4 ms·

So what's the effect of widespread use of microwaves (and soon with 5G, terahertz radiation) on the bioelectrical communication that's going on within our bodie

So what's the effect of widespread use of microwaves (and soon with 5G, terahertz radiation) on the bioelectrical communication that's going on within our bodies? I keep seeing industry studies that say there aren't any health effects, but that's purely due to the argument that the thermal effects of microwave radiation aren't sufficient to harm us (i.e. we're not cooking ourselves). What about non-thermal effects? And how do microwaves affect, say, the long-range navigation of birds or insects, which we do know must have an electromagnetic component since they're in part using the Earth's magnetic field?

keithwhor 8y ago
We’re really talking about electrochemical gradients here: sustained bioelectric fields that represent the differential accumulation of ions in cells / tissue. Radiation would need to be ionizing and intense or have enough of a heating effect to materially alter the structure of gated ion channels (like, you literally put an organism in a microwave) to make a difference. In both cases the result would likely be failure to thrive (complete disruption), but moreso due to the fact you’ve destroyed every other protein in the organism in this process. I’m not going to be completely dismissive of possible side effects of long range microwave radiation on tissue, but you’re essentially asking something akin to, “how does my fridge magnet affect the Sun’s magnetic field and boundaries of the heliosphere?” i.e. orders of magnitude differential in effect size. Hope that helps!
- smallnamespace 8y ago
  I wonder what you think about this paper? https://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/full/10.1111/jcmm.12088 https://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/full/10.1111/jcmm.12088 'extensive evidence has been published clearly showing that the EMF exposure can act to produce excessive activity of the VGCCs in many cell types suggesting that these may be direct targets of EMF exposure.' > Radiation would need to be ionizing and intense or have enough of a heating effect to materially alter the structure of gated ion channels I don't understand this point — why is it necessary that radiation be ionizing to affect VGC ion channels in a transient fashion that could still lead to long-term biochemical changes?
sandworm101 8y ago
Because these frequencies dont handle water well. They turn into heat pretty fast when hitting flesh. As for the birds navigating, a thousand 5g cells would have less impact on the earth's magnetic field than a single high voltage powerline.
- mcbits 8y ago
  What if you controlled the backdoor in the baseband processor and pointed a thousand 5G phones' beamforming antennas with full power at one bird (or one person on stage at a protest)?
  - andai 8y ago
    Smells like chicken.
  - sandworm101 8y ago
    Only 1000? At a range of say 100m... you might raise the temperature a degree or two. If the bird stood very still.

keithwhor 8y ago

We’re really talking about electrochemical gradients here: sustained bioelectric fields that represent the differential accumulation of ions in cells / tissue. Radiation would need to be ionizing and intense or have enough of a heating effect to materially alter the structure of gated ion channels (like, you literally put an organism in a microwave) to make a difference. In both cases the result would likely be failure to thrive (complete disruption), but moreso due to the fact you’ve destroyed every other protein in the organism in this process. I’m not going to be completely dismissive of possible side effects of long range microwave radiation on tissue, but you’re essentially asking something akin to, “how does my fridge magnet affect the Sun’s magnetic field and boundaries of the heliosphere?” i.e. orders of magnitude differential in effect size. Hope that helps!

smallnamespace 8y ago
I wonder what you think about this paper? https://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/full/10.1111/jcmm.12088 https://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/full/10.1111/jcmm.12088 'extensive evidence has been published clearly showing that the EMF exposure can act to produce excessive activity of the VGCCs in many cell types suggesting that these may be direct targets of EMF exposure.' > Radiation would need to be ionizing and intense or have enough of a heating effect to materially alter the structure of gated ion channels I don't understand this point — why is it necessary that radiation be ionizing to affect VGC ion channels in a transient fashion that could still lead to long-term biochemical changes?

sandworm101 8y ago

Because these frequencies dont handle water well. They turn into heat pretty fast when hitting flesh. As for the birds navigating, a thousand 5g cells would have less impact on the earth's magnetic field than a single high voltage powerline.

mcbits 8y ago
What if you controlled the backdoor in the baseband processor and pointed a thousand 5G phones' beamforming antennas with full power at one bird (or one person on stage at a protest)?
- andai 8y ago
  Smells like chicken.
- sandworm101 8y ago
  Only 1000? At a range of say 100m... you might raise the temperature a degree or two. If the bird stood very still.