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The pen is mightier than the sword! FB is not taking down web sites - they are managing public discourse on their own channels. Constitutional freedoms don't q

The pen is mightier than the sword! FB is not taking down web sites - they are managing public discourse on their own channels. Constitutional freedoms don't quite apply here. When the Feds take down web sites, I think a much higher standard needs to apply.

gojomo 8y ago
What if FB is performing censorship under various kinds of implicit pressure from the "Feds" (and other governments)? Then it's just state censorship, laundered to look like it's "only a private party's decision within their narrow domain".
- spookthesunset 8y ago
  Look, if the people posting racist hate-speech get banned from all the sites I use, my life is much better. They can go take their trash somewhere else. You are defending some pretty awful excuses for humans....
  - AnimalMuppet 8y ago
    Yes. See, the problem is, you are a "pretty awful excuse for a human" to somebody. Do you want them to be able to block your speech? No? Then you need to extend the same courtesy to those you consider to be "pretty awful excuses for humans".
    - spookthesunset 8y ago
      Actually, I'm not a racist scumbag so I'm at least better than that.
      - AnimalMuppet 8y ago
        Good. Seriously. It's good that you're not a racist scumbag. But the actual quality of you as a human being wasn't the issue. The issue is that, if you're going to block speech by scumbags, there is someone who is going to consider you a scumbag. If you allow speech from scumbags to get blocked, then you need the people controlling the blocking to have the right ideas of who is a scumbag. Will the right people be the ones making the decisions? Will they always be the right people - not just this year and next, but always? I'm not willing to condone that power, because it can be used against me, not just against the people I want it to be used against.
        spookthesunset 8y ago
        Honestly? I don’t give a crap what private company blocks and bans folks in the alt right. More the marrier. In fact, I wish all companies took a stand against the alt-right. Even if the government started to persecute them, I wouldn’t care. They are all my enemy and I view them as an existential threat to myself, my family and my country. Appeals to the Slippery slope argument doesn’t register with me anymore. They are the enemy and need to go away. Ps: I’m old. I used to think like you. But now I see that sometimes things get out of hand. You are defending a group of people who don’t give a flying fuck about free speech or any of the values you have. And worse, they are in power and use arguments just like yours to remain in power.
        AnimalMuppet 8y ago
        By defending their freedom of speech, I am defending my freedom of speech. I may not care about theirs, but I care about mine. And for you to not be worried about this being used against you... you just said that these people are in power. That means that they at least have the capability of using it against you in the near future.
- stevenicr 8y ago
  this. (and the article mentions some of the gov entwining) And It's often just not seen, which to me is worse then being "laundered to look like it's [private-party]'s fault" When speech is erased, or otherwise hidden and downranked, many people assume, both the poster of the content and those people that have followed or liked believe that content they are expressing desire to get, never existed at all - so there is no blame because so many do not realize the censorship in the first place - which is even worse imho.

gojomo 8y ago

What if FB is performing censorship under various kinds of implicit pressure from the "Feds" (and other governments)? Then it's just state censorship, laundered to look like it's "only a private party's decision within their narrow domain".

spookthesunset 8y ago
Look, if the people posting racist hate-speech get banned from all the sites I use, my life is much better. They can go take their trash somewhere else. You are defending some pretty awful excuses for humans....
- AnimalMuppet 8y ago
  Yes. See, the problem is, you are a "pretty awful excuse for a human" to somebody. Do you want them to be able to block your speech? No? Then you need to extend the same courtesy to those you consider to be "pretty awful excuses for humans".
  - spookthesunset 8y ago
    Actually, I'm not a racist scumbag so I'm at least better than that.
    - AnimalMuppet 8y ago
      Good. Seriously. It's good that you're not a racist scumbag. But the actual quality of you as a human being wasn't the issue. The issue is that, if you're going to block speech by scumbags, there is someone who is going to consider you a scumbag. If you allow speech from scumbags to get blocked, then you need the people controlling the blocking to have the right ideas of who is a scumbag. Will the right people be the ones making the decisions? Will they always be the right people - not just this year and next, but always? I'm not willing to condone that power, because it can be used against me, not just against the people I want it to be used against.
      - spookthesunset 8y ago
        Honestly? I don’t give a crap what private company blocks and bans folks in the alt right. More the marrier. In fact, I wish all companies took a stand against the alt-right. Even if the government started to persecute them, I wouldn’t care. They are all my enemy and I view them as an existential threat to myself, my family and my country. Appeals to the Slippery slope argument doesn’t register with me anymore. They are the enemy and need to go away. Ps: I’m old. I used to think like you. But now I see that sometimes things get out of hand. You are defending a group of people who don’t give a flying fuck about free speech or any of the values you have. And worse, they are in power and use arguments just like yours to remain in power.
        AnimalMuppet 8y ago
        By defending their freedom of speech, I am defending my freedom of speech. I may not care about theirs, but I care about mine. And for you to not be worried about this being used against you... you just said that these people are in power. That means that they at least have the capability of using it against you in the near future.
stevenicr 8y ago
this. (and the article mentions some of the gov entwining) And It's often just not seen, which to me is worse then being "laundered to look like it's [private-party]'s fault" When speech is erased, or otherwise hidden and downranked, many people assume, both the poster of the content and those people that have followed or liked believe that content they are expressing desire to get, never existed at all - so there is no blame because so many do not realize the censorship in the first place - which is even worse imho.