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> The Apple store seems good for small apps This is simply not true. As a small app developer, I can tell you first hand that Apple only promotes and supports

> The Apple store seems good for small apps This is simply not true. As a small app developer, I can tell you first hand that Apple only promotes and supports larger apps in the ecosystem. It is the exception, not the rule, when they promote a smaller app. As a developer, you are on your own on the marketing and discovery front. The billing infrastructure you allude to would be easily replaceable with a dozen or so startups and wouldn't warrant a 30 percent hit that Apple charges.

hinkley 8y ago
I have to agree with grandparent. You can't scale down international infrastructure like this. The cost per sale for someone managing a store for you has a certain minimum cost per month plus an amount per sale and per return. Of course they're going to hype the big games. It's opportunity cost. Advertisement leads to sales, but feeding a hype train gets you more. If they stop advertising the hot new game to showcase yours then that person is not getting promoted. The guy who had no problems ignoring your game gets promoted and now everybody answers to them. Is it awesome? No. Do I like it? Not really. But it's rational, and getting large companies to be rational is often better than you can expect.
- LoSboccacc 8y ago
  The fallacy there is that their push to promote big Warner is mostly promoting toxic games that milk and dime users because freemium games is where money is at. It's no coincidence that on both stores you cannot filter out apps that have in app purchases
  - LoSboccacc 8y ago
    s/Warner/earners/ sorry
- threeseed 8y ago
  Except that Apple doesn't hype the big games. They never have. Go look through the Today/Games section right now. All of the featured games will be from super high quality indie developers. It isn't the ones that make the most money.
xupybd 8y ago
As more and more big players like this choose to move away from transactions in the app stores we may see a lowering of that 30% margin. It's way too high to last. If it came down to something sub 5% it would make a lot more sense.
sandofsky 8y ago
> This is simply not true. As a small app developer, I can tell you first hand that Apple only promotes and supports larger apps in the ecosystem. We’re a two person shop. We’ve taken zero funding. We’re nowhere near Fortnite revenue. Apple has done an outstanding job promoting us. Last month they gave us our first Today tab feature, and at any given time we can be found in several lists.
- electic 8y ago
  I am really happy for you. Genuinely. But most apps do not share your fate no matter how well designed, performant, or useful. I am actually fine if Apple doesn't do any sort of discovery or promotion of our apps. Just don't charge 30 percent then.
  - sandofsky 8y ago
    I just opened the App Store. In the first list, “Great Apps for iPhone XR,” I’d estimate 1/3 of the apps listed were built by small, bootstrapped teams. Another third are larger companies (1Password), and the last third are pretty mainstream brands (Snapchat, Mint). Even if you draw the line for small apps below the size of 1Password, 1/3 seems like an amazingly fair share of retail space. I’m sure many great apps went nowhere. That’s the nature of entrepreneurship. I’d say Apple’s promotion significantly improves the survival odds for small teams doing great work.
  - threeseed 8y ago
    Go look through the store right now. The majority of the apps on the Today section will be small developers. If your app doesn't meet a certain level of quality then Apple will not feature you. But if you do then it is almost certain that at some point they will. I suspect your app falls in the former category.
    - electic 8y ago
      There is no need to attack. Let's be nice. You don't have any idea what the app is.
threeseed 8y ago
> As a small app developer, I can tell you first hand that Apple only promotes and supports larger apps in the ecosystem I have friends at Apple who curate the App Store and I have a number of apps on the store as well. Your statement is categorically wrong. Apple absolutely supports small developers. If you look through many of their "editor playlists" you will see plenty of smaller apps that get a lot of attention e.g. Bear, Notability, Calm. Even apps like Instagram were small once.
- joelrunyon 8y ago
  As an indie developer - HOW do you get in touch with them? We have rave reviews on one of our apps and a very enthusiastic community in a unique space, but having a hell of a time getting the eye of anyone at Apple.
  - threeseed 8y ago
    Look through Linkedin e.g. App Store Editor, find the person that corresponds to your country/region and then email them. Every company has a standard email format and Apple is no different. There are apps around e.g. Hunter that can help. Then be polite, succinct and be specific about what you want. Don't just say "feature me". Say can you please include me in the playlist "Favourite Travel Apps" etc.
  - aaronbrager 8y ago
    Did you fill out the form? https://developer.apple.com/contact/app-store/promote/ https://developer.apple.com/contact/app-store/promote/

hinkley 8y ago

I have to agree with grandparent. You can't scale down international infrastructure like this. The cost per sale for someone managing a store for you has a certain minimum cost per month plus an amount per sale and per return. Of course they're going to hype the big games. It's opportunity cost. Advertisement leads to sales, but feeding a hype train gets you more. If they stop advertising the hot new game to showcase yours then that person is not getting promoted. The guy who had no problems ignoring your game gets promoted and now everybody answers to them. Is it awesome? No. Do I like it? Not really. But it's rational, and getting large companies to be rational is often better than you can expect.

LoSboccacc 8y ago
The fallacy there is that their push to promote big Warner is mostly promoting toxic games that milk and dime users because freemium games is where money is at. It's no coincidence that on both stores you cannot filter out apps that have in app purchases
- LoSboccacc 8y ago
  s/Warner/earners/ sorry
threeseed 8y ago
Except that Apple doesn't hype the big games. They never have. Go look through the Today/Games section right now. All of the featured games will be from super high quality indie developers. It isn't the ones that make the most money.

xupybd 8y ago

As more and more big players like this choose to move away from transactions in the app stores we may see a lowering of that 30% margin. It's way too high to last. If it came down to something sub 5% it would make a lot more sense.

sandofsky 8y ago

> This is simply not true. As a small app developer, I can tell you first hand that Apple only promotes and supports larger apps in the ecosystem. We’re a two person shop. We’ve taken zero funding. We’re nowhere near Fortnite revenue. Apple has done an outstanding job promoting us. Last month they gave us our first Today tab feature, and at any given time we can be found in several lists.

electic 8y ago
I am really happy for you. Genuinely. But most apps do not share your fate no matter how well designed, performant, or useful. I am actually fine if Apple doesn't do any sort of discovery or promotion of our apps. Just don't charge 30 percent then.
- sandofsky 8y ago
  I just opened the App Store. In the first list, “Great Apps for iPhone XR,” I’d estimate 1/3 of the apps listed were built by small, bootstrapped teams. Another third are larger companies (1Password), and the last third are pretty mainstream brands (Snapchat, Mint). Even if you draw the line for small apps below the size of 1Password, 1/3 seems like an amazingly fair share of retail space. I’m sure many great apps went nowhere. That’s the nature of entrepreneurship. I’d say Apple’s promotion significantly improves the survival odds for small teams doing great work.
- threeseed 8y ago
  Go look through the store right now. The majority of the apps on the Today section will be small developers. If your app doesn't meet a certain level of quality then Apple will not feature you. But if you do then it is almost certain that at some point they will. I suspect your app falls in the former category.
  - electic 8y ago
    There is no need to attack. Let's be nice. You don't have any idea what the app is.

threeseed 8y ago

> As a small app developer, I can tell you first hand that Apple only promotes and supports larger apps in the ecosystem I have friends at Apple who curate the App Store and I have a number of apps on the store as well. Your statement is categorically wrong. Apple absolutely supports small developers. If you look through many of their "editor playlists" you will see plenty of smaller apps that get a lot of attention e.g. Bear, Notability, Calm. Even apps like Instagram were small once.

joelrunyon 8y ago
As an indie developer - HOW do you get in touch with them? We have rave reviews on one of our apps and a very enthusiastic community in a unique space, but having a hell of a time getting the eye of anyone at Apple.
- threeseed 8y ago
  Look through Linkedin e.g. App Store Editor, find the person that corresponds to your country/region and then email them. Every company has a standard email format and Apple is no different. There are apps around e.g. Hunter that can help. Then be polite, succinct and be specific about what you want. Don't just say "feature me". Say can you please include me in the playlist "Favourite Travel Apps" etc.
- aaronbrager 8y ago
  Did you fill out the form? https://developer.apple.com/contact/app-store/promote/ https://developer.apple.com/contact/app-store/promote/