the LaTeX interface in Word, though I had used it in Pages on several occaisons. I was impressed and unreasonably wished that Pages was actually a full-featured, live updating LaTeX GUI editor.
- mehrdadn 8y ago
  The equations in the current equation editor look very ugly. The old Equation Editor produced nice-looking equations but it was a pain to use. In LaTeX neither of these is a problem.
btschaegg 8y ago
> There are a real reasons academics and quasi-academics (aka me) use LaTeX instead of something like libreoffice. I can attest to that from first-hand experience. Having done a thesis in LibreOffice once, I wouldn't want to repeat the experience. That's not an absolute negative against LibreOffice, though. I still use it often and like doing so. But a large document with many illustrations, many text-internal references, code and a non-trivial bibliography? Never again.
Fomite 8y ago
Counterpoint: I'm an academic, and almost no one I work with uses LaTeX, and I've found that the pain points between the two are different, but not particularly better. And if I never saw another beamer presentation again I'd be a happy man.
- scottlocklin 8y ago
  Well beamer is convenient for LaTeX using authors anyway. What don't you like about it? Formatting? Also curious if your field involves presenting a lot of mathematics. If I were a test-tube biologist or a lawyer, I doubt I'd use it.
  - Fomite 8y ago
    I'm an epidemiologist, on the more mathematical/computational side of things. Mostly, for beamer, I find that it encourages three things: 1) Very uniform formatting that keeps everything in say, a conference, as sort of a blur. 2) Lots of "I'm going to skip this slide..." 3) Encouragement of the "A presentation is a paper you read to people" style. None of these are unique to beamer, but seems to promote it (in my anecdotal experience).
    - scottlocklin 8y ago
      Ah, OK; I guess all of this makes sense, but people were still using transparencies when I left academia. In business world, beamer is the quirky boffin presentation rather than the workaday powerpoint in corporate colors/fonts.
      - Fomite 8y ago
        Yeah - they were a refreshing, quirky style - or an indicator of someone not in my field - for a bit, but they've grown stale relatively quickly.
    - ajford 8y ago
      I'd venture to say that None of those are beamer/LaTex problems. They are all exclusively at the hand of the presenter. Someone who doesn't care enough to learn how to properly give an engaging presentation, or was never given the opportunity to do so will make those kinds of presentations. In my undergrad Honors Physics program, I was required to attend two different workshops on giving presentations (on top of the university requirement of Speech & Comms class) and a technical writing class. Suffice to say, my beamer presentations are not identical, nor so they include "extra" slides. It doesn't take much to drop slides, so it should be easy to comment out a number of slides for a tailored presentation. That's just a lazy presenter.
deleted 8y ago
[deleted]

gota 8y ago

Microsoft Word's equation editor has improved a lot over the last years. I'm not saying it meets LaTeX at its strenghts but it is very unfair to call it "hell". Also, I haven't used it but newer versions recognize handwritten equations and formulae and automatically transcribe them to the equation format.

kevindong 8y ago
My experience with the Word equation editor is that it causes the entire program to stutter, hang, and lag horribly if you have non-trivial equations. No idea why. On the flip side, LaTeX definitely takes longer to write, but it's less frustrating than having to deal with Word's (well intentioned) autoformatting.
- asdff 8y ago
  That is because ANYTHING on word beyond typing, italics, underline, and bold causes that. Try importing a citation from something like endnote or Zotero, I have time to take my hands off the keyboard and crack my knuckles before I can get back to typing.
xattt 8y ago
Word 2016 and above on Windows allow the use of LaTeX to write equations. On OS X, later versions of Pages do the same thing.
- scottlocklin 8y ago
  As the proverb goes; now you have two problems. Depending on proprietary stuff which changes all the time, or even complex FOSS software with single point of failure developers (I dunno, TeXmacs or something) is a huge risk which went away when I bought a cheap Leslie Lamport book on LaTeX. Doesn't really matter if a new feature in proprietary application-X allows me to also use it with LaTeX. I can just use LaTeX! I wrote my dissertation in 2004, can still trivially use the LaTeX in it, and I sometimes do. Libreoffice, Word ... pretty sure I'd have a harder time of it. Heck Libreoffice was probably called StarOffice back then!
- zrobotics 8y ago
  I was forced to submit a lab report in Word. I'd tried to use the LaTeX feature, and I couldn't even get it to properly understand limits of integration. After ~5 minutes, I just gave up and used the annoying Gui interface, since at least it worked. This was last year, and I haven't tried again (since if I need to typeset math, I'll just use LaTeX). Word has its advantages, mostly ease of use, but it just can't handle math and bibliographies as easily as LaTeX.
  - xattt 8y ago
    I haven’t actually used the LaTeX interface in Word, though I had used it in Pages on several occaisons. I was impressed and unreasonably wished that Pages was actually a full-featured, live updating LaTeX GUI editor.
mehrdadn 8y ago
The equations in the current equation editor look very ugly. The old Equation Editor produced nice-looking equations but it was a pain to use. In LaTeX neither of these is a problem.

btschaegg 8y ago

> There are a real reasons academics and quasi-academics (aka me) use LaTeX instead of something like libreoffice. I can attest to that from first-hand experience. Having done a thesis in LibreOffice once, I wouldn't want to repeat the experience. That's not an absolute negative against LibreOffice, though. I still use it often and like doing so. But a large document with many illustrations, many text-internal references, code and a non-trivial bibliography? Never again.

Fomite 8y ago

Counterpoint: I'm an academic, and almost no one I work with uses LaTeX, and I've found that the pain points between the two are different, but not particularly better. And if I never saw another beamer presentation again I'd be a happy man.

scottlocklin 8y ago
Well beamer is convenient for LaTeX using authors anyway. What don't you like about it? Formatting? Also curious if your field involves presenting a lot of mathematics. If I were a test-tube biologist or a lawyer, I doubt I'd use it.
- Fomite 8y ago
  I'm an epidemiologist, on the more mathematical/computational side of things. Mostly, for beamer, I find that it encourages three things: 1) Very uniform formatting that keeps everything in say, a conference, as sort of a blur. 2) Lots of "I'm going to skip this slide..." 3) Encouragement of the "A presentation is a paper you read to people" style. None of these are unique to beamer, but seems to promote it (in my anecdotal experience).
  - scottlocklin 8y ago
    Ah, OK; I guess all of this makes sense, but people were still using transparencies when I left academia. In business world, beamer is the quirky boffin presentation rather than the workaday powerpoint in corporate colors/fonts.
    - Fomite 8y ago
      Yeah - they were a refreshing, quirky style - or an indicator of someone not in my field - for a bit, but they've grown stale relatively quickly.
  - ajford 8y ago
    I'd venture to say that None of those are beamer/LaTex problems. They are all exclusively at the hand of the presenter. Someone who doesn't care enough to learn how to properly give an engaging presentation, or was never given the opportunity to do so will make those kinds of presentations. In my undergrad Honors Physics program, I was required to attend two different workshops on giving presentations (on top of the university requirement of Speech & Comms class) and a technical writing class. Suffice to say, my beamer presentations are not identical, nor so they include "extra" slides. It doesn't take much to drop slides, so it should be easy to comment out a number of slides for a tailored presentation. That's just a lazy presenter.

deleted 8y ago

[deleted]