22 ms·

Using the iPad Pro as my main computer

74 points by robin_reala 8y ago

tomcam 8y ago
Exactly the article I needed because I've been evaluating the same workflow. Metacomment: Dude is a gifted, working illustrator--and is colorblind!
fmfamaral 8y ago
This is becoming more and more tempting...
- robohoe 8y ago
  Having done it for non-work related code development and personal use past 3 weeks, I would recommend trying it. Not having a mouse may be cumbersome sometimes, but I’m starting to really get used to the touchscreen to the point that I almost find myself trying to touch my MBP’s screen. iPad Pro also supports the Smart Keyboard (which in itself is great to type on) as well as regular USB keyboards (with the Lightning/USB-C to USB adapter). I was able to use my Pok3r keyboard just fine. For shell access, definitely check out Blink. Even using VI isn’t bad as you can remap your `~ key to ESC. Most of my work is done remotely anyway. The only downsides are the occasional apps that don’t support full iPad screen scaling - so they appear like iPhone apps.
- p1necone 8y ago
  Out of curiosity what makes this more tempting for you than a laptop? Is it just the slightly better portability combined with it seemingly being "good enough" now for productivity work?
  - freehunter 8y ago
    I'm not the person you're asking, but I also have this dream. It's mainly the complexity of desktop software. The older I get (and the more responsibilities I have) the less I appreciate knobs and buttons and menu bars and the more I appreciate unified system notifications and "good enough" default settings and a full screen window with nothing behind (or in front) of it. If I need more, SSH exists. The limitations of a tablet form factor force UI designers to be thoughtful, and the limitations of iOS force app developers to all converge on the same solutions. I want my hardware and OS to just get out of my way so I can get my work done. Chromebooks and iPads get this right in my opinion. I feel like Android still gives me too much freedom, and I invariably always break something because I am an irresponsible child when I get bored. When I'm working, I want to think about my work, not about my OS or hardware.
    - nsxwolf 8y ago
      My problem is workflows that involve more than 3 apps. I just can't be productive when I am switching back and forth between apps and not able to see most everything at once.
      - freehunter 8y ago
        Workflows that involve more than 3 apps are exactly what I’d be trying to avoid with this setup :) Of course that’s still just a dream. But it is a beautiful dream for me.
  - robohoe 8y ago
    It’s the ability to instantaneously open up the iPad and have the screen available to me. I don’t have super lengthy workflows (max 2-3 apps at the same time) so ALT-TAB works perfectly fine for me. For those times when I really need to, I can always split screen.
- freehunter 8y ago
  Every few months I go and read this series over again: http://yieldthought.com/post/12239282034/swapped-my-macbook-for-an-ipad http://yieldthought.com/post/12239282034/swapped-my-macbook-... For me it's basically pornography: a beautiful fantasy that I love pretending is real but is actually completely unrealistic (at least in my case). The idea of ditching my laptop and traveling the city with a thin client, not caring if it breaks or gets corrupted because all the data is sitting somewhere up in the cloud, backed up and taken care of. No fans, no worries of processor power or RAM, incredibly flexible form factor, instant-on and everything full screen by default, notifications that just work and work in a unified and consistent way. No distractions, just zen working in a park with a fountain and a chocolate croissant. Problem is I do web development and app development, neither of which are terribly feasible on a tablet. A man can dream though. A man can dream.
  - komali2 8y ago
    I mean, it just comes down to OS at that point, yea? Why not get a turbo-thin ultra book and throw Ubuntu on it, then use cloud storage for everything? Could just SSH in as well. You could even install ubuntu on an android tablet. If what you want is the form factor and speedyness of solid state everything, you could get a tablet that isn't an ipad. Lenovo makes some that would be trivial to swap out for Ubuntu or whatever https://www.lenovo.com/us/en/tablets/c/TABLETS https://www.lenovo.com/us/en/tablets/c/TABLETS
    - freehunter 8y ago
      A big part of it is the zen. I love Linux and it powers my entire career as a server OS but it is anything but zen and I would never use it as a desktop OS.
cheschire 8y ago
Another article confirming iPad Pro is pretty good for graphics designers. Yep. Still not gonna code on it. My iPad Air is still good enough for my entertainment time, and my laptop is still better for coding.
csytan 8y ago
Having investigated this possibility as someone in the Apple ecosystem, I think Android might be ahead of iOS for web development. Reason? Browsers on iOS are crippled: no dev tools, no view as desktop, and no alternatives to Webkit. Another reason is no mouse support. Essentially you'd be using it as a very expensive thin client. What is intriguing about using Android is that you can actually install Ubuntu on your Android device: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v6eC-CH8UG4 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v6eC-CH8UG4
- zenbob 8y ago
  iOS has "Request Desktop Site" as an option in Safari. Is view as desktop something other than that?
  - mynameisvlad 8y ago
    I'd say it's equivalent, but not a fantastic option. I think all it does is send over a different user agent for a desktop browser. On responsive web sites, I just see the same thing with the feature on as with it off. On sites that redirect based on UA, I've seen it take me to the desktop page instead.
    - function_seven 8y ago
      I wish the "Request Desktop" option actually faked a typical screen size (say, 1280 x 800, 96dpi) and all the other attributes that would make a site think it's displaying on a desktop browser. It's frustrating to really want the desktop version, and have no way of doing that when the site is too "smart" for me. I know what I'm in for (lots of zooming and panning). For some sites, it's the only way to reach certain features that the site didn't include in their mobile version.
  - graeme 8y ago
    It doesn't work on a lot of sites. The user agent is still mobile safari, and web devs often have bugs for that browser in a larger screen form factor. Needs a desktop user agent.
- 8y ago
SpikeDad 8y ago
The biggest issue for me frankly (in the old days) was a lack of ad blocker. Now there's plenty of choices for iOS that are highly effective and so browsing on the web isn't a horror show. Still no real mouse support is annoying..
MagicPropmaker 8y ago
I have several surface computers. While they do have their issues, the "BSOD" he showed was not one of them. I've never had a BSOD on them.
- floren 8y ago
  My Surface Pro 3 never BSOD'd, it just frequently crashed the display driver. The screen would go unresponsive for 5-10 seconds, then it would redraw and pop up a little notification in the lower right saying the driver had crashed. The keyboard was also unpleasant to use, and the touchpad stopped clicking after a couple months.
- macjohnmcc 8y ago
  I've never had a BSOD on my Surface Pro 3 but I have had lots of issues where the rear upper right side of the case gets too warm to comfortably hold like a tablet.
- paulie_a 8y ago
  Back in the 90s I got a kick out of people claiming Macs don't crash. no they just routinely locked up where you literally had to pull the plug from the wall. but that doesn't count as a crash.
  - zerohp 8y ago
    Nobody with any credibility claimed that Macs don't crash pre-OSX (the 1990s). They crashed and froze all of the time. That's why everyone was begging for an all-new operating system.
- sahaskatta 8y ago
  The Surface Pro 4 he mentions in the article is 4 years old. It was released in 2015. Things are hopefully better since then with the 5th gen and 6th Surface Pro devices. I'm now on a Dell XPS 13, but the Surface Pro 4 I once had did definitely have plenty of bugs. I ended up getting my device swapped at least twice as it often would not wake up after being put to sleep.
ddoolin 8y ago
Discussion last week related to using an iPad Pro for development purposes: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=18820530 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=18820530
5_minutes 8y ago
As I got older, I started gaming less (or not at all anymore), and after alot of Mac bashing (14 years ago), and tired of installing Windows 93 every few months for every family member, a huge Apple adaptor: just because I want to get things done, work, get paid for that, and spend my free time not messing around with Window’s flaws. That’s biased, I know, things probably improved by now, but every time I picked up a MS tablet or was given one, I still felt it was wacky. That said, I now have all Apple stuff, even though I’m not a Apple fanboy: I just want my stuff to work and spent my free time with my wife and kids. This sums up that I have a Macbook Pro, Ipad Pro, and an iPhone. The Macbook Pro is imho, one of the worst products they ever made. Poor battery time, crappy keyboard, no escape key, the only nice thing about it is the screen. My iPad Pro, on the other hand... is a work of art. An incredibly good battery time (btw, battery time is also not just living on the battery, but also: working on it without a electricity socket). So it’s safe to assume that the Ipad’s are wayyy more energy friendly then the MBP’s. What I don’t understand about Apple is that even though the iPad’s are great machines: we need people to build software for them. So, traditional PCs (where we can connect 2-3 monitors to, etc) are still essential. I think Cooke forgot about that. Jobs, nomatter what - still kept developers in mind. I love my iPad, and am for regular browsing not using my overpriced MBP anymore. But to replace it? To get real work done? To have a “norton commander” like interface? I think it’s still along road to go to replace the traditional desktops. And btw, the Apple iMac’s are objectively good products, that’ll last a long time for a reasonable price. It’s painful to see Lenovo releasing these frequent up-to-date great hardware laptops, and Apple, with all their billions in the bank, doing a minimalistic effort on even upgrading the Mac Mini, Mac Pro, etc. Is it arrogance? Focus? Steve more awknoledging the coders, even in his own way? Either way, with many Chinese developers introducing new hard and software features (foldable phones, wireless charging) and Apple always being late to the game (but then executing it well). I wonder what their strategy is there for the moment. I know no-one of my family is going to put +1000$ for a new phone. To me, the biggest key Apple has is MacOS which is superior to any OS out there, in consistency and user-friendlyness for any end-user. Oh: and everything looks pretty and intuitive too. Even for my mom. I hope they step up their game and make things more dev friendly, otherwise it’ll be a open game, and really soon.
- busterarm 8y ago
zozbot123 8y ago
Hopefully, we will soon be able to use a tablet running the Linux desktop stack as a "main" computer. I can't stand iDevices or Chromebooks - they feel like they're running some Fisher-Price OS. Even plain vanilla AOSP is just barely usable. (I mean, with current solutions I have to go through local VNC just to get a sensible Linux desktop and apps. That's crazy)
- dredmorbius 8y ago
  Purim's Librem line: https://www.engadget.com/2016/05/19/purism-introduces-privacy-focused-2-in-1-tablet/ https://www.engadget.com/2016/05/19/purism-introduces-privac...
lostgame 8y ago
Until we have the ability to make iOS apps on-device, this will never be an option for a lot of folks it could be very useful for. I also repeatedly say that I’m waiting the day when the iPad Pro actually gets some Pro software - where is Logic ‘Pro’, my daily driver that keeps me locked to MacOS as much as xCode does. xCode and Logic Pro are the reasons I have a Mac at all.
- dankoss 8y ago
  Agreed, though have you seen Garageband on iOS lately? It has inherited quite a few features from Logic like the drummer, more customizable plugins / inserts, etc. Also, Cubasis and Auria are pretty powerful. Still not as powerful as Logic proper.
  - lintroller 8y ago
    Often, it isn't even just the "desktop" application itself but the associated workflow plugins that have to run on the iOS as well. For a lot of modern electronic music producers, tools like Serum are a must.
  - kingnight 8y ago
    GarageBand has a crazy/arbitrary limit on length of like 640 bars or 30 mins? I would have loved to use it to make a long mix of multiple tracks but that simple tasks butted up against that limit and I wasted so much time until I had to google this weird thing where it didn’t lengthen any further... wish audacity existed on the iPad.
  - lostgame 8y ago
    Yes...but it still lacks basic automation beyond Volume...is stuck to one BPM through the track and one time signature...even on an iPad Pro there's still only a 3-channel EQ...we don't have notation mode (which would be perfect for the Apple Pencil in Portrait!)...we don't have a sample/waveform editor or flex time/pitch...it's barely usable for me as a sketchpad, although it has improved drastically.
- baddox 8y ago
saagarjha 8y ago
> While the iPad provides enough develpoment possibilities enough for me (someone who is only using HTML CSS and JS) the sandboxed nature of the OS means you can’t run a local web server. You can't? I'm pretty sure that this is possible.
Marsymars 8y ago
My particular blocker for using an iPad (Pro) as a (non-development) PC is that none of the messaging apps I use (SMS on Android, WhatsApp, Signal) have iPad versions, so even though I've got a perfectly functional iPad with keyboard in front of me, I have to use phone or PC/Mac for messaging.
- kortilla 8y ago
  Doesn’t the messenger app for iPhone sync to all of your apple devices?
  - Marsymars 8y ago
    Yes (for SMS and iMessage), but I don't have an iPhone, so there's nothing for my iPad to sync to.
- baby 8y ago
  pro-tip: you can use whatsapp web by requesting the web version (long press on the refresh button). I think this is a good excuse to be productive on that platform though.
- kitsunesoba 8y ago
  It’s really quite ridiculous that neither WhatsApp or Signal have iPad support. The way their UIs are arranged, they could have iPad support for nearly free if they used UISplitView. There’s absolutely no excuse, especially in WhatsApp’s case.
baby 8y ago
I've seen more and more people using this instead of a graphic tablet. That sounds really interesting to me as the Cintiq are quite overpriced if you're not a professional.
dredmorbius 8y ago
Is there anything resembling Termux or other Linux userland environment for iPad? Otherwise, I'm holding out for Purism's Librem tablets.
umeshunni 8y ago
I've noticed that many photographers are switching to use iPad Pros (or even regular iPads) as their main computers. With shoots that happen on location, mobility becomes important and the ability to show clients a quick preview of the shoot right after it happens makes mobile devices ideal for many photography usecases. Now Adobe has launched a preview of the 'full' Photoshop and Lightroom CC on the iPad Pro (https://www.theverge.com/2018/10/15/17969754/adobe-photoshop-apple-ipad-creative-cloud https://www.theverge.com/2018/10/15/17969754/adobe-photoshop...) and this makes the entire workflow very smooth. Even as a 'prosumer' photographer, I've started using my iPad to download and do quick ratings and edits on a flight back from a shoot rather than waiting for days till I get back to my desktop or carrying a heavy Macbook/Air around to a location. The real killer here was Adobe's ability to store raw images in the cloud and sync edits made on different clients.
- bigdubs 8y ago
  My macbook pro is not much extra size / weight above an iPad, and my workflow (lightroom for canon, capture one for fuji) is hard to recreate on iOS anyway. The uses for the iPad on shoots I totally get is if you're Mike Kelley and you need to check that flash fills could be composed into a final image for architecture stuff. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S0WKNYObucY https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S0WKNYObucY
- 21 8y ago
  Is the fact that iPad has a touchscreen, unlike the Macbook a factor?
tbrock 8y ago
I don’t understand people’s fascination with this. The MacBook is more powerful and basically the same size with a keyboard.
- pxeboot 8y ago
  Regardless of the usefulness to you, it would show Apple's commitment to making the iPad a serious tool instead of just a consumption device. It would also be a huge win for schools with large iPad deployments.
- tluyben2 8y ago
  As the big iPad Pro yes; I like the small iPad Pro a lot more though. A lot of people I know, including me, find it incredible Apple stopped making the small MacBook air. Besides the worthless screen, I thought that was a perfect on the road dev laptop. I got great battery life out of it (unlike my current MBP) and it was fast enough to do dev. The current 12 inch MB is not really nice for dev and too big for me, so a lot of times when I have to travel short times, I bring my iPad Pro only. It is definitely not perfect but it works for most things I have to do on the road.
- falcolas 8y ago
  The capabilities and utility of the pencil and a touch screen can't be underestimated for those whose work involves drawing.
deleted 8y ago
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graeme 8y ago
If anyone has rsi issues, I've found the ipad very helpful. The apple pencil is a great input device, and I use anker bluetooth ipad keyboard that I find very comfortable and ergonomic. I have a stand I can put my ipad in to raise it up in desk mode, but it's often just in my lap. Got me through a rough period of rsi, and the 120 hz screen was a joy. I didn't do all my work on it, but it let me heavily reduce my computer usage. Now that I've fixed the rsi and got a better mouse, I'm going to go back to a mac for most stuff. All the little frictions in safari on ios are starting to annoy me: it's hard to manage webapps for my business there. But I'm going to keep using the ipad pro. I have a few drawing/video recording workflows where it is the main device, and it is a good admin device when I'm not at the computer. Will also be getting a better computer monitor and computer. The ipad's screen, 120 hz refresh rate, and fast, fanless performance have spoiled me. Those factors are part of why I kept using the ipad even though it was worse at some tasks. (It's also better at others, to be clear)
- jjw1414 8y ago
  I'm glad to hear that your rsi was helped by using the iPad Pro as a (near) laptop replacement. I, too, suffer from some form of rsi in my left hand (i.e. not my mouse hand) and was wondering what other steps you took to "fix" your rsi. Was it mainly due to the reduced use of a keyboard with the iPad, or did you take other actions at the same time? Thanks for the great review of the pros and cons of your experience.
  - ianai 8y ago
    Switching to a tackball did the most good for my wrists and forearms. I also bought the curved kinesis keyboard. It takes a while to,get used to the kinesis key layout, but now that I have I type insanely fast on it.
    - jjw1414 8y ago
      Thanks very much. I'll look into the Kinesis keyboard. I have a Microsoft Natural Ergonomic Keyboard 4000 connected to my MacBook Pro right now, but the design of the Kinesis looks interesting. My non-mouse hand (left) is the issue, but perhaps I will think of switching to a trackball as a preventative measure for my right hand. Fiftieth B'day coming up next month - don't get old! (actually, it's not that bad - yet).
karmakaze 8y ago
I had some time to kill and stopped by a Microsoft store to check out the Surface Go 10" 8GB. It was surprisingly usable and the pen digitizer had low latency, perhaps not quite as low as the iPad Pros but good enough not to feel laggy. I kept on the lookout for an Android tablet for light work on-the-go but the Surface-Go hits the mark much better. I would also be interested in a similarly size/weight laptop but they tend to be much lower quality and performance at that size. The MacBook/Air is close, more expensive and I don't like the keyboard at all.
- sahaskatta 8y ago
  I got both an iPad Pro LTE and a Surface GO LTE. My simple experience: * Surface Go: You can do pretty much anything on this device. There's no software limitations, but it may just take a while as the performance is just slow. * iPad Pro: It's really speedy. Everything is smooth and quick, however there's too many things that iOS just can't do. Apple makes a lot of complex things easy to do, but they also manage to make some very easy things very difficult.
howlingfantods 8y ago
I've been drawing digitally for around 15 years, starting with the original Wacom tablets. For drawing, my iPad Pro (2018) with the Pencil 2 feels like magic. In my experience, its latency is much better than the Cintiq or the Surface. It feels so much like drawing on paper, especially with a matte screen cover. Every time I use it to draw, I feel like I'm living in the future. No piece of technology has impressed me to this degree. That being said, outside of digital art, it's pretty clunky. The lack of a mouse pointer and proper multitasking makes it less than ideal for business uses. But when I'm drawing on it though, man, I feel like Tom Cruise in Minority Report
rcarmo 8y ago
I’ve been working on iPads for years now, largely for sysadmin and back-end dev stuff. A lot of the pains go away when you remote to someplace (and in some cases, you can use a Citrix X1 mouse with your iPad), but in general the pains are: - Lack of a permanent “desktop mode” setting in the browser (the engine can handle it, it’s just the defaults that suck) - Lack of an official CLI (there are a few stabs at that, some quite creative, but all third-party). There is no lack of excellent SSH/mosh/VNC/RDP apps, which for me is enough. - Lack of a way to background _anything_ (you can run a local web server in Pythonista and some editors, but it’s always a pain) - Lack of a filesystem (apps like WorkingCopy mostly fixed that for doing git and use external editors, and iCloud Drive sort of nearly works as advertised, but sandboxing breaks things across apps) That said, I manage to do quite a lot of sysadmining/writing/prototyping on an iPad, and it is still my “most personal” computer, but if I did front-end development, I’d be severely annoyed. (I carry a Surface Pro 4 for work and love it, but I keep corporate work and pro bono/personal stuff apart) Also, on a personal note, the music production ecosystem on iOS is nothing short of amazing, so if you have creative hobbies, the iPad is a pretty solid choice for leveraging technology without the hassles of a regular computer.

74 points by robin_reala 8y ago

Exactly the article I needed because I've been evaluating the same workflow. Metacomment: Dude is a gifted, working illustrator--and is colorblind!

fmfamaral 8y ago

This is becoming more and more tempting...

robohoe 8y ago
Having done it for non-work related code development and personal use past 3 weeks, I would recommend trying it. Not having a mouse may be cumbersome sometimes, but I’m starting to really get used to the touchscreen to the point that I almost find myself trying to touch my MBP’s screen. iPad Pro also supports the Smart Keyboard (which in itself is great to type on) as well as regular USB keyboards (with the Lightning/USB-C to USB adapter). I was able to use my Pok3r keyboard just fine. For shell access, definitely check out Blink. Even using VI isn’t bad as you can remap your `~ key to ESC. Most of my work is done remotely anyway. The only downsides are the occasional apps that don’t support full iPad screen scaling - so they appear like iPhone apps.
p1necone 8y ago
Out of curiosity what makes this more tempting for you than a laptop? Is it just the slightly better portability combined with it seemingly being "good enough" now for productivity work?
- freehunter 8y ago
  I'm not the person you're asking, but I also have this dream. It's mainly the complexity of desktop software. The older I get (and the more responsibilities I have) the less I appreciate knobs and buttons and menu bars and the more I appreciate unified system notifications and "good enough" default settings and a full screen window with nothing behind (or in front) of it. If I need more, SSH exists. The limitations of a tablet form factor force UI designers to be thoughtful, and the limitations of iOS force app developers to all converge on the same solutions. I want my hardware and OS to just get out of my way so I can get my work done. Chromebooks and iPads get this right in my opinion. I feel like Android still gives me too much freedom, and I invariably always break something because I am an irresponsible child when I get bored. When I'm working, I want to think about my work, not about my OS or hardware.
  - nsxwolf 8y ago
    My problem is workflows that involve more than 3 apps. I just can't be productive when I am switching back and forth between apps and not able to see most everything at once.
    - freehunter 8y ago
      Workflows that involve more than 3 apps are exactly what I’d be trying to avoid with this setup :) Of course that’s still just a dream. But it is a beautiful dream for me.
- robohoe 8y ago
  It’s the ability to instantaneously open up the iPad and have the screen available to me. I don’t have super lengthy workflows (max 2-3 apps at the same time) so ALT-TAB works perfectly fine for me. For those times when I really need to, I can always split screen.
freehunter 8y ago
Every few months I go and read this series over again: http://yieldthought.com/post/12239282034/swapped-my-macbook-for-an-ipad http://yieldthought.com/post/12239282034/swapped-my-macbook-... For me it's basically pornography: a beautiful fantasy that I love pretending is real but is actually completely unrealistic (at least in my case). The idea of ditching my laptop and traveling the city with a thin client, not caring if it breaks or gets corrupted because all the data is sitting somewhere up in the cloud, backed up and taken care of. No fans, no worries of processor power or RAM, incredibly flexible form factor, instant-on and everything full screen by default, notifications that just work and work in a unified and consistent way. No distractions, just zen working in a park with a fountain and a chocolate croissant. Problem is I do web development and app development, neither of which are terribly feasible on a tablet. A man can dream though. A man can dream.
- komali2 8y ago
  I mean, it just comes down to OS at that point, yea? Why not get a turbo-thin ultra book and throw Ubuntu on it, then use cloud storage for everything? Could just SSH in as well. You could even install ubuntu on an android tablet. If what you want is the form factor and speedyness of solid state everything, you could get a tablet that isn't an ipad. Lenovo makes some that would be trivial to swap out for Ubuntu or whatever https://www.lenovo.com/us/en/tablets/c/TABLETS https://www.lenovo.com/us/en/tablets/c/TABLETS
  - freehunter 8y ago
    A big part of it is the zen. I love Linux and it powers my entire career as a server OS but it is anything but zen and I would never use it as a desktop OS.

cheschire 8y ago

Another article confirming iPad Pro is pretty good for graphics designers. Yep. Still not gonna code on it. My iPad Air is still good enough for my entertainment time, and my laptop is still better for coding.

csytan 8y ago

Having investigated this possibility as someone in the Apple ecosystem, I think Android might be ahead of iOS for web development. Reason? Browsers on iOS are crippled: no dev tools, no view as desktop, and no alternatives to Webkit. Another reason is no mouse support. Essentially you'd be using it as a very expensive thin client. What is intriguing about using Android is that you can actually install Ubuntu on your Android device: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v6eC-CH8UG4 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v6eC-CH8UG4

zenbob 8y ago
iOS has "Request Desktop Site" as an option in Safari. Is view as desktop something other than that?
- mynameisvlad 8y ago
  I'd say it's equivalent, but not a fantastic option. I think all it does is send over a different user agent for a desktop browser. On responsive web sites, I just see the same thing with the feature on as with it off. On sites that redirect based on UA, I've seen it take me to the desktop page instead.
  - function_seven 8y ago
    I wish the "Request Desktop" option actually faked a typical screen size (say, 1280 x 800, 96dpi) and all the other attributes that would make a site think it's displaying on a desktop browser. It's frustrating to really want the desktop version, and have no way of doing that when the site is too "smart" for me. I know what I'm in for (lots of zooming and panning). For some sites, it's the only way to reach certain features that the site didn't include in their mobile version.
- graeme 8y ago
  It doesn't work on a lot of sites. The user agent is still mobile safari, and web devs often have bugs for that browser in a larger screen form factor. Needs a desktop user agent.
8y ago

SpikeDad 8y ago

The biggest issue for me frankly (in the old days) was a lack of ad blocker. Now there's plenty of choices for iOS that are highly effective and so browsing on the web isn't a horror show. Still no real mouse support is annoying..

MagicPropmaker 8y ago

I have several surface computers. While they do have their issues, the "BSOD" he showed was not one of them. I've never had a BSOD on them.

floren 8y ago
My Surface Pro 3 never BSOD'd, it just frequently crashed the display driver. The screen would go unresponsive for 5-10 seconds, then it would redraw and pop up a little notification in the lower right saying the driver had crashed. The keyboard was also unpleasant to use, and the touchpad stopped clicking after a couple months.
macjohnmcc 8y ago
I've never had a BSOD on my Surface Pro 3 but I have had lots of issues where the rear upper right side of the case gets too warm to comfortably hold like a tablet.
paulie_a 8y ago
Back in the 90s I got a kick out of people claiming Macs don't crash. no they just routinely locked up where you literally had to pull the plug from the wall. but that doesn't count as a crash.
- zerohp 8y ago
  Nobody with any credibility claimed that Macs don't crash pre-OSX (the 1990s). They crashed and froze all of the time. That's why everyone was begging for an all-new operating system.
sahaskatta 8y ago
The Surface Pro 4 he mentions in the article is 4 years old. It was released in 2015. Things are hopefully better since then with the 5th gen and 6th Surface Pro devices. I'm now on a Dell XPS 13, but the Surface Pro 4 I once had did definitely have plenty of bugs. I ended up getting my device swapped at least twice as it often would not wake up after being put to sleep.

ddoolin 8y ago

Discussion last week related to using an iPad Pro for development purposes: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=18820530 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=18820530

5_minutes 8y ago

As I got older, I started gaming less (or not at all anymore), and after alot of Mac bashing (14 years ago), and tired of installing Windows 93 every few months for every family member, a huge Apple adaptor: just because I want to get things done, work, get paid for that, and spend my free time not messing around with Window’s flaws. That’s biased, I know, things probably improved by now, but every time I picked up a MS tablet or was given one, I still felt it was wacky. That said, I now have all Apple stuff, even though I’m not a Apple fanboy: I just want my stuff to work and spent my free time with my wife and kids. This sums up that I have a Macbook Pro, Ipad Pro, and an iPhone. The Macbook Pro is imho, one of the worst products they ever made. Poor battery time, crappy keyboard, no escape key, the only nice thing about it is the screen. My iPad Pro, on the other hand... is a work of art. An incredibly good battery time (btw, battery time is also not just living on the battery, but also: working on it without a electricity socket). So it’s safe to assume that the Ipad’s are wayyy more energy friendly then the MBP’s. What I don’t understand about Apple is that even though the iPad’s are great machines: we need people to build software for them. So, traditional PCs (where we can connect 2-3 monitors to, etc) are still essential. I think Cooke forgot about that. Jobs, nomatter what - still kept developers in mind. I love my iPad, and am for regular browsing not using my overpriced MBP anymore. But to replace it? To get real work done? To have a “norton commander” like interface? I think it’s still along road to go to replace the traditional desktops. And btw, the Apple iMac’s are objectively good products, that’ll last a long time for a reasonable price. It’s painful to see Lenovo releasing these frequent up-to-date great hardware laptops, and Apple, with all their billions in the bank, doing a minimalistic effort on even upgrading the Mac Mini, Mac Pro, etc. Is it arrogance? Focus? Steve more awknoledging the coders, even in his own way? Either way, with many Chinese developers introducing new hard and software features (foldable phones, wireless charging) and Apple always being late to the game (but then executing it well). I wonder what their strategy is there for the moment. I know no-one of my family is going to put +1000$ for a new phone. To me, the biggest key Apple has is MacOS which is superior to any OS out there, in consistency and user-friendlyness for any end-user. Oh: and everything looks pretty and intuitive too. Even for my mom. I hope they step up their game and make things more dev friendly, otherwise it’ll be a open game, and really soon.

busterarm 8y ago

zozbot123 8y ago

Hopefully, we will soon be able to use a tablet running the Linux desktop stack as a "main" computer. I can't stand iDevices or Chromebooks - they feel like they're running some Fisher-Price OS. Even plain vanilla AOSP is just barely usable. (I mean, with current solutions I have to go through local VNC just to get a sensible Linux desktop and apps. That's crazy)

dredmorbius 8y ago
Purim's Librem line: https://www.engadget.com/2016/05/19/purism-introduces-privacy-focused-2-in-1-tablet/ https://www.engadget.com/2016/05/19/purism-introduces-privac...

lostgame 8y ago

Until we have the ability to make iOS apps on-device, this will never be an option for a lot of folks it could be very useful for. I also repeatedly say that I’m waiting the day when the iPad Pro actually gets some Pro software - where is Logic ‘Pro’, my daily driver that keeps me locked to MacOS as much as xCode does. xCode and Logic Pro are the reasons I have a Mac at all.

dankoss 8y ago
Agreed, though have you seen Garageband on iOS lately? It has inherited quite a few features from Logic like the drummer, more customizable plugins / inserts, etc. Also, Cubasis and Auria are pretty powerful. Still not as powerful as Logic proper.
- lintroller 8y ago
  Often, it isn't even just the "desktop" application itself but the associated workflow plugins that have to run on the iOS as well. For a lot of modern electronic music producers, tools like Serum are a must.
- kingnight 8y ago
  GarageBand has a crazy/arbitrary limit on length of like 640 bars or 30 mins? I would have loved to use it to make a long mix of multiple tracks but that simple tasks butted up against that limit and I wasted so much time until I had to google this weird thing where it didn’t lengthen any further... wish audacity existed on the iPad.
- lostgame 8y ago
  Yes...but it still lacks basic automation beyond Volume...is stuck to one BPM through the track and one time signature...even on an iPad Pro there's still only a 3-channel EQ...we don't have notation mode (which would be perfect for the Apple Pencil in Portrait!)...we don't have a sample/waveform editor or flex time/pitch...it's barely usable for me as a sketchpad, although it has improved drastically.
baddox 8y ago

saagarjha 8y ago

> While the iPad provides enough develpoment possibilities enough for me (someone who is only using HTML CSS and JS) the sandboxed nature of the OS means you can’t run a local web server. You can't? I'm pretty sure that this is possible.

Marsymars 8y ago

My particular blocker for using an iPad (Pro) as a (non-development) PC is that none of the messaging apps I use (SMS on Android, WhatsApp, Signal) have iPad versions, so even though I've got a perfectly functional iPad with keyboard in front of me, I have to use phone or PC/Mac for messaging.

kortilla 8y ago
Doesn’t the messenger app for iPhone sync to all of your apple devices?
- Marsymars 8y ago
  Yes (for SMS and iMessage), but I don't have an iPhone, so there's nothing for my iPad to sync to.
baby 8y ago
pro-tip: you can use whatsapp web by requesting the web version (long press on the refresh button). I think this is a good excuse to be productive on that platform though.
kitsunesoba 8y ago
It’s really quite ridiculous that neither WhatsApp or Signal have iPad support. The way their UIs are arranged, they could have iPad support for nearly free if they used UISplitView. There’s absolutely no excuse, especially in WhatsApp’s case.

baby 8y ago

I've seen more and more people using this instead of a graphic tablet. That sounds really interesting to me as the Cintiq are quite overpriced if you're not a professional.

dredmorbius 8y ago

Is there anything resembling Termux or other Linux userland environment for iPad? Otherwise, I'm holding out for Purism's Librem tablets.

umeshunni 8y ago

I've noticed that many photographers are switching to use iPad Pros (or even regular iPads) as their main computers. With shoots that happen on location, mobility becomes important and the ability to show clients a quick preview of the shoot right after it happens makes mobile devices ideal for many photography usecases. Now Adobe has launched a preview of the 'full' Photoshop and Lightroom CC on the iPad Pro (https://www.theverge.com/2018/10/15/17969754/adobe-photoshop-apple-ipad-creative-cloud https://www.theverge.com/2018/10/15/17969754/adobe-photoshop...) and this makes the entire workflow very smooth. Even as a 'prosumer' photographer, I've started using my iPad to download and do quick ratings and edits on a flight back from a shoot rather than waiting for days till I get back to my desktop or carrying a heavy Macbook/Air around to a location. The real killer here was Adobe's ability to store raw images in the cloud and sync edits made on different clients.

bigdubs 8y ago
My macbook pro is not much extra size / weight above an iPad, and my workflow (lightroom for canon, capture one for fuji) is hard to recreate on iOS anyway. The uses for the iPad on shoots I totally get is if you're Mike Kelley and you need to check that flash fills could be composed into a final image for architecture stuff. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S0WKNYObucY https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S0WKNYObucY
21 8y ago
Is the fact that iPad has a touchscreen, unlike the Macbook a factor?

tbrock 8y ago

I don’t understand people’s fascination with this. The MacBook is more powerful and basically the same size with a keyboard.

pxeboot 8y ago
Regardless of the usefulness to you, it would show Apple's commitment to making the iPad a serious tool instead of just a consumption device. It would also be a huge win for schools with large iPad deployments.
tluyben2 8y ago
As the big iPad Pro yes; I like the small iPad Pro a lot more though. A lot of people I know, including me, find it incredible Apple stopped making the small MacBook air. Besides the worthless screen, I thought that was a perfect on the road dev laptop. I got great battery life out of it (unlike my current MBP) and it was fast enough to do dev. The current 12 inch MB is not really nice for dev and too big for me, so a lot of times when I have to travel short times, I bring my iPad Pro only. It is definitely not perfect but it works for most things I have to do on the road.
falcolas 8y ago
The capabilities and utility of the pencil and a touch screen can't be underestimated for those whose work involves drawing.

deleted 8y ago

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graeme 8y ago

If anyone has rsi issues, I've found the ipad very helpful. The apple pencil is a great input device, and I use anker bluetooth ipad keyboard that I find very comfortable and ergonomic. I have a stand I can put my ipad in to raise it up in desk mode, but it's often just in my lap. Got me through a rough period of rsi, and the 120 hz screen was a joy. I didn't do all my work on it, but it let me heavily reduce my computer usage. Now that I've fixed the rsi and got a better mouse, I'm going to go back to a mac for most stuff. All the little frictions in safari on ios are starting to annoy me: it's hard to manage webapps for my business there. But I'm going to keep using the ipad pro. I have a few drawing/video recording workflows where it is the main device, and it is a good admin device when I'm not at the computer. Will also be getting a better computer monitor and computer. The ipad's screen, 120 hz refresh rate, and fast, fanless performance have spoiled me. Those factors are part of why I kept using the ipad even though it was worse at some tasks. (It's also better at others, to be clear)

jjw1414 8y ago
I'm glad to hear that your rsi was helped by using the iPad Pro as a (near) laptop replacement. I, too, suffer from some form of rsi in my left hand (i.e. not my mouse hand) and was wondering what other steps you took to "fix" your rsi. Was it mainly due to the reduced use of a keyboard with the iPad, or did you take other actions at the same time? Thanks for the great review of the pros and cons of your experience.
- ianai 8y ago
  Switching to a tackball did the most good for my wrists and forearms. I also bought the curved kinesis keyboard. It takes a while to,get used to the kinesis key layout, but now that I have I type insanely fast on it.
  - jjw1414 8y ago
    Thanks very much. I'll look into the Kinesis keyboard. I have a Microsoft Natural Ergonomic Keyboard 4000 connected to my MacBook Pro right now, but the design of the Kinesis looks interesting. My non-mouse hand (left) is the issue, but perhaps I will think of switching to a trackball as a preventative measure for my right hand. Fiftieth B'day coming up next month - don't get old! (actually, it's not that bad - yet).

karmakaze 8y ago

I had some time to kill and stopped by a Microsoft store to check out the Surface Go 10" 8GB. It was surprisingly usable and the pen digitizer had low latency, perhaps not quite as low as the iPad Pros but good enough not to feel laggy. I kept on the lookout for an Android tablet for light work on-the-go but the Surface-Go hits the mark much better. I would also be interested in a similarly size/weight laptop but they tend to be much lower quality and performance at that size. The MacBook/Air is close, more expensive and I don't like the keyboard at all.

sahaskatta 8y ago
I got both an iPad Pro LTE and a Surface GO LTE. My simple experience: * Surface Go: You can do pretty much anything on this device. There's no software limitations, but it may just take a while as the performance is just slow. * iPad Pro: It's really speedy. Everything is smooth and quick, however there's too many things that iOS just can't do. Apple makes a lot of complex things easy to do, but they also manage to make some very easy things very difficult.

howlingfantods 8y ago

I've been drawing digitally for around 15 years, starting with the original Wacom tablets. For drawing, my iPad Pro (2018) with the Pencil 2 feels like magic. In my experience, its latency is much better than the Cintiq or the Surface. It feels so much like drawing on paper, especially with a matte screen cover. Every time I use it to draw, I feel like I'm living in the future. No piece of technology has impressed me to this degree. That being said, outside of digital art, it's pretty clunky. The lack of a mouse pointer and proper multitasking makes it less than ideal for business uses. But when I'm drawing on it though, man, I feel like Tom Cruise in Minority Report

rcarmo 8y ago

I’ve been working on iPads for years now, largely for sysadmin and back-end dev stuff. A lot of the pains go away when you remote to someplace (and in some cases, you can use a Citrix X1 mouse with your iPad), but in general the pains are: - Lack of a permanent “desktop mode” setting in the browser (the engine can handle it, it’s just the defaults that suck) - Lack of an official CLI (there are a few stabs at that, some quite creative, but all third-party). There is no lack of excellent SSH/mosh/VNC/RDP apps, which for me is enough. - Lack of a way to background _anything_ (you can run a local web server in Pythonista and some editors, but it’s always a pain) - Lack of a filesystem (apps like WorkingCopy mostly fixed that for doing git and use external editors, and iCloud Drive sort of nearly works as advertised, but sandboxing breaks things across apps) That said, I manage to do quite a lot of sysadmining/writing/prototyping on an iPad, and it is still my “most personal” computer, but if I did front-end development, I’d be severely annoyed. (I carry a Surface Pro 4 for work and love it, but I keep corporate work and pro bono/personal stuff apart) Also, on a personal note, the music production ecosystem on iOS is nothing short of amazing, so if you have creative hobbies, the iPad is a pretty solid choice for leveraging technology without the hassles of a regular computer.