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Capitalism has only existed for about 300 years. And it's been shown to give rise to Fascism, destruction of the Planet, countless civilians dying everyday, cou

Capitalism has only existed for about 300 years. And it's been shown to give rise to Fascism, destruction of the Planet, countless civilians dying everyday, countless homeless people while we have countless houses unoccupied. Regular boom-and-bust that keep people poorer and lessen social spending. It's very good at allowing the 1% exploit us and feed you lies. > There are very, very few counter-examples in narrow low-growth specialised markets, but the general rule has been shown to occur countless times across economies as small as communes to as big as a superpower. Yet we have Mondragon Cooperatives in Spain. > but far less than in planned economies (at least all of them so far) What I am specifically talking about is Worker-owned-and-directed-enterprises [1]. Planned economies is just state capitalism (but even that, you see China? the fastest growth in the history of mankind?). > and capitalism tends to be very efficient at recycling that wasted capital back into productive enterprises. Are you serious? Very efficient? [1] https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qT1JAzhywfA https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qT1JAzhywfA

lucozade 8y ago
> Capitalism ... been shown to give rise to Fascism Historical nonsense. Fascism is a direct descendent of Marxist socialism with class consciousness replaced by nationalism. And the Soviet Union and Communist China were state socialist societies. Neither of which were known for their humanity and environmental consciousness. You can't just define capitalism as "all the bad stuff". Well you can but it's disingenuous and wrong. Pure capitalism has never existed and wouldn't work anyway. Same goes for pure socialism. Organisations like Mondragon and John Lewis have shown that models that mix the two can be successful. That message is not helped by a wilful disregard of facts.
- profalseidol 8y ago
  > Fascism is a direct descendent of Marxist socialism with class consciousness replaced by nationalism. Pure Nonsense. Fascism is simply extreme nationalism. It is believing that one's race is superior which makes you hate immigrants. Makes you build up walls to keep them out. This is born out of the constant exploitation of the capitalists. When the people stop believing the Capitalist lies, you start getting demagogues like Trump. This has nothing to do with Marx and Socialism. Just to repeat, Soviet Union and Communist China Vangaurdism has nothing to do with Worker-owned-and-directed enterprises. Soviet Union and Communist China is very different from Mondragon and John Lewis. Power is decentralized as much as possible. Managers and Executives (if needed) are only in power for a few months and is subject to call any time. Unlike today where C-level persons act like Feudal Lords.

lucozade 8y ago

> Capitalism ... been shown to give rise to Fascism Historical nonsense. Fascism is a direct descendent of Marxist socialism with class consciousness replaced by nationalism. And the Soviet Union and Communist China were state socialist societies. Neither of which were known for their humanity and environmental consciousness. You can't just define capitalism as "all the bad stuff". Well you can but it's disingenuous and wrong. Pure capitalism has never existed and wouldn't work anyway. Same goes for pure socialism. Organisations like Mondragon and John Lewis have shown that models that mix the two can be successful. That message is not helped by a wilful disregard of facts.

profalseidol 8y ago
> Fascism is a direct descendent of Marxist socialism with class consciousness replaced by nationalism. Pure Nonsense. Fascism is simply extreme nationalism. It is believing that one's race is superior which makes you hate immigrants. Makes you build up walls to keep them out. This is born out of the constant exploitation of the capitalists. When the people stop believing the Capitalist lies, you start getting demagogues like Trump. This has nothing to do with Marx and Socialism. Just to repeat, Soviet Union and Communist China Vangaurdism has nothing to do with Worker-owned-and-directed enterprises. Soviet Union and Communist China is very different from Mondragon and John Lewis. Power is decentralized as much as possible. Managers and Executives (if needed) are only in power for a few months and is subject to call any time. Unlike today where C-level persons act like Feudal Lords.