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The only reason you don't pay more in taxes is because you don't like the feels of not keeping up with the Joneses? Okay, but I don't regard you as an sort of

The only reason you don't pay more in taxes is because you don't like the feels of not keeping up with the Joneses? Okay, but I don't regard you as an sort of moral actor for that: you intentionally don't do something you readily admit would make the situation better, out of your emotional needs, while politicking to force everyone to do the thing you're not actually willing to do yourself. So no, I simply don't believe you: I don't think you believe you should pay higher taxes, I think you believe other people in your income bracket should, to run society the way you envision. If somehow that didn't apply to you, but applied to every one, well that would be just fine wouldn't it? I originally didn't agree with GP, but the posts like yours trying to refute it are actually bringing me around to that position -- because they're deeply morally compromised, full of special pleading, and so on.

skh 8y ago
You've made a mistake. You wrote: ..you're not actually willing to do yourself." That should be: ...you're not actually willing to do solely by yourself. As I said, what does it matter if I'm a hypocrite? My belief that taxes should be higher for people like me is true or false independent of my hypocrisy. The question of taxation levels should not be determined or influenced by the level of my own personal hypocrisy. I don't think you believe you should pay higher taxes, I think you believe other people in your income bracket should,.. You inserted other. This is wrong. I believe all people in my income bracket should pay more in taxes. This includes me. I do believe that government should tax me more. I'm also not going to donate more to the government if it isn't forced. Free rider problem and all that. There's no special pleading in my position and I don't claim that my position on taxation levels is some sort of moral action on my part. All I've said is the following 2 things: 1. Taxes should higher for people in my income bracket. 2. I'm not going donate more to the government than what is required. Make of this what you will. I'm a hypocrite. But I still think taxes should be higher for people in my income bracket and this obviously includes myself.
- davidivadavid 8y ago
  The problem is not that you're a hypocrite, it's that you're an inconsistent hypocrite. If paying more taxes is a net good for society, any additional amount of taxes should be better for society. You're not living by the principles you claim to believe in.
  - skh 8y ago
    So what if I’m an inconsistent hypocrite? By the way, isn’t the essence of hypocrisy inconsistency? I still believe tax rates are too low for people in my income bracket. Also one should ponder that the marginal effect of donations to the government by me are neglible but when done on the scale of millions of people they end up not being negligible. I don’t think me paying an extra $x thousand will actually help anyone. I do think that millions of people paying $x thousands more will. In this case, size matters.
    - antidesitter 8y ago
      > I don’t think me paying an extra $x thousand will actually help anyone. Then by the same logic, doing so when other people pay won’t actually help anyone either.
      - skh 8y ago
        Your logic is bad or it’s your math. Suppose I pay an extra $1,000 in income taxes via a donation. This amount will not help anyone or improve the fiscal situation of the United States government. However, several million people paying another thousand dollars in taxes can/will. Replace the word other in your comment with everyong in the tax bracket I’m in and you’ll see that your conclusion is wrong. Consider this analogy. Me pooping in the local lake isn’t going to adversely affect the lake’s ecology. A million people doing so will.
        RhysU 8y ago
        > Suppose I pay an extra $1,000 in income taxes via a donation. This amount will not help anyone or improve the fiscal situation of the United States government. It sounds like you think government waste implies $1000 is meaningless. Certainly $1000 in some private folks' pockets will materially help them.
grey-area 8y ago
The only reason you don't pay more in taxes is because you don't like the feels of not keeping up with the Joneses? That's not what they said, at all. You appear to think everyone is maximally selfish and short-sighted: you believe others should pay...if that somehow didn't apply to you...that'd be just fine That is not the case. Not everyone thinks like this.

skh 8y ago

You've made a mistake. You wrote: ..you're not actually willing to do yourself." That should be: ...you're not actually willing to do solely by yourself. As I said, what does it matter if I'm a hypocrite? My belief that taxes should be higher for people like me is true or false independent of my hypocrisy. The question of taxation levels should not be determined or influenced by the level of my own personal hypocrisy. I don't think you believe you should pay higher taxes, I think you believe other people in your income bracket should,.. You inserted other. This is wrong. I believe all people in my income bracket should pay more in taxes. This includes me. I do believe that government should tax me more. I'm also not going to donate more to the government if it isn't forced. Free rider problem and all that. There's no special pleading in my position and I don't claim that my position on taxation levels is some sort of moral action on my part. All I've said is the following 2 things: 1. Taxes should higher for people in my income bracket. 2. I'm not going donate more to the government than what is required. Make of this what you will. I'm a hypocrite. But I still think taxes should be higher for people in my income bracket and this obviously includes myself.

davidivadavid 8y ago
The problem is not that you're a hypocrite, it's that you're an inconsistent hypocrite. If paying more taxes is a net good for society, any additional amount of taxes should be better for society. You're not living by the principles you claim to believe in.
- skh 8y ago
  So what if I’m an inconsistent hypocrite? By the way, isn’t the essence of hypocrisy inconsistency? I still believe tax rates are too low for people in my income bracket. Also one should ponder that the marginal effect of donations to the government by me are neglible but when done on the scale of millions of people they end up not being negligible. I don’t think me paying an extra $x thousand will actually help anyone. I do think that millions of people paying $x thousands more will. In this case, size matters.
  - antidesitter 8y ago
    > I don’t think me paying an extra $x thousand will actually help anyone. Then by the same logic, doing so when other people pay won’t actually help anyone either.
    - skh 8y ago
      Your logic is bad or it’s your math. Suppose I pay an extra $1,000 in income taxes via a donation. This amount will not help anyone or improve the fiscal situation of the United States government. However, several million people paying another thousand dollars in taxes can/will. Replace the word other in your comment with everyong in the tax bracket I’m in and you’ll see that your conclusion is wrong. Consider this analogy. Me pooping in the local lake isn’t going to adversely affect the lake’s ecology. A million people doing so will.
      - RhysU 8y ago
        > Suppose I pay an extra $1,000 in income taxes via a donation. This amount will not help anyone or improve the fiscal situation of the United States government. It sounds like you think government waste implies $1000 is meaningless. Certainly $1000 in some private folks' pockets will materially help them.

grey-area 8y ago

The only reason you don't pay more in taxes is because you don't like the feels of not keeping up with the Joneses? That's not what they said, at all. You appear to think everyone is maximally selfish and short-sighted: you believe others should pay...if that somehow didn't apply to you...that'd be just fine That is not the case. Not everyone thinks like this.