13 ms·

American Cheese Surplus Reaches Record High

62 points by tshannon 8y ago

mikhailfranco 8y ago
So that's what they do with all the harvested oceanic plastic.
crushcrashcrush 8y ago
Reading between the lines here: the American cheese “product” isn’t very good, and consumer tastes have shifted. Also, I assume the dairy industry is heavily subsidized by the US govnerment?
- foolfoolz 8y ago
  it’s closer to how beer has changed. american mass produced and majority revenue generating cheese is low quality and people have better access to higher quality cheese. so they aren’t buying the traditional money making cheeses as much anymore. of the cheese people are buying now, most of it is american, some of it imported. similar to rise of craft brew. much of the dairy supply chain has been subsidized, previously to ensure availability and lower prices. the same outcome is happening, big cheese makers in the u. s. are branching product lines to have more specialty cheeses or will buy out those small cheese makers. tastes definitely have shifted
- mc32 8y ago
  Maybe but the article states "Record dairy production in the U.S. has produced a record surplus of cheese causing prices to drop" So, perhaps there is some of what you say, but it looks like the article is saying it's predominantly due to overproduction. So tastes are changing, and people are shifting their habits but milk (and thus cheese) production have continued to climb.
- bryanlarsen 8y ago
  American cheese is cheap. And when you have an oversupply of milk, you have to either dump it or turn it into something that can be stored for later sale. Thus cheap cheese.
  - ryanmercer 8y ago
    >you have to either dump it or turn it into something that can be stored for later sale. Indeed. Planet Money has a good episode on this too https://www.npr.org/sections/money/2018/08/31/643486297/episode-862-big-government-cheese https://www.npr.org/sections/money/2018/08/31/643486297/epis...
  - tomschlick 8y ago
    So what you're saying is that blocks of cheese are milk batteries. I like it.
    - deleted 8y ago
      [deleted]
    - mrguyorama 8y ago
      Not at all. Once milk is turned into cheese, it's not really possible to turn it back, or into other dairy products
      - AnIdiotOnTheNet 8y ago
        Are you sure about that? Has anyone tried? I mean, there was that one time that guy accidentally figured out how to uncook eggs: https://www.smh.com.au/technology/australian-scientist-wins-ig-nobel-prize-for-uncooking-an-egg-20150918-gjpq12.html https://www.smh.com.au/technology/australian-scientist-wins-...
        mrguyorama 8y ago
        Now that sure is an interesting development! However, in cheesemaking, some of the ingredients and byproducts are discarded as part of the process, so you could not recover that for the original milk
    - moate 8y ago
      Sorta. Cheese can still go bad (or at least develop a form most people aren't interested in eating). Part of the problem here is that storing milk as cheese is fine if you assume that in the future there will be less milk/cheese and you'll be able to unload your current stock. This will eventually happen, but along the way you're just going to see a ton of dairy farmers go under and who knows how long it's going to take for the market to stabilize"
- cptskippy 8y ago
  > Reading between the lines here... Well the article actually says as much: > Suppliers turn that extra milk into cheese because it is less perishable and stays fresh for longer periods. But Americans are turning their noses up at those processed cheese slices and string cheese — varieties that are a main driver of the U.S. cheese market — in favor of more refined options, Novakovic tells Here & Now's Jeremy Hobson.
- ryanmercer 8y ago
  >Also, I assume the dairy industry is heavily subsidized by the US govnerment? Yes, a few different ways. The reason we have a cheese surplus to begin with though is because of government intervention in 1976. Planet Money has a good episode about this: https://www.npr.org/sections/money/2018/08/31/643486297/episode-862-big-government-cheese https://www.npr.org/sections/money/2018/08/31/643486297/epis...
benj111 8y ago
This is like the EU butter mountains of the 90s. Except I found no mention of subsidies. Is that not a (the) factor?
danans 8y ago
The shifting preference patterns around cheese type are very tangible. In my own case, my kids have never had the kind of individually plastic-wrapped processed orange cheese slices that I grew up with. No Velveeta style either (unless it was on nachos at a fair). And we mostly buy domestic cheeses, of which there are many suppliers who make higher quality varieties. Tillamook, Cabot come to mind, and one of my favorites, Milton Creamery's Prairie Breeze Cheddar. Apart from these cheeses being objectively tastier than the cheese of my childhood, the power of social trends is strong, and people across the country have taken on to the "whole" foods trope in the past several years, no doubt urged along by the influence of celebrity chefs and new cuisines that have entered the US via immigration. Interest in higher quality food is one of things that, despite polarization in other spheres, has become fairly consistent between the coasts and the middle of the country.
- neom 8y ago
  Wow you're really passionate about your cheese huh? :) Question - could your parents have afforded real cheese and not the plastic processed stuff? I grew up in Scotland and you could only buy really real cheese, so when I'd go on summer holiday Cheese Whiz was such a treat and I envied anyone who got to eat it regularly.
  - dataanalyst1 8y ago
    I grew up on kraft yellow cheese slices as well, my parents could've afforded better cheese however I think its more to the availability (much like the OP states) of better quality items. Grocery stores in America (well big cities at least) have changed massively in the past 30 years, and once you have some decent cheese, you wont buy single slices again.
  - rch 8y ago
    My parents bought processed cheese because it was all my little brother would eat. I focused my complaining on dyes and sweeteners in order to get the the kind of food I preferred, but really I just like how simple foods taste. To this day, things that I buy or bring and leave on the shelf will still be there the next time I visit. It's probably a matter of different palates reinforced as culture.
wil421 8y ago
>Support, in its various forms, equaled 73 percent of U.S. dairy farmers’ market returns in 2015. [1] For the other commenters and viewers who were wondering about subsides. [1]https://amp-realagriculture-com.cdn.ampproject.org/c/s/amp.realagriculture.com/2018/02/u-s-dairy-subsidies-equal-73-percent-of-producer-returns-says-new-report/ https://amp-realagriculture-com.cdn.ampproject.org/c/s/amp.r...
- bryanlarsen 8y ago
  It's worse than that; that study only counts things that benefit American producers vis-a-vis Canadian ones. For example, American corn subsidies depress the global price of corn, benefiting both American and Canadian milk producers.
- justtopost 8y ago
  Got a real link?
thieving_magpie 8y ago
Tangential story, who remembers when the US government "accidentally created a cheese surplus so large it had to be stored in a ginormous cave." Great podcast on it from Planet Money: https://www.npr.org/sections/money/2018/08/31/643486297/episode-862-big-government-cheese https://www.npr.org/sections/money/2018/08/31/643486297/epis...
- cronix 8y ago
  I remember in the late 70's, or early 80's (I was a kid so don't remember exactly), when my grandmother went on Social Security she got cheese and butter regularly from the government. It was actually quality stuff. I believe it was possibly due to what you're talking about.
  - thieving_magpie 8y ago
    Yes, they call that "government cheese". I can't speak to the quality but there are people out there that still try to find things that are close to the government cheese quality they loved as kids.
    - linuxlizard 8y ago
      My family had government cheese growing up. Was very very soft, only lightly more dense than cream cheese. Was hard to cut because was too hard for a butter knife but too soft for a carving knife. Taste was like a blander Velveeta. Was not terribly tasty in cold sandwiches but it made THE BEST toasted cheese and grilled cheese sandwiches. Melted very well and tested best melted.
    - thatoneuser 8y ago
      It’s pretty great. The gem of govt food.
  - zanny 8y ago
    I honestly don't get why all the first world countries of the world don't do more stuff like this. Agriculture is nothing close to a free market anywhere, but its all state involvement behind the scenes before you are presented with what looks like price competition and unbridled capitalism on store shelves. Except for milk, which stands out as being price regulated in the US. The largest exception I know of. If taxpayers are going to subsidize farmers to grow tons of excess corn, at least give everyone a cob or two a week instead of using it to dilute gas for no reason.
ArrayList 8y ago
Perhaps a lot of folks are starting to wake up and go vegan, too, which would contribute to the "cheese surplus" (opting for cashew cheeses and other cruelty-free, delicious options.)
- Retra 8y ago
  Perhaps some real-world data could support or refute that hypothesis. Though if Veganism is every going to be a proper religion, that sort of rationalism may undermine it.
ChuckMcM 8y ago
We could start stacking it up along the southern border :-) More seriously though it seems to me that we could use with more cheese factories that make "exotic european" cheese, I much prefer a Camembert after dinner than slices of American. The Marin Cheese Factory[1] is a good example, more of those would be nice. [1] https://marinfrenchcheese.com/about-us/visit-us/ https://marinfrenchcheese.com/about-us/visit-us/
- ericd 8y ago
  Would definitely be nice to have more local producers. Cowgirl creamery makes some really good cheese, but it's stupidly overpriced, and they could use some more competition. I was excited to try Marin's Camembert based on the idea of it being a local producer of real French-style cheese, but I've actually been very disappointed in the couple wheels I've tried. Tasted really dull and dry compared to d'Affinois (which is pretty commonly available and pretty reasonably priced) or real French Camembert (which is pungent enough that you should never cut it in a public enclosed space, but I've found it harder to find the good stuff).
  - thatfrenchguy 8y ago
    You can’t find real Camembert in the US, it has to be unpasteurized and it’s aged less than 60 days which doesn’t pass agricultural rules.
    - ericd 8y ago
      Ah, well, that explains the difficulty :-)
- masonic 8y ago
  Note, however, that the Camembert can be a bit runny. https://youtu.be/B3KBuQHHKx0 https://youtu.be/B3KBuQHHKx0
  - masonic 8y ago
    Update: the cat's eaten it.
Johnny555 8y ago
Some of the best cheese I've ever had was decades ago when there was another cheese surplus and the government was giving it away. My grandparents got some from some senior citizen group, and it was delicious. I remember it being some kind of cheddar cheese. They had more cheese than they could handle -- they had like 4 5 pound blocks of cheese, so they gave most of it to my parents. Though I was in my teens at the time and prior to that my idea of fine cheese was individually wrapped slices, so I'm not sure what I'd think of it now when I barely consider processed cheese slices to be "cheese". https://www.history.com/news/government-cheese-dairy-farmers-reagan https://www.history.com/news/government-cheese-dairy-farmers...
kkhire 8y ago
Go Vegan!
- ArrayList 8y ago
  Heck yeah. Best thing I've ever done
  - walshemj 8y ago
    Hope your taking your supplements and keeping an eye on your biochemistry
    - deleted 8y ago
      [deleted]
- ionised 8y ago
  How would you nourish a new child on a vegan diet?
irrational 8y ago
We had grilled cheese for dinner last night - just doing our part to use up the surplus.
crispyambulance 8y ago
Oh, by "American Cheese" they don't just mean cheese made in America, they mean the actual rectangular blocks of processed yellow cheddar-like stuff with mild flavor? Seems like a waste to just store it as yellow tasteless bricks, can't the industry branch out into more interesting and varied cheeses the people will actually buy?
DeonPenny 8y ago
The great american cheese debt bubble.
equalunique 8y ago
Had cheese for lunch. Doing my part. How about you?
RickJWagner 8y ago
I remember when the US government distributed cheese to low-income families. It was a good move-- it moved product from farmers, and it fed the hungry. The cheese was good, too. My family had some.
jmull 8y ago
HN is making me hungry tonight. Mmmm I need a grilled cheese sandwich now.

62 points by tshannon 8y ago

So that's what they do with all the harvested oceanic plastic.

Reading between the lines here: the American cheese “product” isn’t very good, and consumer tastes have shifted. Also, I assume the dairy industry is heavily subsidized by the US govnerment?

foolfoolz 8y ago
it’s closer to how beer has changed. american mass produced and majority revenue generating cheese is low quality and people have better access to higher quality cheese. so they aren’t buying the traditional money making cheeses as much anymore. of the cheese people are buying now, most of it is american, some of it imported. similar to rise of craft brew. much of the dairy supply chain has been subsidized, previously to ensure availability and lower prices. the same outcome is happening, big cheese makers in the u. s. are branching product lines to have more specialty cheeses or will buy out those small cheese makers. tastes definitely have shifted
mc32 8y ago
Maybe but the article states "Record dairy production in the U.S. has produced a record surplus of cheese causing prices to drop" So, perhaps there is some of what you say, but it looks like the article is saying it's predominantly due to overproduction. So tastes are changing, and people are shifting their habits but milk (and thus cheese) production have continued to climb.
bryanlarsen 8y ago
American cheese is cheap. And when you have an oversupply of milk, you have to either dump it or turn it into something that can be stored for later sale. Thus cheap cheese.
- ryanmercer 8y ago
  >you have to either dump it or turn it into something that can be stored for later sale. Indeed. Planet Money has a good episode on this too https://www.npr.org/sections/money/2018/08/31/643486297/episode-862-big-government-cheese https://www.npr.org/sections/money/2018/08/31/643486297/epis...
- tomschlick 8y ago
  So what you're saying is that blocks of cheese are milk batteries. I like it.
  - deleted 8y ago
    [deleted]
  - mrguyorama 8y ago
    Not at all. Once milk is turned into cheese, it's not really possible to turn it back, or into other dairy products
    - AnIdiotOnTheNet 8y ago
      Are you sure about that? Has anyone tried? I mean, there was that one time that guy accidentally figured out how to uncook eggs: https://www.smh.com.au/technology/australian-scientist-wins-ig-nobel-prize-for-uncooking-an-egg-20150918-gjpq12.html https://www.smh.com.au/technology/australian-scientist-wins-...
      - mrguyorama 8y ago
        Now that sure is an interesting development! However, in cheesemaking, some of the ingredients and byproducts are discarded as part of the process, so you could not recover that for the original milk
  - moate 8y ago
    Sorta. Cheese can still go bad (or at least develop a form most people aren't interested in eating). Part of the problem here is that storing milk as cheese is fine if you assume that in the future there will be less milk/cheese and you'll be able to unload your current stock. This will eventually happen, but along the way you're just going to see a ton of dairy farmers go under and who knows how long it's going to take for the market to stabilize"
cptskippy 8y ago
> Reading between the lines here... Well the article actually says as much: > Suppliers turn that extra milk into cheese because it is less perishable and stays fresh for longer periods. But Americans are turning their noses up at those processed cheese slices and string cheese — varieties that are a main driver of the U.S. cheese market — in favor of more refined options, Novakovic tells Here & Now's Jeremy Hobson.
ryanmercer 8y ago
>Also, I assume the dairy industry is heavily subsidized by the US govnerment? Yes, a few different ways. The reason we have a cheese surplus to begin with though is because of government intervention in 1976. Planet Money has a good episode about this: https://www.npr.org/sections/money/2018/08/31/643486297/episode-862-big-government-cheese https://www.npr.org/sections/money/2018/08/31/643486297/epis...

benj111 8y ago

This is like the EU butter mountains of the 90s. Except I found no mention of subsidies. Is that not a (the) factor?

danans 8y ago

The shifting preference patterns around cheese type are very tangible. In my own case, my kids have never had the kind of individually plastic-wrapped processed orange cheese slices that I grew up with. No Velveeta style either (unless it was on nachos at a fair). And we mostly buy domestic cheeses, of which there are many suppliers who make higher quality varieties. Tillamook, Cabot come to mind, and one of my favorites, Milton Creamery's Prairie Breeze Cheddar. Apart from these cheeses being objectively tastier than the cheese of my childhood, the power of social trends is strong, and people across the country have taken on to the "whole" foods trope in the past several years, no doubt urged along by the influence of celebrity chefs and new cuisines that have entered the US via immigration. Interest in higher quality food is one of things that, despite polarization in other spheres, has become fairly consistent between the coasts and the middle of the country.

neom 8y ago
Wow you're really passionate about your cheese huh? :) Question - could your parents have afforded real cheese and not the plastic processed stuff? I grew up in Scotland and you could only buy really real cheese, so when I'd go on summer holiday Cheese Whiz was such a treat and I envied anyone who got to eat it regularly.
- dataanalyst1 8y ago
  I grew up on kraft yellow cheese slices as well, my parents could've afforded better cheese however I think its more to the availability (much like the OP states) of better quality items. Grocery stores in America (well big cities at least) have changed massively in the past 30 years, and once you have some decent cheese, you wont buy single slices again.
- rch 8y ago
  My parents bought processed cheese because it was all my little brother would eat. I focused my complaining on dyes and sweeteners in order to get the the kind of food I preferred, but really I just like how simple foods taste. To this day, things that I buy or bring and leave on the shelf will still be there the next time I visit. It's probably a matter of different palates reinforced as culture.

wil421 8y ago

>Support, in its various forms, equaled 73 percent of U.S. dairy farmers’ market returns in 2015. [1] For the other commenters and viewers who were wondering about subsides. [1]https://amp-realagriculture-com.cdn.ampproject.org/c/s/amp.realagriculture.com/2018/02/u-s-dairy-subsidies-equal-73-percent-of-producer-returns-says-new-report/ https://amp-realagriculture-com.cdn.ampproject.org/c/s/amp.r...

bryanlarsen 8y ago
It's worse than that; that study only counts things that benefit American producers vis-a-vis Canadian ones. For example, American corn subsidies depress the global price of corn, benefiting both American and Canadian milk producers.
justtopost 8y ago
Got a real link?

thieving_magpie 8y ago

Tangential story, who remembers when the US government "accidentally created a cheese surplus so large it had to be stored in a ginormous cave." Great podcast on it from Planet Money: https://www.npr.org/sections/money/2018/08/31/643486297/episode-862-big-government-cheese https://www.npr.org/sections/money/2018/08/31/643486297/epis...

cronix 8y ago
I remember in the late 70's, or early 80's (I was a kid so don't remember exactly), when my grandmother went on Social Security she got cheese and butter regularly from the government. It was actually quality stuff. I believe it was possibly due to what you're talking about.
- thieving_magpie 8y ago
  Yes, they call that "government cheese". I can't speak to the quality but there are people out there that still try to find things that are close to the government cheese quality they loved as kids.
  - linuxlizard 8y ago
    My family had government cheese growing up. Was very very soft, only lightly more dense than cream cheese. Was hard to cut because was too hard for a butter knife but too soft for a carving knife. Taste was like a blander Velveeta. Was not terribly tasty in cold sandwiches but it made THE BEST toasted cheese and grilled cheese sandwiches. Melted very well and tested best melted.
  - thatoneuser 8y ago
    It’s pretty great. The gem of govt food.
- zanny 8y ago
  I honestly don't get why all the first world countries of the world don't do more stuff like this. Agriculture is nothing close to a free market anywhere, but its all state involvement behind the scenes before you are presented with what looks like price competition and unbridled capitalism on store shelves. Except for milk, which stands out as being price regulated in the US. The largest exception I know of. If taxpayers are going to subsidize farmers to grow tons of excess corn, at least give everyone a cob or two a week instead of using it to dilute gas for no reason.

ArrayList 8y ago

Perhaps a lot of folks are starting to wake up and go vegan, too, which would contribute to the "cheese surplus" (opting for cashew cheeses and other cruelty-free, delicious options.)

Retra 8y ago
Perhaps some real-world data could support or refute that hypothesis. Though if Veganism is every going to be a proper religion, that sort of rationalism may undermine it.

ChuckMcM 8y ago

We could start stacking it up along the southern border :-) More seriously though it seems to me that we could use with more cheese factories that make "exotic european" cheese, I much prefer a Camembert after dinner than slices of American. The Marin Cheese Factory[1] is a good example, more of those would be nice. [1] https://marinfrenchcheese.com/about-us/visit-us/ https://marinfrenchcheese.com/about-us/visit-us/

ericd 8y ago
Would definitely be nice to have more local producers. Cowgirl creamery makes some really good cheese, but it's stupidly overpriced, and they could use some more competition. I was excited to try Marin's Camembert based on the idea of it being a local producer of real French-style cheese, but I've actually been very disappointed in the couple wheels I've tried. Tasted really dull and dry compared to d'Affinois (which is pretty commonly available and pretty reasonably priced) or real French Camembert (which is pungent enough that you should never cut it in a public enclosed space, but I've found it harder to find the good stuff).
- thatfrenchguy 8y ago
  You can’t find real Camembert in the US, it has to be unpasteurized and it’s aged less than 60 days which doesn’t pass agricultural rules.
  - ericd 8y ago
    Ah, well, that explains the difficulty :-)
masonic 8y ago
Note, however, that the Camembert can be a bit runny. https://youtu.be/B3KBuQHHKx0 https://youtu.be/B3KBuQHHKx0
- masonic 8y ago
  Update: the cat's eaten it.

Johnny555 8y ago

Some of the best cheese I've ever had was decades ago when there was another cheese surplus and the government was giving it away. My grandparents got some from some senior citizen group, and it was delicious. I remember it being some kind of cheddar cheese. They had more cheese than they could handle -- they had like 4 5 pound blocks of cheese, so they gave most of it to my parents. Though I was in my teens at the time and prior to that my idea of fine cheese was individually wrapped slices, so I'm not sure what I'd think of it now when I barely consider processed cheese slices to be "cheese". https://www.history.com/news/government-cheese-dairy-farmers-reagan https://www.history.com/news/government-cheese-dairy-farmers...

kkhire 8y ago

Go Vegan!

ArrayList 8y ago
Heck yeah. Best thing I've ever done
- walshemj 8y ago
  Hope your taking your supplements and keeping an eye on your biochemistry
  - deleted 8y ago
    [deleted]
ionised 8y ago
How would you nourish a new child on a vegan diet?

irrational 8y ago

We had grilled cheese for dinner last night - just doing our part to use up the surplus.

crispyambulance 8y ago

Oh, by "American Cheese" they don't just mean cheese made in America, they mean the actual rectangular blocks of processed yellow cheddar-like stuff with mild flavor? Seems like a waste to just store it as yellow tasteless bricks, can't the industry branch out into more interesting and varied cheeses the people will actually buy?

DeonPenny 8y ago

The great american cheese debt bubble.

equalunique 8y ago

Had cheese for lunch. Doing my part. How about you?

RickJWagner 8y ago

I remember when the US government distributed cheese to low-income families. It was a good move-- it moved product from farmers, and it fed the hungry. The cheese was good, too. My family had some.

jmull 8y ago

HN is making me hungry tonight. Mmmm I need a grilled cheese sandwich now.