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> PoS requires that you get the consensus rules AND a hash of the most recent valid block from a trusted source. no, nothing in PoS requires that. just a sad s

> PoS requires that you get the consensus rules AND a hash of the most recent valid block from a trusted source. no, nothing in PoS requires that. just a sad state of affairs with most centralized insecure PoS coins these days. > With PoW, you only get the consensus rules. no, you can opt to get hash of the most recent block if you want to compromise your security. > Either way, you're relying on a trusted third party for bootstrapping. no, you don't have to rely on trusted party for PoW bootstrapping. if you're scared somebody has communicated consensus rules to you incorrectly or maliciously - you just get those rules from multiple sources and VERIFY THE CHAIN FOR YOURSELF. with PoW you get objective measure to compare those chains, with PoS you get nothing. > With PoS, you do you have a somewhat similar option: you can measure the market value of the coins of each chain. no, you completely misunderstand the problem at hand. given coin X and multiple chains of coin X - how do you compare those chains? market price of coin X tells you nothing how to distinguish between competing chains. market price is completely detached from actual verification work happening on chain.

CryptoPunk 8y ago
>>no, nothing in PoS requires that. It's necessary for bootstrapping. What alternative is there for bootstrapping using PoS? >>just a sad state of affairs with most centralized insecure PoS coins these days. I have no idea what superior alternative for PoS you're referring to. What bootstrapping alternative does any PoS blockchain have to getting the recent state and consensus rules from a trusted third party? Right now your argument makes absolutely no sense to me as you suddenly seem to be implying that there is a superior PoS mechanism that existing PoS chains don't use, which is an entirely new argument you haven't touched on before and an have not detailed right now, so please elaborate on this with a mind to explain its connection to the argument thread that preceded it.
- keymone 8y ago
  > It's necessary for bootstrapping your claim was consensus rules AND hash of most recent block are necessary. this is false, hash of most recent block is not necessary for bootstrapping. > your argument makes absolutely no sense to me so please elaborate you have to be more specific. i've responded to every point of your message. if you don't understand something in my response - point that out.
  - CryptoPunk 8y ago
    >>your claim was consensus rules AND hash of most recent block are necessary. this is false, hash of most recent block is not necessary for bootstrapping. A hash of A block from a trusted third party is needed for a node to bootstrap into a PoS network. Regardless of which block that is, the same amount of trust is required. And getting a more recent one reduces the number of blocks the node needs to download. Anyway, the point is, the difference in bootrapping between PoW and PoS is in PoS, a hash of a block is also needed from a trusted third party. In both cases, a trusted third party is needed, and if the TTP is malicious, they can totally defraud the user.
    - keymone 8y ago
      > the difference in bootrapping between PoW and PoS is in PoS, a hash of a block is also needed from a trusted third party. so far so good... > In both cases, a trusted third party is needed wait, what? when did that thing sneak into your argument? why do i need trusted party for PoW?
      - CryptoPunk 8y ago
        I thought we went through this. In PoW, you need the consensus rules from a Trusted Third Party.

CryptoPunk 8y ago

>>no, nothing in PoS requires that. It's necessary for bootstrapping. What alternative is there for bootstrapping using PoS? >>just a sad state of affairs with most centralized insecure PoS coins these days. I have no idea what superior alternative for PoS you're referring to. What bootstrapping alternative does any PoS blockchain have to getting the recent state and consensus rules from a trusted third party? Right now your argument makes absolutely no sense to me as you suddenly seem to be implying that there is a superior PoS mechanism that existing PoS chains don't use, which is an entirely new argument you haven't touched on before and an have not detailed right now, so please elaborate on this with a mind to explain its connection to the argument thread that preceded it.

keymone 8y ago
> It's necessary for bootstrapping your claim was consensus rules AND hash of most recent block are necessary. this is false, hash of most recent block is not necessary for bootstrapping. > your argument makes absolutely no sense to me so please elaborate you have to be more specific. i've responded to every point of your message. if you don't understand something in my response - point that out.
- CryptoPunk 8y ago
  >>your claim was consensus rules AND hash of most recent block are necessary. this is false, hash of most recent block is not necessary for bootstrapping. A hash of A block from a trusted third party is needed for a node to bootstrap into a PoS network. Regardless of which block that is, the same amount of trust is required. And getting a more recent one reduces the number of blocks the node needs to download. Anyway, the point is, the difference in bootrapping between PoW and PoS is in PoS, a hash of a block is also needed from a trusted third party. In both cases, a trusted third party is needed, and if the TTP is malicious, they can totally defraud the user.
  - keymone 8y ago
    > the difference in bootrapping between PoW and PoS is in PoS, a hash of a block is also needed from a trusted third party. so far so good... > In both cases, a trusted third party is needed wait, what? when did that thing sneak into your argument? why do i need trusted party for PoW?
    - CryptoPunk 8y ago
      I thought we went through this. In PoW, you need the consensus rules from a Trusted Third Party.