7 ms·

Could the USA or an european nation offer to pay the loan in exchange for taking over the port? Itd be cool to swoop in on this deal.

mc32 8y ago
Russia swooped in to help Venezuela it’s possible there’s an oligarch out there who might be interested. Suppose it depends on the leverage they could get from their state.
- tefferon 8y ago
  imagine mr. bezos with port authority
BigChiefSmokem 8y ago
Globalism is not very popular in the West right now.
- toomuchtodo 8y ago
  Taking vindictive actions against authoritarian regimes never goes out of style.
  - curiousgal 8y ago
    Ah, of course, the U.S. is the leader of standing up for the little guy. The entire West has taken advantage out of African nations but God forbid someone else tries to do that now.
    - toomuchtodo 8y ago
      > The entire West has taken advantage out of African nations but God forbid someone else tries to do that now. As an American citizen, yes. We're not perfect by any means, but we're no authoritarian regime such that China has.
      - supergirl 8y ago
        > The entire West has taken advantage out of African nations > we're not perfect
        toomuchtodo 8y ago
        China is using political prisoners as organ farms. Russia is flat out physically attacking LGBT individuals and lead by a dictator for life. America is still a shining beacon of freedom in comparison.
supergirl 8y ago
so china taking over the port is bad but it's OK if USA does it because they will make it a freedom port?
- some_random 8y ago
  Well, there would probably be less slave labor in the American port so I suppose so.
  - StavrosK 8y ago
    Yep, we all know it's not slave labor if you get prisoners to do it.
    - learc83 8y ago
      I'm completely against using prison labor for profit, and there are inequalities in the US system...but prisoners in the US have had due process. Despite our problems, the protections for the accused in the US are among the best in the world. To pretend that there isn't an enormous difference between labor camps in China and prison labor in the US is absolutely absurd.
      - StavrosK 8y ago
        Your argument is that, because they had a fair trial and were found guilty, it is ethical to force them to work without compensation? > Over the years, the courts have held that inmates may be required to work and are not protected by the constitutional prohibition against involuntary servitude. They have also consistently held that inmates have no constitutional right to compensation and that inmates are paid by the ‘grace of the state.” https://www.gao.gov/assets/220/217999.pdf https://www.gao.gov/assets/220/217999.pdf
        learc83 8y ago
        >Your argument is that, because they had a fair trial and were found guilty, it is ethical to force them to work without compensation? Yes to some extent. I think forcing prisoners to cook their own meals, clean up after themselves etc... is fine. I draw the line at contracting out prisoners for money, or selling products that prisoners make--not because I think requiring work as a part of fairly meted punishment is inherently wrong, but because I believe it creates perverse incentives. My primary argument is that requiring work as a part of punishment for an offense for which they were convicted at a fair trial is not remotely comparable to forcing hundreds of thousands of unconvicted political prisoners into labor camps.
m000 8y ago
Greece should have thought of that: - Provide unfettered economic access to China for 20 years in exchange for having the country's debt paid by them. - Seed a few alarmist articles. - Wait until USA and EU go crazy over that and summarily agree on a debt write-off.
- MFrGfBmq 8y ago
  Greece already leases the port of Piraeus to China. Didn't help much, our country's richest families are shipping magnates.
  - cauldron 8y ago
    I mean Greece is selling EU permanent residency to Chinese for 250K euros (property purchse), you can take with you all your parents and kids, best of all, it doesn't require you to actually live there to get it.
- buboard 8y ago
  Greece did play that card: the government visited china and russia asking for loans . Did not change anything as far as i know. (The chinese already had a strategy for greece and the balkans though which is progressing steadily - they are part of one belt one road)
  - onetimemanytime 8y ago
    Greece is in EU and NATO. EU, monetarily and NATO in defense have Greece by the, you know what. No one can give Greece the money that EU gives them and if Greece loses NATO, Turkey is waiting. So no Chinese or Russian base will be allowed in Greece or Turkey gets a wink and a nod to remind Greece which side the bread is buttered. http://www.ekathimerini.com/235989/article/ekathimerini/news/turkey-warns-of--heavy-price-over-provocations http://www.ekathimerini.com/235989/article/ekathimerini/news...
ssnistfajen 8y ago
Unironic exceptionalism at display right here. Colonialism is only bad if it's not Europe/US doing it. /s
- objektif 8y ago
  Well to be honest China could not have brought democracy to Iraq. First of all they are not a democracy and second they do not have a Dick Cheney. (/s)

mc32 8y ago

Russia swooped in to help Venezuela it’s possible there’s an oligarch out there who might be interested. Suppose it depends on the leverage they could get from their state.

tefferon 8y ago
imagine mr. bezos with port authority

BigChiefSmokem 8y ago

Globalism is not very popular in the West right now.

toomuchtodo 8y ago
Taking vindictive actions against authoritarian regimes never goes out of style.
- curiousgal 8y ago
  Ah, of course, the U.S. is the leader of standing up for the little guy. The entire West has taken advantage out of African nations but God forbid someone else tries to do that now.
  - toomuchtodo 8y ago
    > The entire West has taken advantage out of African nations but God forbid someone else tries to do that now. As an American citizen, yes. We're not perfect by any means, but we're no authoritarian regime such that China has.
    - supergirl 8y ago
      > The entire West has taken advantage out of African nations > we're not perfect
      - toomuchtodo 8y ago
        China is using political prisoners as organ farms. Russia is flat out physically attacking LGBT individuals and lead by a dictator for life. America is still a shining beacon of freedom in comparison.

supergirl 8y ago

so china taking over the port is bad but it's OK if USA does it because they will make it a freedom port?

some_random 8y ago
Well, there would probably be less slave labor in the American port so I suppose so.
- StavrosK 8y ago
  Yep, we all know it's not slave labor if you get prisoners to do it.
  - learc83 8y ago
    I'm completely against using prison labor for profit, and there are inequalities in the US system...but prisoners in the US have had due process. Despite our problems, the protections for the accused in the US are among the best in the world. To pretend that there isn't an enormous difference between labor camps in China and prison labor in the US is absolutely absurd.
    - StavrosK 8y ago
      Your argument is that, because they had a fair trial and were found guilty, it is ethical to force them to work without compensation? > Over the years, the courts have held that inmates may be required to work and are not protected by the constitutional prohibition against involuntary servitude. They have also consistently held that inmates have no constitutional right to compensation and that inmates are paid by the ‘grace of the state.” https://www.gao.gov/assets/220/217999.pdf https://www.gao.gov/assets/220/217999.pdf
      - learc83 8y ago
        >Your argument is that, because they had a fair trial and were found guilty, it is ethical to force them to work without compensation? Yes to some extent. I think forcing prisoners to cook their own meals, clean up after themselves etc... is fine. I draw the line at contracting out prisoners for money, or selling products that prisoners make--not because I think requiring work as a part of fairly meted punishment is inherently wrong, but because I believe it creates perverse incentives. My primary argument is that requiring work as a part of punishment for an offense for which they were convicted at a fair trial is not remotely comparable to forcing hundreds of thousands of unconvicted political prisoners into labor camps.

m000 8y ago

Greece should have thought of that: - Provide unfettered economic access to China for 20 years in exchange for having the country's debt paid by them. - Seed a few alarmist articles. - Wait until USA and EU go crazy over that and summarily agree on a debt write-off.

MFrGfBmq 8y ago
Greece already leases the port of Piraeus to China. Didn't help much, our country's richest families are shipping magnates.
- cauldron 8y ago
  I mean Greece is selling EU permanent residency to Chinese for 250K euros (property purchse), you can take with you all your parents and kids, best of all, it doesn't require you to actually live there to get it.
buboard 8y ago
Greece did play that card: the government visited china and russia asking for loans . Did not change anything as far as i know. (The chinese already had a strategy for greece and the balkans though which is progressing steadily - they are part of one belt one road)
- onetimemanytime 8y ago
  Greece is in EU and NATO. EU, monetarily and NATO in defense have Greece by the, you know what. No one can give Greece the money that EU gives them and if Greece loses NATO, Turkey is waiting. So no Chinese or Russian base will be allowed in Greece or Turkey gets a wink and a nod to remind Greece which side the bread is buttered. http://www.ekathimerini.com/235989/article/ekathimerini/news/turkey-warns-of--heavy-price-over-provocations http://www.ekathimerini.com/235989/article/ekathimerini/news...

ssnistfajen 8y ago

Unironic exceptionalism at display right here. Colonialism is only bad if it's not Europe/US doing it. /s

objektif 8y ago
Well to be honest China could not have brought democracy to Iraq. First of all they are not a democracy and second they do not have a Dick Cheney. (/s)