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Something I've been thinking about lately and I think I've come to consider the optimum to be genuinely happy with the defaults. As someone who has moved aroun

Something I've been thinking about lately and I think I've come to consider the optimum to be genuinely happy with the defaults. As someone who has moved around a lot, tried different things, different jobs, I look at the people who never left their home towns, still have the same friends who are far from perfect and far fewer, and they seem no less happy living day to day than the people I know who moved to a place they 'love', got a great job and do scubaing, skiing and general traveling months out of the year. There is something about adaptability that make humans strong. Getting a severe illness people still tend to revert to being just as happy as before after a few years, though the condition remains. Winning the lottery doesn't improve your happiness since you revert to the same baseline in the same amount of time. Those of us who move around are some kind of seeker looking to improve, but the environment might not be unfit for us and if we had another persons mentality we would be just as happy where we are as we will be in our optimal place.

keiferski 8y ago
The people that are happy with living in their hometowns are generally the kind of people that, for one reason or another, aren't the personality type that seeks optimization, expansion or novel experiences. At least that's in my experience - I grew up in the middle of nowhere and had very little in common with most of the people around me. The Internet quite literally saved me. It made me realize that the world is truly a vast place, and that I wasn't just "broken" because I wasn't happy in my current situation.
- tapland 8y ago
  Yes. I'm just thinking about the author of the article. It might be an error to assume that people living the default would be happier or better off finding their love for surfing. Those who seek would assume that was true, but that might be because they are a different kind of person. I feel that I'm hitting a language barrier (English is a secondary language) trying to explain what I mean. I'll see if I can explain my thoughts better later.
  - TeMPOraL 8y ago
    I think there's an implicit assumption - perhaps not even consciously realized by the author himself - that people in his audience wouldn't be reading a self-help blog and commenting on their problems if they were the kind of people who are happy with the defaults. There's a huge self-selection happening here - as is with many "personal growth-based"[0] communities, including HN. Most people from tech industry I've met in the meatspace are entirely unlike the people I meet on HN. -- [0] - There's something that I can't quite name that is shared by places like that blog, HN, some subreddits, SlateStarCodex and many other places. The common desire of wanting to get better at things, gain greater understanding of the world and the systems that run within it. Some people come with curiosity, other with strong will of Tsuyoku naritai - but out of the contributors I've seen around the non-shitposting web, it's hard to find people satisfied with status quo.
  - ball_of_lint 8y ago
    I'd say that's well said. I feel like I'm very different from my friends who have stayed in our hometown. We're still working hard to remain good friends and they're excellent people, but we have different drives and needs.
    - dorchadas 8y ago
      I'm one of those who moved back to my small rural hometown after going to a private top-20 school 6 hours away. It was a culture shock returning, and even the worldview of my roommate, who's been a good friend since birth, is so unnatural and foreign to me. He doesn't want new experiences and is just content to work and sit around in the hopes that he might do something when he retires. He wants to get married, but also won't put himself out there to meet people outside of church. That said, my closest friends here all also went away and came back (one works at his sister's law firm; the other two are both fairly well off with freelancing, inherited a home, etc), and the difference in their view from those who stayed is truly fascinating. I wish more people from this town would leave and see what the world has to offer, realize it's so different. I truly want to get out again, and it's taking its toll on me mentally for sure.
rhn_mk1 8y ago
Is being happy the goal we should be satisfied with though? The adaptability has both a good and a bad side. We become happy, but we become complacent. I am hoping that most humans value being a good person as much as being happy. Settling just on happiness doesn't take into account striving for higher values. I think that's what the article is saying in a roundabout way: we should not be self-satisfied, but instead actively try to improve ourselves to become closer to the ideals we want to represent.
- tapland 8y ago
  I agree, but I think that a lot of people seek happiness and not much else.
- justaguyhere 8y ago
  we should not be self-satisfied, but instead actively try to improve ourselves Two things I don't understand about this statement - first is the use of the word "should". Why should someone tell me what I should or shouldn't do (as long as whatever I do isn't impacting others negatively)? second, what is wrong with people who are just plain happy with the way they are and don't find any reason to try new things or "improve"? To be clear, I am not for or against trying to improve one's life. IMHO, each person should be left to decide for themselves and not pressured to "improve". A person isn't inferior if they aren't trying to make more money, run faster, play the piano better or whatever, and they are just happy the way they are.
  - rhn_mk1 8y ago
    I could rephrase that sentence to answer your first question: > It's not logically consistent to remain stagnant while self-satisfied if you have goals beyond that. I used "should" not to express an obligation to someone else, but to yourself. As to what's wrong with people who don't find any reason to improve: In their frame of reference, there's nothing wrong with them. That's why I said: > improve ourselves to become closer to the ideals we want to represent. If someone has no ideal they want to represent, then nothing I said applies to them. I personally disagree with what you said here though: > A person isn't inferior if they aren't trying to make more money, run faster, play the piano better or whatever, and they are just happy the way they are. People live in the context of society, and the world they are creating. There's no unbinding oneself from the consequences of one's actions, the same way every act of consumption creates a footprint and cost to the world that we share with others. I think settling on one's own happiness is a low bar to clear, and failing to strive to leave our legacy better for others is a short-sightedness that leads to crises, best represented by the global warming. Of course, people are being left to decide what they think they should be doing for their lives, but I hope we can agree that there exists a view in which they would be reasonably condemned.
kiba 8y ago
Maybe my fitness and health goal isn't going to make me more happy, but instead I am aiming for greater "well-being". At least that's what I am telling myself trying to work on a healthy diet and getting exercises. We'll see in six months.
- Cthulhu_ 8y ago
  It works / worked for me, and I've never been particularly obese, just unfit due to sitting on my arse all day. Just being able to walk with a bit more confidence, to open doors without having to shoulder them open, to lean down and tie my shoes without putting it up on a bench, going for short sprints or up stairs without getting winded, are all small but great changes. But they take time. It won't be an overnight change; you need to make a new habit (and unlearn others), and stick with them for six months. Don't try and change it all in one go.
- ip26 8y ago
  Yeah, I can understand the debate about hedonic adaptation as it relates to hobbies and wealth- what's the point if your happiness is the same- but whether or not my happiness remains the same, I cannot accept the idea that fitness, health, and wellbeing are thus not worthwhile pursuits.
bartread 8y ago
I think this might be a case of something like "hedonic adaptation". Nick Shabazz has an interesting video talking about this with respect to collecting gear that's worth a watch: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zuwCTi2DbBc&t=10s https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zuwCTi2DbBc&t=10s. The short version is that "better" becomes the new "normal", but it doesn't necessarily make us happier. I guess this may also be part of the reason why issues such as privilege and entitlement can manifest themselves, and start causing problems.
aaron695 8y ago
> Winning the lottery doesn't improve your happiness Not true at all, the evidence is conclusive it does make you happier. Maybe you are thinking of people who don't win the lottery but play it?

keiferski 8y ago

The people that are happy with living in their hometowns are generally the kind of people that, for one reason or another, aren't the personality type that seeks optimization, expansion or novel experiences. At least that's in my experience - I grew up in the middle of nowhere and had very little in common with most of the people around me. The Internet quite literally saved me. It made me realize that the world is truly a vast place, and that I wasn't just "broken" because I wasn't happy in my current situation.

tapland 8y ago
Yes. I'm just thinking about the author of the article. It might be an error to assume that people living the default would be happier or better off finding their love for surfing. Those who seek would assume that was true, but that might be because they are a different kind of person. I feel that I'm hitting a language barrier (English is a secondary language) trying to explain what I mean. I'll see if I can explain my thoughts better later.
- TeMPOraL 8y ago
  I think there's an implicit assumption - perhaps not even consciously realized by the author himself - that people in his audience wouldn't be reading a self-help blog and commenting on their problems if they were the kind of people who are happy with the defaults. There's a huge self-selection happening here - as is with many "personal growth-based"[0] communities, including HN. Most people from tech industry I've met in the meatspace are entirely unlike the people I meet on HN. -- [0] - There's something that I can't quite name that is shared by places like that blog, HN, some subreddits, SlateStarCodex and many other places. The common desire of wanting to get better at things, gain greater understanding of the world and the systems that run within it. Some people come with curiosity, other with strong will of Tsuyoku naritai - but out of the contributors I've seen around the non-shitposting web, it's hard to find people satisfied with status quo.
- ball_of_lint 8y ago
  I'd say that's well said. I feel like I'm very different from my friends who have stayed in our hometown. We're still working hard to remain good friends and they're excellent people, but we have different drives and needs.
  - dorchadas 8y ago
    I'm one of those who moved back to my small rural hometown after going to a private top-20 school 6 hours away. It was a culture shock returning, and even the worldview of my roommate, who's been a good friend since birth, is so unnatural and foreign to me. He doesn't want new experiences and is just content to work and sit around in the hopes that he might do something when he retires. He wants to get married, but also won't put himself out there to meet people outside of church. That said, my closest friends here all also went away and came back (one works at his sister's law firm; the other two are both fairly well off with freelancing, inherited a home, etc), and the difference in their view from those who stayed is truly fascinating. I wish more people from this town would leave and see what the world has to offer, realize it's so different. I truly want to get out again, and it's taking its toll on me mentally for sure.

rhn_mk1 8y ago

Is being happy the goal we should be satisfied with though? The adaptability has both a good and a bad side. We become happy, but we become complacent. I am hoping that most humans value being a good person as much as being happy. Settling just on happiness doesn't take into account striving for higher values. I think that's what the article is saying in a roundabout way: we should not be self-satisfied, but instead actively try to improve ourselves to become closer to the ideals we want to represent.

tapland 8y ago
I agree, but I think that a lot of people seek happiness and not much else.
justaguyhere 8y ago
we should not be self-satisfied, but instead actively try to improve ourselves Two things I don't understand about this statement - first is the use of the word "should". Why should someone tell me what I should or shouldn't do (as long as whatever I do isn't impacting others negatively)? second, what is wrong with people who are just plain happy with the way they are and don't find any reason to try new things or "improve"? To be clear, I am not for or against trying to improve one's life. IMHO, each person should be left to decide for themselves and not pressured to "improve". A person isn't inferior if they aren't trying to make more money, run faster, play the piano better or whatever, and they are just happy the way they are.
- rhn_mk1 8y ago
  I could rephrase that sentence to answer your first question: > It's not logically consistent to remain stagnant while self-satisfied if you have goals beyond that. I used "should" not to express an obligation to someone else, but to yourself. As to what's wrong with people who don't find any reason to improve: In their frame of reference, there's nothing wrong with them. That's why I said: > improve ourselves to become closer to the ideals we want to represent. If someone has no ideal they want to represent, then nothing I said applies to them. I personally disagree with what you said here though: > A person isn't inferior if they aren't trying to make more money, run faster, play the piano better or whatever, and they are just happy the way they are. People live in the context of society, and the world they are creating. There's no unbinding oneself from the consequences of one's actions, the same way every act of consumption creates a footprint and cost to the world that we share with others. I think settling on one's own happiness is a low bar to clear, and failing to strive to leave our legacy better for others is a short-sightedness that leads to crises, best represented by the global warming. Of course, people are being left to decide what they think they should be doing for their lives, but I hope we can agree that there exists a view in which they would be reasonably condemned.

kiba 8y ago

Maybe my fitness and health goal isn't going to make me more happy, but instead I am aiming for greater "well-being". At least that's what I am telling myself trying to work on a healthy diet and getting exercises. We'll see in six months.

Cthulhu_ 8y ago
It works / worked for me, and I've never been particularly obese, just unfit due to sitting on my arse all day. Just being able to walk with a bit more confidence, to open doors without having to shoulder them open, to lean down and tie my shoes without putting it up on a bench, going for short sprints or up stairs without getting winded, are all small but great changes. But they take time. It won't be an overnight change; you need to make a new habit (and unlearn others), and stick with them for six months. Don't try and change it all in one go.
ip26 8y ago
Yeah, I can understand the debate about hedonic adaptation as it relates to hobbies and wealth- what's the point if your happiness is the same- but whether or not my happiness remains the same, I cannot accept the idea that fitness, health, and wellbeing are thus not worthwhile pursuits.

bartread 8y ago

I think this might be a case of something like "hedonic adaptation". Nick Shabazz has an interesting video talking about this with respect to collecting gear that's worth a watch: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zuwCTi2DbBc&t=10s https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zuwCTi2DbBc&t=10s. The short version is that "better" becomes the new "normal", but it doesn't necessarily make us happier. I guess this may also be part of the reason why issues such as privilege and entitlement can manifest themselves, and start causing problems.

aaron695 8y ago

> Winning the lottery doesn't improve your happiness Not true at all, the evidence is conclusive it does make you happier. Maybe you are thinking of people who don't win the lottery but play it?