4 ms·

To be honest I think VB.Net is a decent choice for a high school level course. It's an approachable modern language backed by a huge framework with easy access

To be honest I think VB.Net is a decent choice for a high school level course. It's an approachable modern language backed by a huge framework with easy access to web, Windows and console programming. The IDE is free and relatively user friendly for someone familiar with Windows, which is much more likely than anything else. Don't underestimate VB.Net. It has a terrible history but most of that ended with VB6. Another bonus is that once you know VB.Net the jump to C# is trivial and now you know 2 in demand languages. You can also compile the same code into a program along side F#, IronRuby and yes, IronPython. You aren't there to learn syntax, you are there to learn to program. You should absolutely learn Python on your own as well, knowing one will make the other much easier to pick up anyway. Once you've done that go and learn Scheme, or Ruby, or Scala, ir preferably all of the above.

barrydahlberg 16y ago
Although I should point, C# is my language of choice on .Net.
famousactress 16y ago
I don't mean this as flamebait at all.. Really. I very much respect the .NET platform... but honestly, something really bothers me about the idea of teaching a proprietary language & platform in public schools when there are sooo many amazing open source options available..
- barrydahlberg 16y ago
  Fair comment and I kind of agree in spirit. Java hasn't really been living the dream lately though. At my high school we were taught to use Word and Excel because those were considered essential skills. We could have learnt Open Office or something else but really, how often are we going to encounter that in the real world? In terms of practical use, .Net is not a bad choice. Personally I would like to see Python for getting started and practical use and maybe Scheme for going deeper.
  - famousactress 16y ago
    We could have learnt Open Office or something else but really, how often are we going to encounter that in the real world? In terms of practical use, .Net is not a bad choice I'd say let's take practical-business-relevance out of it (even though I'd argue the relevance of Java, Python, and Ruby to be plenty comparable to .NET). We're talking about high school students, not trade-school students. I think the curriculum ought to be about opening their eyes to this really incredible world of solving problems with computers and logic. I also think a bit part of the key to that is to make sure we don't saddle them with skills that can't afford to develop. You know how bummed I was after taking AutoCad or using Photoshop in high school only to find out that I'd have to mow lawns until I was thirty to afford to use them at home? That's just stupid, and spirit-breaking for interested kids that don't have 800$ (or whatever) for Visual-Studio-Enterprise-Resume-Edition.
    - barrydahlberg 16y ago
      That's why it's nice that everything you need is free including web, Windows and even SQL. http://www.microsoft.com/express/ http://www.microsoft.com/express/ I think the best argument here is regard students running Macs at home which I have no reasonable counter to.
- 3dFlatLander 16y ago
  Proprietary or not, it is an accessible language and IDE. The idea of learning an open language is a good one. But, I think at the high-school level, it would be more important to expose students to something with a low barrier of entry. I don't mean the language, but the entire package. With VB you install one application, and you get an environment where you basically type code and press a play button to get it to run.
  - biot 16y ago
    How accessible is VB.NET for all those kids who own a Mac?
    - barrydahlberg 16y ago
      Fron what I read the Mono compiler for VB.Net is reasonably complete so to answer your question, it's there but more difficult than it should be.
    - kenjackson 16y ago
      I hear Mac's run Windows pretty well.
      - biot 16y ago
        And how much does the non-upgrade copy of Windows cost? I suppose kids could download an unregistered copy and use that for 90 days or whatever the period is, but that may not be enough to last the school year. No doubt schools won't encourage kids to use unlicensed software that they "borrowed" from somewhere.

barrydahlberg 16y ago

Although I should point, C# is my language of choice on .Net.

famousactress 16y ago

I don't mean this as flamebait at all.. Really. I very much respect the .NET platform... but honestly, something really bothers me about the idea of teaching a proprietary language & platform in public schools when there are sooo many amazing open source options available..

barrydahlberg 16y ago
Fair comment and I kind of agree in spirit. Java hasn't really been living the dream lately though. At my high school we were taught to use Word and Excel because those were considered essential skills. We could have learnt Open Office or something else but really, how often are we going to encounter that in the real world? In terms of practical use, .Net is not a bad choice. Personally I would like to see Python for getting started and practical use and maybe Scheme for going deeper.
- famousactress 16y ago
  We could have learnt Open Office or something else but really, how often are we going to encounter that in the real world? In terms of practical use, .Net is not a bad choice I'd say let's take practical-business-relevance out of it (even though I'd argue the relevance of Java, Python, and Ruby to be plenty comparable to .NET). We're talking about high school students, not trade-school students. I think the curriculum ought to be about opening their eyes to this really incredible world of solving problems with computers and logic. I also think a bit part of the key to that is to make sure we don't saddle them with skills that can't afford to develop. You know how bummed I was after taking AutoCad or using Photoshop in high school only to find out that I'd have to mow lawns until I was thirty to afford to use them at home? That's just stupid, and spirit-breaking for interested kids that don't have 800$ (or whatever) for Visual-Studio-Enterprise-Resume-Edition.
  - barrydahlberg 16y ago
    That's why it's nice that everything you need is free including web, Windows and even SQL. http://www.microsoft.com/express/ http://www.microsoft.com/express/ I think the best argument here is regard students running Macs at home which I have no reasonable counter to.
3dFlatLander 16y ago
Proprietary or not, it is an accessible language and IDE. The idea of learning an open language is a good one. But, I think at the high-school level, it would be more important to expose students to something with a low barrier of entry. I don't mean the language, but the entire package. With VB you install one application, and you get an environment where you basically type code and press a play button to get it to run.
- biot 16y ago
  How accessible is VB.NET for all those kids who own a Mac?
  - barrydahlberg 16y ago
    Fron what I read the Mono compiler for VB.Net is reasonably complete so to answer your question, it's there but more difficult than it should be.
  - kenjackson 16y ago
    I hear Mac's run Windows pretty well.
    - biot 16y ago
      And how much does the non-upgrade copy of Windows cost? I suppose kids could download an unregistered copy and use that for 90 days or whatever the period is, but that may not be enough to last the school year. No doubt schools won't encourage kids to use unlicensed software that they "borrowed" from somewhere.