5 ms·

It will happen if you vote blue. The first wave of it was 10 year of payments and then debt forgiveness.

by sjg007 8y ago

xyzzyz 8y ago
That will push college prices even higher.
- kamarg 8y ago
  Can you explain why that is to me? I would think that if the expected return on college loans drops significantly, fewer large loans would be given out that can be passed on to universities which would see less demand for their product and would need to lower their prices accordingly.
  - Mountain_Skies 8y ago
    The universities aren't on the hook for student loan defaults so they don't care about the expected return for the borrower or the lender. If students borrowed from the schools directly, then the admissions process along with university spending patterns would be vastly different. The only thing we have that is remotely close to this is schools giving out scholarships to students who have great potential to be high earners who later donate back to the school.
    - l9k 8y ago
      A startup called Lambda started teaching (online) for free in exchange for a percentage of the new graduate's salary. This is called Income Sharing Agreements (ISA). https://www.nytimes.com/2019/01/08/business/dealbook/education-student-loans-lambda-schools.html https://www.nytimes.com/2019/01/08/business/dealbook/educati...
- sjg007 8y ago
  There are plenty of mechanisms to counter this. One is direct funding of colleges as we did before via state and Federal funding. Another is to establish a feedback loop where loan guarantees and funding for the institution are a function of their students default rate: that way if the education doesn't lead to jobs then the school gets less money.
  - vondur 8y ago
    That will lead to universities only accepting students that would get jobs after graduation, which would probably kill many majors that don’t have high employment rates.
    - sjg007 8y ago
      Nah.. right now the risk is born uniformly across all tax payers. We should make the school responsible for some of it.
    - gowld 8y ago
      Which is... fine? We don't need millions of people learning unproductive things for excessive prices. Obvious people who can afford to learn something for fun can do so, and knowledge that is socially valuable but not economically valuable can be supported by government or private patrons who see the social merit. Both are better than duping kids into huge loans.
    - xyzzyz 8y ago
      Not really; most university graduates can find jobs relatively easily. Unemployment among young diploma-holders in the US is very low, and the diploma premium to income is high, though of course varies by the major. What will rather happen is that less-well-paying majors will become cheaper.
porphyrogene 8y ago
> It will happen if you vote blue. Unfortunately it is a matter of voting blue enough, not just blue. In some areas politicians, even Democrats, regularly relate to their constituents by bashing "East cost liberal elites" despite having degrees from Ivy League schools. If Doug Jones had said that a liberal arts education is valuable for developing into a well-rounded citizen his race would have ended then and there.
- StevePerkins 8y ago
  I have a college degree. I hope for my kids to take the path of earning college degrees. I think that college is great in the abstract. I also think that until we sort out our health care system in this country (USA), a career in the trades is a very frightening prospect. Even so, this comment is very interesting to me. I frequently see on Hacker News the sentiment that modern higher education is a bubble. That if we don't actively encourage young people to consider a life in the skilled trades, we should at least be teaching respect for those who do. But at the same time, it's hard to ignore the open derision toward non-college grads. I mean, in this particular example, why SHOULD non-college grads support a politician's promises to subsidize colleges, at the expense of other more direct interests? There are obvious cultural/tribal resentments in play, as you're talking about transferring wealth from one class to another class which openly looks down upon the first. But even separating emotion from it, it's hard to criticize strawmen for opposing policy that might well reasonably be seen as voting against their own interests.
  - deleted 8y ago
    [deleted]
  - sjg007 8y ago
    Eventually that non-college grad will need the services of the college grad (and vice versa) so really it should all come out in the wash right?
  - gowld 8y ago
    Subsidized college is for the rural and urban poor, no the elites. Elites don't wait for subsidies, and low-SES people need more cheap vocational/technical colleges to raise their SES.
Red_Pill_Phil 8y ago
What about those of us who didn't go because we knew we wouldnt be able to pay it off? Do I get a credit of some sort and how large should that credit be? I have debts too friend.

It will happen if you vote blue. The first wave of it was 10 year of payments and then debt forgiveness.

by sjg007 8y ago

It will happen if you vote blue. The first wave of it was 10 year of payments and then debt forgiveness.

xyzzyz 8y ago

That will push college prices even higher.

kamarg 8y ago
Can you explain why that is to me? I would think that if the expected return on college loans drops significantly, fewer large loans would be given out that can be passed on to universities which would see less demand for their product and would need to lower their prices accordingly.
- Mountain_Skies 8y ago
  The universities aren't on the hook for student loan defaults so they don't care about the expected return for the borrower or the lender. If students borrowed from the schools directly, then the admissions process along with university spending patterns would be vastly different. The only thing we have that is remotely close to this is schools giving out scholarships to students who have great potential to be high earners who later donate back to the school.
  - l9k 8y ago
    A startup called Lambda started teaching (online) for free in exchange for a percentage of the new graduate's salary. This is called Income Sharing Agreements (ISA). https://www.nytimes.com/2019/01/08/business/dealbook/education-student-loans-lambda-schools.html https://www.nytimes.com/2019/01/08/business/dealbook/educati...
sjg007 8y ago
There are plenty of mechanisms to counter this. One is direct funding of colleges as we did before via state and Federal funding. Another is to establish a feedback loop where loan guarantees and funding for the institution are a function of their students default rate: that way if the education doesn't lead to jobs then the school gets less money.
- vondur 8y ago
  That will lead to universities only accepting students that would get jobs after graduation, which would probably kill many majors that don’t have high employment rates.
  - sjg007 8y ago
    Nah.. right now the risk is born uniformly across all tax payers. We should make the school responsible for some of it.
  - gowld 8y ago
    Which is... fine? We don't need millions of people learning unproductive things for excessive prices. Obvious people who can afford to learn something for fun can do so, and knowledge that is socially valuable but not economically valuable can be supported by government or private patrons who see the social merit. Both are better than duping kids into huge loans.
  - xyzzyz 8y ago
    Not really; most university graduates can find jobs relatively easily. Unemployment among young diploma-holders in the US is very low, and the diploma premium to income is high, though of course varies by the major. What will rather happen is that less-well-paying majors will become cheaper.

porphyrogene 8y ago

> It will happen if you vote blue. Unfortunately it is a matter of voting blue enough, not just blue. In some areas politicians, even Democrats, regularly relate to their constituents by bashing "East cost liberal elites" despite having degrees from Ivy League schools. If Doug Jones had said that a liberal arts education is valuable for developing into a well-rounded citizen his race would have ended then and there.

StevePerkins 8y ago
I have a college degree. I hope for my kids to take the path of earning college degrees. I think that college is great in the abstract. I also think that until we sort out our health care system in this country (USA), a career in the trades is a very frightening prospect. Even so, this comment is very interesting to me. I frequently see on Hacker News the sentiment that modern higher education is a bubble. That if we don't actively encourage young people to consider a life in the skilled trades, we should at least be teaching respect for those who do. But at the same time, it's hard to ignore the open derision toward non-college grads. I mean, in this particular example, why SHOULD non-college grads support a politician's promises to subsidize colleges, at the expense of other more direct interests? There are obvious cultural/tribal resentments in play, as you're talking about transferring wealth from one class to another class which openly looks down upon the first. But even separating emotion from it, it's hard to criticize strawmen for opposing policy that might well reasonably be seen as voting against their own interests.
- deleted 8y ago
  [deleted]
- sjg007 8y ago
  Eventually that non-college grad will need the services of the college grad (and vice versa) so really it should all come out in the wash right?
- gowld 8y ago
  Subsidized college is for the rural and urban poor, no the elites. Elites don't wait for subsidies, and low-SES people need more cheap vocational/technical colleges to raise their SES.

Red_Pill_Phil 8y ago

What about those of us who didn't go because we knew we wouldnt be able to pay it off? Do I get a credit of some sort and how large should that credit be? I have debts too friend.