4 ms·

Crucifixion was a degrading and viscerally disturbing form of execution, with connotations not unlike hanging or the electric chair today. It was not the kind o

by anjbe 8y ago

Crucifixion was a degrading and viscerally disturbing form of execution, with connotations not unlike hanging or the electric chair today. It was not the kind of thing to centralize one’s messianic cult around. The fact that it happened once is already so bizarre that the crucifixion is considered by historians to be one of the most certain truths of Jesus’ life story.

Retric 8y ago
Crucifiction was a common form of execution at the time. One of the really bizarre things from our perspective is just how many people where executed back then.
- anjbe 8y ago
  Crucifixion was indeed common. What I’m referring to as bizarre is the idea of the Messiah being subject to such a degrading, humiliating, torturous death, which ran totally counter to Jewish thought at the time (and indeed Jewish thought ever).
  - redial 8y ago
    Which is why christianity didn't find many followers among the Jews.
  - betterunix2 8y ago
    It runs counter to the mainstream Jewish thought of the past 1800 years regarding the messiah, but we are talking about a movement that was divergent from what ultimately became "mainstream Judaism" (i.e. the Pharisees). I would also point out that it is not so unique for a messianic claimant to be humiliated yet retain devoted followers: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sabbatai_Zevi https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sabbatai_Zevi Nor would violating mainstream religious views be a terribly unique event when a new movement is picking up followers: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jacob_Frank https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jacob_Frank It is also not as "bizarre" as you might think. Judaism two thousand years ago was highly fragmented, with many different movements all competing for followers and converts; there was no single body of "Jewish thought" at the time. There were different interpretations of the prophecies, and the earliest Christians followed one tradition of interpretations (this is clearly reflected in the gospels -- e.g. Matthew follows the Greco-Jewish tradition and the Septuagint).

by anjbe 8y ago

Retric 8y ago

Crucifiction was a common form of execution at the time. One of the really bizarre things from our perspective is just how many people where executed back then.

anjbe 8y ago
Crucifixion was indeed common. What I’m referring to as bizarre is the idea of the Messiah being subject to such a degrading, humiliating, torturous death, which ran totally counter to Jewish thought at the time (and indeed Jewish thought ever).
- redial 8y ago
  Which is why christianity didn't find many followers among the Jews.
- betterunix2 8y ago
  It runs counter to the mainstream Jewish thought of the past 1800 years regarding the messiah, but we are talking about a movement that was divergent from what ultimately became "mainstream Judaism" (i.e. the Pharisees). I would also point out that it is not so unique for a messianic claimant to be humiliated yet retain devoted followers: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sabbatai_Zevi https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sabbatai_Zevi Nor would violating mainstream religious views be a terribly unique event when a new movement is picking up followers: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jacob_Frank https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jacob_Frank It is also not as "bizarre" as you might think. Judaism two thousand years ago was highly fragmented, with many different movements all competing for followers and converts; there was no single body of "Jewish thought" at the time. There were different interpretations of the prophecies, and the earliest Christians followed one tradition of interpretations (this is clearly reflected in the gospels -- e.g. Matthew follows the Greco-Jewish tradition and the Septuagint).