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> However, as a utilitarian, I'm opposed to open borders for utilitarian reasons. Having unchecked immigration would destroy the culture and institutions of the
by msla 8y ago
> However, as a utilitarian, I'm opposed to open borders for utilitarian reasons. Having unchecked immigration would destroy the culture and institutions of the successful societies. They would lose the very culture and institutions that made them successful and attractive to immigrants in the first place.
I have to steelman this position with something now:
If you have a country which accepts broad civil rights for sexual minorities, and you have a large influx of people coming into your country who prefer few or no civil rights for sexual minorities, what happens when you have enough immigrants to force a vote on rights for sexual minorities? Don't tell me that can't happen; ultimately, there's always a threshold beyond which the government loses legitimacy if it refuses to put certain things to a ballot, and by "government" I mean "ruling party or coalition" if you're lucky.
If I were a sexual minority, I'd see border restrictions as being an existential issue.
- Rotten194 8y agoI'm trans. Please dont use us as a cover for your arguments, thanks. People who come to the US almost universally accept American values after a generation. And considering large proportions of the US believe LGBT people don't deserve to get married or adopt children, and several trans women were savagely beaten last month in my city by some white-bread born in america nazis, that many people born in this country think doctors should be able to deny care to LGBT people based on their religious beliefs -- meanwhile everyone I know who's immigrated from a different country has been nothing but wonderful to me -- I would argue that believing immigrants will somehow reverse progress on civil rights is ridiculous and not justified by the facts.
- msla 8y ago> People who come to the US almost universally accept American values after a generation. And considering large proportions of the US believe LGBT people don't deserve to get married or adopt children, and several trans women were savagely beaten last month in my city by some white-bread born in america nazis [snip] You aren't making your own case very well.
- Rotten194 8y agoso whats your point? yes people going back 10 generations can be intolerant fucks, meaning there is no difference between the people who've been here for a long time vs people who just came here, proving my point. the segment of people who are intolerant, in my experience, is much more people who have been here for a very long time and not immigrants.
- deleted 8y ago[deleted]