6 ms·

USA added to list of most dangerous countries for journalists

78 points by kevmo 8y ago

danielvf 8y ago
This list is by actual deaths during the year, not a prediction of future danger or government policies. The US is on the list this year because of a mass shooting at a newspaper. The full PDF report is much more interesting than the article. https://rsf.org/sites/default/files/worldwilde_round-up.pdf https://rsf.org/sites/default/files/worldwilde_round-up.pdf The report also notes that worldwide journalist deaths are down, and for the first time in 15 years, no journalist deaths in Iraq.
- cf141q5325 8y ago
  >The US is on the list this year because of a mass shooting at a newspaper. The Annapolis shooting to be precise. >Meanwhile, the shooting deaths of five employees of the Capital Gazette newspaper in Annapolis, Maryland, in June propelled the United States into the ranks of the most dangerous countries for the first time.
  - danielvf 8y ago
    https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Capital_Gazette_shooting https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Capital_Gazette_shooting
  - wil421 8y ago
    There was also a hurricane that killed 2 journalists.
Brendinooo 8y ago
For what it's worth, the word "dangerous" never appears in the report, unless my Find feature isn't working well in the PDF. "Dangerous" is a value judgment; the PDF is a report on journalists who were "killed, detained, held hostage, or missing." Note that this doesn't include harassment, another metric that could be possibly quantified and used to inform a theoretical "danger" ranking. I guess what I'm leaning towards is that NBC News has a lot of spin in this piece. The headline makes you think it's about the US. The lede cites Khashoggi and tries to conflate it with general hostility towards the media in the United States, but his death was a very different situation (and different country!). Then it cites the global figure without saying "worldwide" in the paragraph, while never explicitly saying that the total death count in the US is 6. The report also shows that zero journalists were jailed in the US and zero were taken hostage. I don't wish to minimize anyone's death. But the piece gives off a feeling that the US is becoming Saudi Arabia, yet the reason it's in this list at all is because of two events that don't really feel systemic: Capital Gazette, and hurricanes. (Could argue that mass shootings feel systemic in the US, but not mass shootings targeting journalists. No, I don't feel great trying to make that distinction.) ADDENDUM: How many people are working in the US as journalists? A quick search was tough to nail down. And, even with the mass shooting that hopefully proves to be a statistical anomaly, how does the deaths per 100,000 in the US compare to the 3.6 per 100,000 in the US's workplace at large?[0] Also, edited this to remove my confusion about where Khashoggi died. ---------- [0]: https://247wallst.com/special-report/2018/01/02/25-most-dangerous-jobs-in-america/ https://247wallst.com/special-report/2018/01/02/25-most-dang...
- simion314 8y ago
  Still, if you compare with other countries it is still dangerous to write something bad about some person because in US even known people with mental or behavior issues can get their hands on powerful guns. So relative to other US professions maybe is as dangerous but relative to other countries it is on the top of the list.
  - bitrrrate 8y ago
    Also a president with mental issues uses his powerful position to call the press “the enemy of the people”. Then his mentally unstable followers send bombs or get their hands on assault weapons.
    - magduf 8y ago
      What's extremely worrying is that his election and subsequent events have shown a very sizable portion of the electorate to have problems with mental stability.
- benwerd 8y ago
  Did you read the report? The 6 journalists were the 4 slain in Annapolis and the 2 killed by a falling tree. Khashoggi was killed in Istanbul, not the US.
  - yorwba 8y ago
    > Please don't insinuate that someone hasn't read an article. "Did you even read the article? It mentions that" can be shortened to "The article mentions that." https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html
    - weberc2 8y ago
      He referred to the report referenced in the article, not the article itself. Seems like a fair question; I don’t chase down citations often.
sys_64738 8y ago
Khashoggi was killed in Turkey so does that really count as an American death? Perhaps the fact that the USA didn't impose sanctions on the country alleged to be involved influenced that view.

78 points by kevmo 8y ago

This list is by actual deaths during the year, not a prediction of future danger or government policies. The US is on the list this year because of a mass shooting at a newspaper. The full PDF report is much more interesting than the article. https://rsf.org/sites/default/files/worldwilde_round-up.pdf https://rsf.org/sites/default/files/worldwilde_round-up.pdf The report also notes that worldwide journalist deaths are down, and for the first time in 15 years, no journalist deaths in Iraq.

cf141q5325 8y ago
>The US is on the list this year because of a mass shooting at a newspaper. The Annapolis shooting to be precise. >Meanwhile, the shooting deaths of five employees of the Capital Gazette newspaper in Annapolis, Maryland, in June propelled the United States into the ranks of the most dangerous countries for the first time.
- danielvf 8y ago
  https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Capital_Gazette_shooting https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Capital_Gazette_shooting
- wil421 8y ago
  There was also a hurricane that killed 2 journalists.

Brendinooo 8y ago

For what it's worth, the word "dangerous" never appears in the report, unless my Find feature isn't working well in the PDF. "Dangerous" is a value judgment; the PDF is a report on journalists who were "killed, detained, held hostage, or missing." Note that this doesn't include harassment, another metric that could be possibly quantified and used to inform a theoretical "danger" ranking. I guess what I'm leaning towards is that NBC News has a lot of spin in this piece. The headline makes you think it's about the US. The lede cites Khashoggi and tries to conflate it with general hostility towards the media in the United States, but his death was a very different situation (and different country!). Then it cites the global figure without saying "worldwide" in the paragraph, while never explicitly saying that the total death count in the US is 6. The report also shows that zero journalists were jailed in the US and zero were taken hostage. I don't wish to minimize anyone's death. But the piece gives off a feeling that the US is becoming Saudi Arabia, yet the reason it's in this list at all is because of two events that don't really feel systemic: Capital Gazette, and hurricanes. (Could argue that mass shootings feel systemic in the US, but not mass shootings targeting journalists. No, I don't feel great trying to make that distinction.) ADDENDUM: How many people are working in the US as journalists? A quick search was tough to nail down. And, even with the mass shooting that hopefully proves to be a statistical anomaly, how does the deaths per 100,000 in the US compare to the 3.6 per 100,000 in the US's workplace at large?[0] Also, edited this to remove my confusion about where Khashoggi died. ---------- [0]: https://247wallst.com/special-report/2018/01/02/25-most-dangerous-jobs-in-america/ https://247wallst.com/special-report/2018/01/02/25-most-dang...

simion314 8y ago
Still, if you compare with other countries it is still dangerous to write something bad about some person because in US even known people with mental or behavior issues can get their hands on powerful guns. So relative to other US professions maybe is as dangerous but relative to other countries it is on the top of the list.
- bitrrrate 8y ago
  Also a president with mental issues uses his powerful position to call the press “the enemy of the people”. Then his mentally unstable followers send bombs or get their hands on assault weapons.
  - magduf 8y ago
    What's extremely worrying is that his election and subsequent events have shown a very sizable portion of the electorate to have problems with mental stability.
benwerd 8y ago
Did you read the report? The 6 journalists were the 4 slain in Annapolis and the 2 killed by a falling tree. Khashoggi was killed in Istanbul, not the US.
- yorwba 8y ago
  > Please don't insinuate that someone hasn't read an article. "Did you even read the article? It mentions that" can be shortened to "The article mentions that." https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html
  - weberc2 8y ago
    He referred to the report referenced in the article, not the article itself. Seems like a fair question; I don’t chase down citations often.

sys_64738 8y ago

Khashoggi was killed in Turkey so does that really count as an American death? Perhaps the fact that the USA didn't impose sanctions on the country alleged to be involved influenced that view.