6 ms·

Flutter Desktop Embedding

119 points by boshomi 8y ago

vlad_doster 8y ago
Really looking forward to porting my home automation to flutter!
- KitDuncan 8y ago
  ... This is a good idea. I might do the same to try out flutter.
- pvinis 8y ago
  Can you share more about this?
- machiaweliczny 8y ago
  Could you point me to some tools/hardware/solutions you used for home automation? I'm about to start such project for my new flat and I'm looking for information/inspiration.
netcyrax 8y ago
With desktop support, I will definitely try Flutter. I just wish desktop support was a committed effort, not an "exploratory effort".
- krzat 8y ago
  They used this to create presentation app during last Flutter Live, so it seems strange that it's still "exploratory effort".
  - pjmlp 8y ago
    While stating at the samw time that the Flutter team is only commited to iOS and Android. I am still waiting to see if that is a Chrome and Angular level commitment or what.
- damian2000 8y ago
  I think desktop support will always be there in some form or another because I believe to port flutter to some particular platform wouldn't be a massive amount of work. Reason is that Flutter is written to address a graphics layer such as OpenGL or equivalent. The iOS/Android apps it generates are just a single view with graphics and touch input, similar to a Unity game for example.
wiradikusuma 8y ago
"This is not an officially supported Google product." — such a weird thing to say considering it's hosted under github.com/GOOGLE/...
- cwyers 8y ago
  This sort of thing predates GitHub. Microsoft had the PowerToys for Windows -- it was a Microsoft software product for Windows, but it didn't undergo the same level of vetting as something that was part of Windows, and if you broke something using it, you were on your own. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Microsoft_PowerToys https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Microsoft_PowerToys It's not crazy for someone at Google to want to use Flutter on the desktop, to build something to scratch their own itch, and to release it while not wanting to commit to the same level of support that Google gives to mainline Flutter.
  - StavrosK 8y ago
    This is pretty off-topic, but I used to love the PowerToys. I have very fond memories of browsing through TweakUI's options and trying things, and what surprises me most about those twenty-year old memories is that I remember how things smelled.
- petters 8y ago
  Agreed, but google/ on GitHub just contains code that happens to be owned by Google, due to the authors being employees.
- jdub 8y ago
  I'd wager you'll find the same statement on 90% of the repos under /google/ Employees agree that Google will own their creative output, even off the clock. Those personal project repos are almost always managed by a Google-owned GitHub organisation.
  - zokier 8y ago
    > I'd wager you'll find the same statement on 90% of the repos under /google/ And it feels like this gets brought up in 90% of HN threads about google owned projects
hliyan 8y ago
I love Flutter, but I'm still slightly reluctant to go for full adoption until I see a firm commitment to Dart. If Google makes Dart the main SDK language for Android (like Swift on iOS), that'll do it!
- farmerbb 8y ago
  Not going to happen, considering Google's commitment to supporting Kotlin for Android development over the past couple of years.
- netdur 8y ago
  Google is moving away from Android, the replacement has Dart built-in.
  - pjmlp 8y ago
    Google is porting Android to run on Fuchsia as well, similar to ChromeOS.
  - SneakerXZ 8y ago
    Fuchsia tries to be language agnostic thanks to FIDL. Dart will be one of many options.
  - hliyan 8y ago
    What is the "replacement"?
- damian2000 8y ago
  The reply from a Google employee when asked this question was to look at the Google AdWords team - they have invested heavily in Flutter for their Google Ads app on iOS and Android. He basically said Flutter will be supported for 10+ years as a minimum.
  - pjmlp 8y ago
    The AdWords team is the one that rescued Dart 1.0 project from being completely canceled, after the Chrome and Angular teams no longer cared.
dajonker 8y ago
I'm not quite familiar with the tooling but it seems to be based on Chromium?
- glenrivard 8y ago
  It is based on Skia which is also part of Chromium.
PaulHoule 8y ago
What is flutter?
- stronglikedan 8y ago
  https://github.com/flutter/flutter https://github.com/flutter/flutter
MarkMc 8y ago
Our product Feather is based on this one. If you want to try running a few Flutter apps on macOS, see the 'Sample Apps' section on this page: https://feather-apps.com/ https://feather-apps.com/
- therockhead 8y ago
  Just tried the some of the apps and while it seems pretty promising, they are really mobile apps running on the desktop, in fact, it even says that on the website :). For example, the picker is a carousel wheel and not a native looking control. I understand that is still Alpha but do you plan to make it feel more like a desktop application?
  - MarkMc 8y ago
    Right now we are focused on other areas like producing a Windows version and supporting more Flutter plugins. Making it feel like a desktop app might be something we tackle in the longer term. But my personal view is that platform fidelity isn't particularly important as long as an app is fast, responsive and looks good. eg. Gmail and Spotify have been wildly successful without needing to look like native apps.
glenrivard 8y ago
I am old and used a lot of different GUI development tools. From Xwindows to React. Then AWT, Swing, Qt, Android, iOS, and many others inbetween. Flutter is the real deal, IMO. The reason is it offers a superior developer UX. It is the hot reload aspect without having to do web development. Then the weird feature that I now love is how it retains state when developing. This is such a simple thing that you get use to and hard to lose.
srikz 8y ago
I think at the annual Flutter conf in November they said they will be working towards making flutter officially support desktops. I hope Flutter and ScenicUX[1] can become strong options for building lightweight, good looking UIs for apps and embedded device interfaces. By 'embedded' I mean something like a raspi connected to a 7" touch screen [1]: https://github.com/boydm/scenic/blob/master/README.md https://github.com/boydm/scenic/blob/master/README.md
- therockhead 8y ago
  If they support desktop correctly (including accessibility, Left to right languages etc) I honestly believe this technology could be a game changer for cross platform development.

119 points by boshomi 8y ago

vlad_doster 8y ago

Really looking forward to porting my home automation to flutter!

KitDuncan 8y ago
... This is a good idea. I might do the same to try out flutter.
pvinis 8y ago
Can you share more about this?
machiaweliczny 8y ago
Could you point me to some tools/hardware/solutions you used for home automation? I'm about to start such project for my new flat and I'm looking for information/inspiration.

netcyrax 8y ago

With desktop support, I will definitely try Flutter. I just wish desktop support was a committed effort, not an "exploratory effort".

krzat 8y ago
They used this to create presentation app during last Flutter Live, so it seems strange that it's still "exploratory effort".
- pjmlp 8y ago
  While stating at the samw time that the Flutter team is only commited to iOS and Android. I am still waiting to see if that is a Chrome and Angular level commitment or what.
damian2000 8y ago
I think desktop support will always be there in some form or another because I believe to port flutter to some particular platform wouldn't be a massive amount of work. Reason is that Flutter is written to address a graphics layer such as OpenGL or equivalent. The iOS/Android apps it generates are just a single view with graphics and touch input, similar to a Unity game for example.

wiradikusuma 8y ago

"This is not an officially supported Google product." — such a weird thing to say considering it's hosted under github.com/GOOGLE/...

cwyers 8y ago
This sort of thing predates GitHub. Microsoft had the PowerToys for Windows -- it was a Microsoft software product for Windows, but it didn't undergo the same level of vetting as something that was part of Windows, and if you broke something using it, you were on your own. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Microsoft_PowerToys https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Microsoft_PowerToys It's not crazy for someone at Google to want to use Flutter on the desktop, to build something to scratch their own itch, and to release it while not wanting to commit to the same level of support that Google gives to mainline Flutter.
- StavrosK 8y ago
  This is pretty off-topic, but I used to love the PowerToys. I have very fond memories of browsing through TweakUI's options and trying things, and what surprises me most about those twenty-year old memories is that I remember how things smelled.
petters 8y ago
Agreed, but google/ on GitHub just contains code that happens to be owned by Google, due to the authors being employees.
jdub 8y ago
I'd wager you'll find the same statement on 90% of the repos under /google/ Employees agree that Google will own their creative output, even off the clock. Those personal project repos are almost always managed by a Google-owned GitHub organisation.
- zokier 8y ago
  > I'd wager you'll find the same statement on 90% of the repos under /google/ And it feels like this gets brought up in 90% of HN threads about google owned projects

hliyan 8y ago

I love Flutter, but I'm still slightly reluctant to go for full adoption until I see a firm commitment to Dart. If Google makes Dart the main SDK language for Android (like Swift on iOS), that'll do it!

farmerbb 8y ago
Not going to happen, considering Google's commitment to supporting Kotlin for Android development over the past couple of years.
netdur 8y ago
Google is moving away from Android, the replacement has Dart built-in.
- pjmlp 8y ago
  Google is porting Android to run on Fuchsia as well, similar to ChromeOS.
- SneakerXZ 8y ago
  Fuchsia tries to be language agnostic thanks to FIDL. Dart will be one of many options.
- hliyan 8y ago
  What is the "replacement"?
damian2000 8y ago
The reply from a Google employee when asked this question was to look at the Google AdWords team - they have invested heavily in Flutter for their Google Ads app on iOS and Android. He basically said Flutter will be supported for 10+ years as a minimum.
- pjmlp 8y ago
  The AdWords team is the one that rescued Dart 1.0 project from being completely canceled, after the Chrome and Angular teams no longer cared.

dajonker 8y ago

I'm not quite familiar with the tooling but it seems to be based on Chromium?

glenrivard 8y ago
It is based on Skia which is also part of Chromium.

PaulHoule 8y ago

What is flutter?

stronglikedan 8y ago
https://github.com/flutter/flutter https://github.com/flutter/flutter

MarkMc 8y ago

Our product Feather is based on this one. If you want to try running a few Flutter apps on macOS, see the 'Sample Apps' section on this page: https://feather-apps.com/ https://feather-apps.com/

therockhead 8y ago
Just tried the some of the apps and while it seems pretty promising, they are really mobile apps running on the desktop, in fact, it even says that on the website :). For example, the picker is a carousel wheel and not a native looking control. I understand that is still Alpha but do you plan to make it feel more like a desktop application?
- MarkMc 8y ago
  Right now we are focused on other areas like producing a Windows version and supporting more Flutter plugins. Making it feel like a desktop app might be something we tackle in the longer term. But my personal view is that platform fidelity isn't particularly important as long as an app is fast, responsive and looks good. eg. Gmail and Spotify have been wildly successful without needing to look like native apps.

glenrivard 8y ago

I am old and used a lot of different GUI development tools. From Xwindows to React. Then AWT, Swing, Qt, Android, iOS, and many others inbetween. Flutter is the real deal, IMO. The reason is it offers a superior developer UX. It is the hot reload aspect without having to do web development. Then the weird feature that I now love is how it retains state when developing. This is such a simple thing that you get use to and hard to lose.

srikz 8y ago

I think at the annual Flutter conf in November they said they will be working towards making flutter officially support desktops. I hope Flutter and ScenicUX[1] can become strong options for building lightweight, good looking UIs for apps and embedded device interfaces. By 'embedded' I mean something like a raspi connected to a 7" touch screen [1]: https://github.com/boydm/scenic/blob/master/README.md https://github.com/boydm/scenic/blob/master/README.md

therockhead 8y ago
If they support desktop correctly (including accessibility, Left to right languages etc) I honestly believe this technology could be a game changer for cross platform development.