4 ms·

" He announced that he had studied the US constitution in detail, and—no doubt, forensically examining its propositions one at a time and perhaps testing it aga

by craigr1972 8y ago

" He announced that he had studied the US constitution in detail, and—no doubt, forensically examining its propositions one at a time and perhaps testing it against thought experiments against wild possible futures in which the president was allowed to get out of control—he had discovered how the US could legally be turned into a dictatorship."

oska 8y ago
Suggestions as to what this found flaw might have been has been discussed on Quora a couple of times [1][2] [1] https://www.quora.com/How-did-G%C3%B6del-believe-the-US-could-become-a-dictatorship-without-the-constitution-being-violated https://www.quora.com/How-did-G%C3%B6del-believe-the-US-coul... [2] https://www.quora.com/What-was-the-flaw-Kurt-G%C3%B6del-discovered-in-the-US-constitution-that-would-allow-conversion-to-a-dictatorship https://www.quora.com/What-was-the-flaw-Kurt-G%C3%B6del-disc...
- JoeSmithson 8y ago
  The first answer is from someone claiming a BS from the University of Autodidacts, who finishes with an unexplained dig at the Democratic Party.
DyslexicAtheist 8y ago
sadly this article skips a lot of detail on what happened during and before the hearing and how Einstein tried to coach him. The New Yorker had a much better summary on this. Here in all its hilarity: ---- from https://www.newyorker.com/magazine/2005/02/28/time-bandits-2 https://www.newyorker.com/magazine/2005/02/28/time-bandits-2 So naïve and otherworldly was the great logician that Einstein felt obliged to help look after the practical aspects of his life. One much retailed story concerns Gödel’s decision after the war to become an American citizen. The character witnesses at his hearing were to be Einstein and Oskar Morgenstern, one of the founders of game theory. Gödel took the matter of citizenship with great solemnity, preparing for the exam by making a close study of the United States Constitution. On the eve of the hearing, he called Morgenstern in an agitated state, saying he had found an “inconsistency” in the Constitution, one that could allow a dictatorship to arise. Morgenstern was amused, but he realized that Gödel was serious and urged him not to mention it to the judge, fearing that it would jeopardize Gödel’s citizenship bid. On the short drive to Trenton the next day, with Morgenstern serving as chauffeur, Einstein tried to distract Gödel with jokes. When they arrived at the courthouse, the judge was impressed by Gödel’s eminent witnesses, and he invited the trio into his chambers. After some small talk, he said to Gödel, “Up to now you have held German citizenship.” No, Gödel corrected, Austrian. “In any case, it was under an evil dictatorship,” the judge continued. “Fortunately that’s not possible in America.” “On the contrary, I can prove it is possible!” Gödel exclaimed, and he began describing the constitutional loophole he had descried. But the judge told the examinee that “he needn’t go into that,” and Einstein and Morgenstern succeeded in quieting him down. A few months later, Gödel took his oath of citizenship. ---- Another one: https://www.quickanddirtytips.com/education/science/when-g-del-almost-took-on-the-us-constitution https://www.quickanddirtytips.com/education/science/when-g-d... --- EDIT: something I also missed in this piece was that Gödel developed rheumatic fevers as a child and started reading medical books with the age of 8 to learn more about the condition. He concluded that he had a weak heart :D Gödel is really worth studying closer and this article just leaves out a lot.
- edmundsauto 8y ago
  Coincidentally, I'm reading When Einstein Walked with Godel, and this anecdote is in there. Such an interesting man -- he's up there with Von Neumann for historical figures I'd like to learn more about, as the work they develop is a form of first principles that a lot of modern thought is derived from. Any reccs on books to read, more focused on their theories than their lives?

oska 8y ago

Suggestions as to what this found flaw might have been has been discussed on Quora a couple of times [1][2] [1] https://www.quora.com/How-did-G%C3%B6del-believe-the-US-could-become-a-dictatorship-without-the-constitution-being-violated https://www.quora.com/How-did-G%C3%B6del-believe-the-US-coul... [2] https://www.quora.com/What-was-the-flaw-Kurt-G%C3%B6del-discovered-in-the-US-constitution-that-would-allow-conversion-to-a-dictatorship https://www.quora.com/What-was-the-flaw-Kurt-G%C3%B6del-disc...

JoeSmithson 8y ago
The first answer is from someone claiming a BS from the University of Autodidacts, who finishes with an unexplained dig at the Democratic Party.

DyslexicAtheist 8y ago

sadly this article skips a lot of detail on what happened during and before the hearing and how Einstein tried to coach him. The New Yorker had a much better summary on this. Here in all its hilarity: ---- from https://www.newyorker.com/magazine/2005/02/28/time-bandits-2 https://www.newyorker.com/magazine/2005/02/28/time-bandits-2 So naïve and otherworldly was the great logician that Einstein felt obliged to help look after the practical aspects of his life. One much retailed story concerns Gödel’s decision after the war to become an American citizen. The character witnesses at his hearing were to be Einstein and Oskar Morgenstern, one of the founders of game theory. Gödel took the matter of citizenship with great solemnity, preparing for the exam by making a close study of the United States Constitution. On the eve of the hearing, he called Morgenstern in an agitated state, saying he had found an “inconsistency” in the Constitution, one that could allow a dictatorship to arise. Morgenstern was amused, but he realized that Gödel was serious and urged him not to mention it to the judge, fearing that it would jeopardize Gödel’s citizenship bid. On the short drive to Trenton the next day, with Morgenstern serving as chauffeur, Einstein tried to distract Gödel with jokes. When they arrived at the courthouse, the judge was impressed by Gödel’s eminent witnesses, and he invited the trio into his chambers. After some small talk, he said to Gödel, “Up to now you have held German citizenship.” No, Gödel corrected, Austrian. “In any case, it was under an evil dictatorship,” the judge continued. “Fortunately that’s not possible in America.” “On the contrary, I can prove it is possible!” Gödel exclaimed, and he began describing the constitutional loophole he had descried. But the judge told the examinee that “he needn’t go into that,” and Einstein and Morgenstern succeeded in quieting him down. A few months later, Gödel took his oath of citizenship. ---- Another one: https://www.quickanddirtytips.com/education/science/when-g-del-almost-took-on-the-us-constitution https://www.quickanddirtytips.com/education/science/when-g-d... --- EDIT: something I also missed in this piece was that Gödel developed rheumatic fevers as a child and started reading medical books with the age of 8 to learn more about the condition. He concluded that he had a weak heart :D Gödel is really worth studying closer and this article just leaves out a lot.

edmundsauto 8y ago
Coincidentally, I'm reading When Einstein Walked with Godel, and this anecdote is in there. Such an interesting man -- he's up there with Von Neumann for historical figures I'd like to learn more about, as the work they develop is a form of first principles that a lot of modern thought is derived from. Any reccs on books to read, more focused on their theories than their lives?