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At least in America, most teachers are expected to take home work and spend a large portion of time outside of the strict 6-8 school day doing lesson planning,

At least in America, most teachers are expected to take home work and spend a large portion of time outside of the strict 6-8 school day doing lesson planning, grading, etc. Their wages are quickly approaching what you would expect at a fry cook position yet Wendy's doesn't give you four hours of extra homework a night. We are headed for a giant education crisis because we overwork and underpay under-qualified teachers. Those of us who cannot afford to keep their kids in private or home school will have it rough finding quality education for their kids.

tomohawk 8y ago
All of the most successful teachers I had placed tight boundaries on when they worked. They were organized, fast, and efficient. One history teacher I had only ever gave essay tests. He would have them all graded by 4pm. As one class was taking the exam, he would grade the previous class's essays. He had been a colonel in the army, and so had learned how to be ruthlessly efficient. One of the best teachers I had. Similarly, had a neighbor who had been a colonel and became a realtor when he retired. He way outworked everyone else, including realtors with many years of experience. He was accustomed to slamming through all the paperwork quickly and carried that to his realtor gig. I have known many teachers who were never trained to be efficient or organized, and who did not anticipate the paperwork load that comes with the job. They would struggle under the paperwork load due to this. But, what do we expect from a system run by government administrators with little or no transparency or accountability. The administrators pile on the paperwork, because that is what means quality to them. That is what they do.
- BoiledCabbage 8y ago
  Comments like these frequently crack me up. Paraphrasing: > Teachers are terrible because they work at a government job. People don't learn anything good from working in a government job. The most successful teacher I knew he already knew how to be efficient so he was successful. And where did he learn that? Oh a former Colonl? You mean from a government job? It always reminds me of the signs you see people holding, saying "The government had better keep it's hands off my medicare"
  - tomohawk 8y ago
    Thanks for putting words in my mouth. My point is that teachers do not become teachers to do paperwork. They become teachers to teach. However, their job is defined by government administrators who measure everything by how much paperwork is done. Teachers are receiving the wrong training and have the wrong expectations, so they are leaving.
    - kakarot 8y ago
      I'm sorry if it seemed like I was putting words in your mouth. I did directly quote you. I didn't become a software developer to document every minute action or go to meetings or explain complex concepts to clueless bosses or meet intense deadlines, I became a software developer to program. Yet... Besides having more realistic expectations about my field due to exhaustive research, which in fact led me to change my mind about becoming a teacher or professor and just focusing on software development, I also trained myself extensively extracurricularly to be prepared for my job. What motivates all of this is the salary and the control over my life which programming affords me. Neither of those things are pluses about being a teacher. Their salaries are absolute garbage and get worse every year, and they have little control over how they structure their life. Most of the motivated public school teachers I knew growing up have moved into administrative positions because of this. What ends up happening is that it's mostly just the inefficient people without foresight who remain in college for 4-6 years to become a teacher. The quality of applicants is directly tied to the quality of life afforded by the position. And in my opinion, public school teaching positions should be some of the highest-paid and highest-qualified jobs in the market, on par with college professors and junior to mid level engineers. At least more on par with what their administrators are already pocketing.
- kakarot 8y ago
  > All of the most successful teachers I had placed tight boundaries on when they worked. They were organized, fast, and efficient. You're describing efficient people. Unfortunately we do not properly train our teachers because we do not want to properly pay them.

tomohawk 8y ago

All of the most successful teachers I had placed tight boundaries on when they worked. They were organized, fast, and efficient. One history teacher I had only ever gave essay tests. He would have them all graded by 4pm. As one class was taking the exam, he would grade the previous class's essays. He had been a colonel in the army, and so had learned how to be ruthlessly efficient. One of the best teachers I had. Similarly, had a neighbor who had been a colonel and became a realtor when he retired. He way outworked everyone else, including realtors with many years of experience. He was accustomed to slamming through all the paperwork quickly and carried that to his realtor gig. I have known many teachers who were never trained to be efficient or organized, and who did not anticipate the paperwork load that comes with the job. They would struggle under the paperwork load due to this. But, what do we expect from a system run by government administrators with little or no transparency or accountability. The administrators pile on the paperwork, because that is what means quality to them. That is what they do.

BoiledCabbage 8y ago
Comments like these frequently crack me up. Paraphrasing: > Teachers are terrible because they work at a government job. People don't learn anything good from working in a government job. The most successful teacher I knew he already knew how to be efficient so he was successful. And where did he learn that? Oh a former Colonl? You mean from a government job? It always reminds me of the signs you see people holding, saying "The government had better keep it's hands off my medicare"
- tomohawk 8y ago
  Thanks for putting words in my mouth. My point is that teachers do not become teachers to do paperwork. They become teachers to teach. However, their job is defined by government administrators who measure everything by how much paperwork is done. Teachers are receiving the wrong training and have the wrong expectations, so they are leaving.
  - kakarot 8y ago
    I'm sorry if it seemed like I was putting words in your mouth. I did directly quote you. I didn't become a software developer to document every minute action or go to meetings or explain complex concepts to clueless bosses or meet intense deadlines, I became a software developer to program. Yet... Besides having more realistic expectations about my field due to exhaustive research, which in fact led me to change my mind about becoming a teacher or professor and just focusing on software development, I also trained myself extensively extracurricularly to be prepared for my job. What motivates all of this is the salary and the control over my life which programming affords me. Neither of those things are pluses about being a teacher. Their salaries are absolute garbage and get worse every year, and they have little control over how they structure their life. Most of the motivated public school teachers I knew growing up have moved into administrative positions because of this. What ends up happening is that it's mostly just the inefficient people without foresight who remain in college for 4-6 years to become a teacher. The quality of applicants is directly tied to the quality of life afforded by the position. And in my opinion, public school teaching positions should be some of the highest-paid and highest-qualified jobs in the market, on par with college professors and junior to mid level engineers. At least more on par with what their administrators are already pocketing.
kakarot 8y ago
> All of the most successful teachers I had placed tight boundaries on when they worked. They were organized, fast, and efficient. You're describing efficient people. Unfortunately we do not properly train our teachers because we do not want to properly pay them.