> Most developers of Java I've encountered Java has about 10M developers, who do everything from developing banking systems, GMail, Netflix, to people writing

> Most developers of Java I've encountered Java has about 10M developers, who do everything from developing banking systems, GMail, Netflix, to people writing avionics, air-trafic and weapons control, and manufacturing control. Even 1% of Java developers is more than many language's entire ecosystems. > I think Java has a lot of merit, but it also has an "ecosystem" rife with bloated, dogmatic, hyper-abstracted code that was never really given a thought about optimality and requires purchasing big servers with lots of RAM. Again, it's really hard to generalize with such a diverse ecosystem. 1% of Java developers is still ~100K developers. > that stems from lack of understanding that there are still big juicy low hanging fruit to be found and incorporated into our tools I'm not sure there are, but if so -- go ahead and prove it. > The line about "lots of smart people have been optimizing the JVM for a long time" seems like a go-to defense of what I see as stagnation. Well, as one of the many people working on OpenJDK, I won't comment on that :)