4 ms·

Interesting subject - but I found myself pretty quickly lost in the technica terms. I do not even know what an NTP server is.

eropple 8y ago
I don't really understand comments like this on HN. I've derived a lot of value through the years from thoughtful questions asked to dig further into an article but I've never understood why somebody would assert "I don't even know what X is." Search engines exist, yes?
- bytematic 8y ago
  His argument is likely that you shouldn't have to when a simple explanation could fit into the article.
  - eropple 8y ago
    But it's not an "article". It's a blog post. An informal post, written informally, for an obviously technical audience. I very, very rarely explain what "AWS" is when I'm casually writing about cloud stuff. It's table stakes. You should know, or you aren't gonna appreciate reading it anyway.
    - toomuchtodo 8y ago
      Logged in just to upvote your comments. This is a place of intellectual curiosity, and I don’t understand those who expect knowledge to be spoon fed to them. If you don’t know a term, search engine it and work your way down the stack. You might find yourself pleasantly surprised you’re providing an NTP server in the NTP global DNS pool.
      - Drdrdrq 8y ago
        > search engine it... That is, go to google.com or DuckDuckGo.com and search for it... I mean, open the browser, click on location bar (on the top) and write... That is, if you are on Windows, click Start menu (which is now 4 rectangles),... Nevermind... /s
        Wowfunhappy 8y ago
        I use Safari on macOS. When I need to google a term, I highlight it, and then press ⌘C, ⌘T, ⌘V, enter. (Copy the search term, open a new tab, paste into url/search bar, search term) I've gotten quite fast at the keyboard sequence; it takes maybe one second total. I imagine I could make this process even faster with a plugin, But I see no need. I would like to think that most Windows machines would let you be similarly performant by default. But if not, that's further evidence in my book that Windows just sucks... I will note that some acronyms can be annoyingly un-googlable, as the same one stands for a wide variety of different terms. This problem does not apply to ntp, however, which comes up right away.
        sbmassey 8y ago
        Can't you just right click and search from the context menu, since you just highlighted the term so the pointer ought to be in the vicinity.
        Wowfunhappy 8y ago
        ...y'know, I actually forgot that existed. IIRC, at one point, that opened a search in the current tab rather than a new one, so I got used to my little keyboard shortcut instead. The behavior appears to have changed at some point, though, because it now opens searches in a new tab. I'll probably change my behavior now. Thanks for the reminder. ^_^
        Drdrdrq 8y ago
        To downvoters: thanks, always appreciate that. My point was that the OP can't guess their readers' level of knowledge, and it would be impossible for them to cater to all levels (as my attempt to explain searching... failed to show :-/) If readers don't know what NTP is, they should be able to either ignore the blog post or find the missing bits of their knowledge by themselves.
    - Phenomenit 8y ago
      I agree with you but if you take the time to just maybe write out an acronym once its much easier for us who aren't quite there yet technically to understand the context instead of having to search for 4-5 terms. This gives us a chance to enjoy the write up and gives it maybe a broader audience.
      - wpietri 8y ago
        This is a technical person blogging for a technical audience. If you are not tall enough to ride this ride and aren't interested in growing, maybe find another ride. If this were a project blog post explaining their latest features, I'd agree with you. If the point is outreach, then yes, they should make it accessible. But he's telling a story. A story that requires a relatively deep understanding of the history and practice of operating internet services. Him writing "NTP (Network Time Protocol)" will not make the story much clearer. And if he explains the whole background, then it's no longer a story, it's a general-audience essay. That's a lot of work for you to expect from somebody that you aren't paying.
  - TylerE 8y ago
    Then reading what could be an interesting article becomes an exercise in being treated like an intellectual toddler.
NikolaNovak 8y ago
Network time protocol Obscure but critical way servers set their accurate time, but maintained by even more obscure people with limited recognition and reward.
josephpmay 8y ago
I do agree the article could have been much improved by adding a sentence that defined what an NTP server was upfront.
- eropple 8y ago
  As I noted in the sibling: it's not an "article". It's a blog post, written informally, for a familiar audience. If you're stepping in on somebody's semi-public journal, it's probably incumbent upon the reader to do their spadework if they care.
rdiddly 8y ago
You don't actually need to know what NTP is to enjoy this story. I knew I had heard of NTP but had forgotten about it. But it ends in P so it must be some protocol or other, right? Just create a variable in your mind called $protocol and keep reading. It could just as easily be Zuqwatny Protocol at that point for all I care. That said, I went and looked it up after. Because that's what you do.
maxxxxx 8y ago
I feel a little passive aggressive today: http://lmgtfy.com/?q=ntp+server http://lmgtfy.com/?q=ntp+server
rkho 8y ago
If you hover over the first instance of the word NTP on the post, it'll show you that it stands for Network Time Protocol.

eropple 8y ago

I don't really understand comments like this on HN. I've derived a lot of value through the years from thoughtful questions asked to dig further into an article but I've never understood why somebody would assert "I don't even know what X is." Search engines exist, yes?

bytematic 8y ago
His argument is likely that you shouldn't have to when a simple explanation could fit into the article.
- eropple 8y ago
  But it's not an "article". It's a blog post. An informal post, written informally, for an obviously technical audience. I very, very rarely explain what "AWS" is when I'm casually writing about cloud stuff. It's table stakes. You should know, or you aren't gonna appreciate reading it anyway.
  - toomuchtodo 8y ago
    Logged in just to upvote your comments. This is a place of intellectual curiosity, and I don’t understand those who expect knowledge to be spoon fed to them. If you don’t know a term, search engine it and work your way down the stack. You might find yourself pleasantly surprised you’re providing an NTP server in the NTP global DNS pool.
    - Drdrdrq 8y ago
      > search engine it... That is, go to google.com or DuckDuckGo.com and search for it... I mean, open the browser, click on location bar (on the top) and write... That is, if you are on Windows, click Start menu (which is now 4 rectangles),... Nevermind... /s
      - Wowfunhappy 8y ago
        I use Safari on macOS. When I need to google a term, I highlight it, and then press ⌘C, ⌘T, ⌘V, enter. (Copy the search term, open a new tab, paste into url/search bar, search term) I've gotten quite fast at the keyboard sequence; it takes maybe one second total. I imagine I could make this process even faster with a plugin, But I see no need. I would like to think that most Windows machines would let you be similarly performant by default. But if not, that's further evidence in my book that Windows just sucks... I will note that some acronyms can be annoyingly un-googlable, as the same one stands for a wide variety of different terms. This problem does not apply to ntp, however, which comes up right away.
        sbmassey 8y ago
        Can't you just right click and search from the context menu, since you just highlighted the term so the pointer ought to be in the vicinity.
        Wowfunhappy 8y ago
        ...y'know, I actually forgot that existed. IIRC, at one point, that opened a search in the current tab rather than a new one, so I got used to my little keyboard shortcut instead. The behavior appears to have changed at some point, though, because it now opens searches in a new tab. I'll probably change my behavior now. Thanks for the reminder. ^_^
      - Drdrdrq 8y ago
        To downvoters: thanks, always appreciate that. My point was that the OP can't guess their readers' level of knowledge, and it would be impossible for them to cater to all levels (as my attempt to explain searching... failed to show :-/) If readers don't know what NTP is, they should be able to either ignore the blog post or find the missing bits of their knowledge by themselves.
  - Phenomenit 8y ago
    I agree with you but if you take the time to just maybe write out an acronym once its much easier for us who aren't quite there yet technically to understand the context instead of having to search for 4-5 terms. This gives us a chance to enjoy the write up and gives it maybe a broader audience.
    - wpietri 8y ago
      This is a technical person blogging for a technical audience. If you are not tall enough to ride this ride and aren't interested in growing, maybe find another ride. If this were a project blog post explaining their latest features, I'd agree with you. If the point is outreach, then yes, they should make it accessible. But he's telling a story. A story that requires a relatively deep understanding of the history and practice of operating internet services. Him writing "NTP (Network Time Protocol)" will not make the story much clearer. And if he explains the whole background, then it's no longer a story, it's a general-audience essay. That's a lot of work for you to expect from somebody that you aren't paying.
- TylerE 8y ago
  Then reading what could be an interesting article becomes an exercise in being treated like an intellectual toddler.

NikolaNovak 8y ago

Network time protocol Obscure but critical way servers set their accurate time, but maintained by even more obscure people with limited recognition and reward.

josephpmay 8y ago

I do agree the article could have been much improved by adding a sentence that defined what an NTP server was upfront.

eropple 8y ago
As I noted in the sibling: it's not an "article". It's a blog post, written informally, for a familiar audience. If you're stepping in on somebody's semi-public journal, it's probably incumbent upon the reader to do their spadework if they care.

rdiddly 8y ago

You don't actually need to know what NTP is to enjoy this story. I knew I had heard of NTP but had forgotten about it. But it ends in P so it must be some protocol or other, right? Just create a variable in your mind called $protocol and keep reading. It could just as easily be Zuqwatny Protocol at that point for all I care. That said, I went and looked it up after. Because that's what you do.

maxxxxx 8y ago

I feel a little passive aggressive today: http://lmgtfy.com/?q=ntp+server http://lmgtfy.com/?q=ntp+server

rkho 8y ago

If you hover over the first instance of the word NTP on the post, it'll show you that it stands for Network Time Protocol.