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I dont think that by looking only to features we can understand this very well. Go was very lucky to be launched when cloud computing fever was catching up, and

I dont think that by looking only to features we can understand this very well. Go was very lucky to be launched when cloud computing fever was catching up, and people were being burned for using techs like Java for this end. C++ were very performant, and unlike Java not a memory hog, but for this sort of tasks it was deemed to complex. Besides the ammount of people that were able to program in it was limited (and you can even see this reasoning being used as a reason why they created Go). Then Go showed up with simplicity and a good story in performance and memory, deploying simple binaries in a world of complex server infrastructure paved out by Java was a very handy and right on time approach. The problem with Rust now, is that it is target the system programming, in a era of system programming renaissance given the whole mobile app scenery. The problem is; there is already a lot of C++, C, Java, Objective C and Swift code there, so it will be hard to have a good reason to rewrite complex stuff with a lot of man hours in it in Rust. Every language needs a platform. C is here because of Unix, C++ because of Unix, games and early 2000 and 90's era startups. Java and C# because of bussiness software, Go because of the cloud, Ruby and PHP; because of webservers, Rails an blogs, Python for educational purposes, Data Science, ML and now AI. Now what about Rust? Its trying to eat some lunch from C and C++. But a lot of code and value is already there in C and C++, where rewriting it in Rust just for some ocasional added value here and there is not reasonable. Its really tough, and if Rust dont find a platform to grow it will be very hard to advance any further. But, there's always new tech waves and tools that will marry perfectly with them. Lets see which languages are able to be a perfect fit for them in years to come. But right now Rust will depend a lot of the community it already formed to keep sharp and maybe be lucky to surf one of those waves.

dan00 8y ago
> Now what about Rust? Its trying to eat some lunch from C and C++. But a lot of code and value is already there in C and C++, where rewriting it in Rust just for some ocasional added value here and there is not reasonable. For existing software it certainly is less about rewriting it but extending it in Rust. Thanks to not having a runtime and being quite easy to create a shared library with a C-ABI, pretty much any software written in any language could be extended with code written in Rust.
- oscargrouch 8y ago
  > Thanks to not having a runtime and being quite easy to create a shared library with a C-ABI, pretty much any software written in any language could be extended with code written in Rust. Ok, but you kind of added complexity to your codebase. Now you will need not only C++ coders, but also Rust coders. If you are Mozilla or Google you can do that, you eat complexity for breakfast.. But they are probably not the companies you need right now to keep your steady growth, unless of course you are lucky that they created some killer app in Rust because of their in-house use of it. Like Google did recently with Kubernetes, only it is in Go of course, but i guess it checks the square of a killer app which helps into the language adoption as a programming trend. Speaking of Go, it once was suffering from the same problem Rust is going through right now. It was sucessful in a first phase because of its community, but it needed more to start having more adoption and mind share. Then, Docker happened, and Go found a sweet spot to aim for and take it to the second base.
1-KB-OK 8y ago
It's a good point that a language needs a platform to really shine. I think one place where Rust can find it is by targeting WASM and being the first systems language that can compile to code that runs in the browser. The rustc compiler supports WASM out of the box and I think this is one direction that the language adoption is going to grow. Another platform is cryptocurrencies/blockchains- Rust lends itself uniquely as a modern C++ for writing performant blockchain protocols. This is evidenced by the Parity team using Rust exclusively for all their projects. As that world evolves Rust can find a foothold there as well - there is no real legacy code floating around, the Bitcoin protocol is only 10 years old.
- oscargrouch 8y ago
  These are definitely a couple of good bets to be aiming for. The blockchain trend reminds me that Rust could also try to find some cosy home in banking software, in expert systems and in embedded software. The key now is to be humble and not to try to pick up a fight with C and C++ just yet. Go only now is in a position to pick a fight against Java in the server and in the cloud, and Rust will probably need to get into the same point of adoption, if it wants to be seen as a serious contender to those languages in the eyes of the people they need to convince. Unfortunatelly Rust missed a good new trend now, with multi-platform cores for mobile phones that ended up being written mostly in C++. Rust wasnt even invented when people were trying to solve the problem of multi-os phone apps. And that is the current trend which is giving the system development trend a second chance. But is not that bad, because thats exactly what is making people to take a serious look at Rust. Battery life, memory, storage. It all matters again thanks to the phone environments, and you cant afford the be wrapped in layers upon layers of software virtualization like it was common in the early PC era, where Java and C# were kings.

dan00 8y ago

> Now what about Rust? Its trying to eat some lunch from C and C++. But a lot of code and value is already there in C and C++, where rewriting it in Rust just for some ocasional added value here and there is not reasonable. For existing software it certainly is less about rewriting it but extending it in Rust. Thanks to not having a runtime and being quite easy to create a shared library with a C-ABI, pretty much any software written in any language could be extended with code written in Rust.

oscargrouch 8y ago
> Thanks to not having a runtime and being quite easy to create a shared library with a C-ABI, pretty much any software written in any language could be extended with code written in Rust. Ok, but you kind of added complexity to your codebase. Now you will need not only C++ coders, but also Rust coders. If you are Mozilla or Google you can do that, you eat complexity for breakfast.. But they are probably not the companies you need right now to keep your steady growth, unless of course you are lucky that they created some killer app in Rust because of their in-house use of it. Like Google did recently with Kubernetes, only it is in Go of course, but i guess it checks the square of a killer app which helps into the language adoption as a programming trend. Speaking of Go, it once was suffering from the same problem Rust is going through right now. It was sucessful in a first phase because of its community, but it needed more to start having more adoption and mind share. Then, Docker happened, and Go found a sweet spot to aim for and take it to the second base.

1-KB-OK 8y ago

It's a good point that a language needs a platform to really shine. I think one place where Rust can find it is by targeting WASM and being the first systems language that can compile to code that runs in the browser. The rustc compiler supports WASM out of the box and I think this is one direction that the language adoption is going to grow. Another platform is cryptocurrencies/blockchains- Rust lends itself uniquely as a modern C++ for writing performant blockchain protocols. This is evidenced by the Parity team using Rust exclusively for all their projects. As that world evolves Rust can find a foothold there as well - there is no real legacy code floating around, the Bitcoin protocol is only 10 years old.

oscargrouch 8y ago
These are definitely a couple of good bets to be aiming for. The blockchain trend reminds me that Rust could also try to find some cosy home in banking software, in expert systems and in embedded software. The key now is to be humble and not to try to pick up a fight with C and C++ just yet. Go only now is in a position to pick a fight against Java in the server and in the cloud, and Rust will probably need to get into the same point of adoption, if it wants to be seen as a serious contender to those languages in the eyes of the people they need to convince. Unfortunatelly Rust missed a good new trend now, with multi-platform cores for mobile phones that ended up being written mostly in C++. Rust wasnt even invented when people were trying to solve the problem of multi-os phone apps. And that is the current trend which is giving the system development trend a second chance. But is not that bad, because thats exactly what is making people to take a serious look at Rust. Battery life, memory, storage. It all matters again thanks to the phone environments, and you cant afford the be wrapped in layers upon layers of software virtualization like it was common in the early PC era, where Java and C# were kings.