4 ms·

Because the solution is typically implemented with a bounty program which is known to result in the intentional release of more of the invasive species to colle

Because the solution is typically implemented with a bounty program which is known to result in the intentional release of more of the invasive species to collect more rewards.

jessaustin 8y ago
That scenario might have happened with e.g. "wild" hogs, but where are the fraudsters going to get a bunch of non-native monkeys? They aren't available at the local livestock auction...
- jobigoud 8y ago
  Same. Capture a few and have them breed and collect the reward for the offsprings.
  - jessaustin 8y ago
    How many Floridians would hear about wild animals with horrible deadly diseases and think "I need to start breeding these in my basement"?
    - theandrewbailey 8y ago
      A lot, actually. Florida has lots of old people, rednecks, and drug addicts.
    - will_brown 8y ago
      Florida is the gateway to the America’s. It’s how all these invasive species got here in the first place. People breed alligators in their bathtubs, release giant pythons. Maybe they don’t need to breed the moneys but do things to support their population growth (kill predators if any, leave food, etc...) or they can breed monkey without the disease. The invasive monkeys did get here and released in the first place after all.
    - mikestew 8y ago
      Based on my visits to my parents down there, and other visits over the years, my tourist slogan for Florida is “The Land of Bad Ideas”. You won’t see it at Disney World, but seems to me that FL attracts folks that tend to not think things through to their conclusion. So to answer your question: more than you might think.
      - jessaustin 8y ago
        ...FL attracts folks that tend to not think things through to their conclusion. Haha yeah they moved to Florida, didn't they?
    - olyjohn 8y ago
      Depends on how big the reward is for one of the animals.
sho 8y ago
"Is known to"? By who? It sounds like you've read the anecdote about the Cobra Effect and generalized into the conclusion that no bounty system could ever work, which is demonstrably incorrect. Place a nominal bounty on the monkeys of, say, $50 each and threaten anyone attempting to breed and release the animals for profit with a lifetime jail sentence and the Cobra Effect would not arise.
- will_brown 8y ago
  >It sounds like you've read the anecdote about the Cobra Effect and generalized... I’d say it sounds like you read about the anecdote and have little first hand experience with these bounty programs in Florida. Whereas I live in south Florida and I am familiar with fraud and failure of these bounty programs with pythons and lion fish...whereas I have seen non-bounty government programs gain ground in the eradication of giant African snails. Good luck gaining any ground with advocating for life time jail sentences for breeding animals (invasive or otherwise) in Florida. Have any evidence such a program has ever existed?
  - sho 8y ago
    > Have any evidence such a program has ever existed? It was an argumentum ad absurdum to demonstrate that with sufficient disincentives to cheating, the "Cobra Effect" might be effectively countered - in reply to your questionable claim that any and all bounty program "is known" to not work, as if that's some sort of law of physics. I'm not familiar with the failed python and fish programs you mention, but I'll take your word for it that they were implemented so incompetently and supervised so inadequately that fraudulent breeding for profit took place. That said, I'd believe almost anything about Southern Florida and perhaps you're right that it's not the ideal place for a government program requiring tight control and a deft touch. Having read the article - there's only 200 monkeys and they're all pretty localized to one place - I don't see the problem with the government simply doing it themselves, so I agree somewhat, but still take issue with your generalizations. Bounty programs are known to be unworkable, in South Florida, with snakes and fish. That's it. Oh, and in possibly-apocryphal British India.
honkycat 8y ago
Fair, would be messy to implement. Plus who wants to be the "murder the tiny adorable monkeys" politician haha

Because the solution is typically implemented with a bounty program which is known to result in the intentional release of more of the invasive species to collect more rewards.

jessaustin 8y ago

That scenario might have happened with e.g. "wild" hogs, but where are the fraudsters going to get a bunch of non-native monkeys? They aren't available at the local livestock auction...

jobigoud 8y ago
Same. Capture a few and have them breed and collect the reward for the offsprings.
- jessaustin 8y ago
  How many Floridians would hear about wild animals with horrible deadly diseases and think "I need to start breeding these in my basement"?
  - theandrewbailey 8y ago
    A lot, actually. Florida has lots of old people, rednecks, and drug addicts.
  - will_brown 8y ago
    Florida is the gateway to the America’s. It’s how all these invasive species got here in the first place. People breed alligators in their bathtubs, release giant pythons. Maybe they don’t need to breed the moneys but do things to support their population growth (kill predators if any, leave food, etc...) or they can breed monkey without the disease. The invasive monkeys did get here and released in the first place after all.
  - mikestew 8y ago
    Based on my visits to my parents down there, and other visits over the years, my tourist slogan for Florida is “The Land of Bad Ideas”. You won’t see it at Disney World, but seems to me that FL attracts folks that tend to not think things through to their conclusion. So to answer your question: more than you might think.
    - jessaustin 8y ago
      ...FL attracts folks that tend to not think things through to their conclusion. Haha yeah they moved to Florida, didn't they?
  - olyjohn 8y ago
    Depends on how big the reward is for one of the animals.

sho 8y ago

"Is known to"? By who? It sounds like you've read the anecdote about the Cobra Effect and generalized into the conclusion that no bounty system could ever work, which is demonstrably incorrect. Place a nominal bounty on the monkeys of, say, $50 each and threaten anyone attempting to breed and release the animals for profit with a lifetime jail sentence and the Cobra Effect would not arise.

will_brown 8y ago
>It sounds like you've read the anecdote about the Cobra Effect and generalized... I’d say it sounds like you read about the anecdote and have little first hand experience with these bounty programs in Florida. Whereas I live in south Florida and I am familiar with fraud and failure of these bounty programs with pythons and lion fish...whereas I have seen non-bounty government programs gain ground in the eradication of giant African snails. Good luck gaining any ground with advocating for life time jail sentences for breeding animals (invasive or otherwise) in Florida. Have any evidence such a program has ever existed?
- sho 8y ago
  > Have any evidence such a program has ever existed? It was an argumentum ad absurdum to demonstrate that with sufficient disincentives to cheating, the "Cobra Effect" might be effectively countered - in reply to your questionable claim that any and all bounty program "is known" to not work, as if that's some sort of law of physics. I'm not familiar with the failed python and fish programs you mention, but I'll take your word for it that they were implemented so incompetently and supervised so inadequately that fraudulent breeding for profit took place. That said, I'd believe almost anything about Southern Florida and perhaps you're right that it's not the ideal place for a government program requiring tight control and a deft touch. Having read the article - there's only 200 monkeys and they're all pretty localized to one place - I don't see the problem with the government simply doing it themselves, so I agree somewhat, but still take issue with your generalizations. Bounty programs are known to be unworkable, in South Florida, with snakes and fish. That's it. Oh, and in possibly-apocryphal British India.

honkycat 8y ago

Fair, would be messy to implement. Plus who wants to be the "murder the tiny adorable monkeys" politician haha