3 ms·

Frankly I think the world is (rightly) going the way of DSP + objective (probably class D more and more) power amp. If there is something nice about tubes, it i

Frankly I think the world is (rightly) going the way of DSP + objective (probably class D more and more) power amp. If there is something nice about tubes, it is probably captured in somebody's software by now.

WalterBright 8y ago
I don't know about the dynamics of tubes, but I have yet to hear a credible replication of the sound of a trumpet with a synthesizer.
- Applejinx 8y ago
  Hell, you're not going to get a credible replication of the sound of a trumpet off a CD… not compared to real life. Trumpets are among the few sorts of instruments that produce an overtone sequence going WAY beyond human hearing. It might not take that much more to cover those bases (I personally think 24/96 is more than enough and as such ought to be considered the baseline) and the heavy lifting will definitely be done by the amplification and speakers, but even a compact disc is going to fall short, much less a synthesizer.
  - WalterBright 8y ago
    I well know that any playback of recorded sound is hopelessly inadequate compared to live sound (I don't know why). But listen to any Herb Alpert recording, and then listen to any synthesized trumpet. The gulf is as wide as the Atlantic. (Part of the reason is that Alpert plays with the notes and the transitions, while a synthesizer just emits a note.)
    - microcolonel 8y ago
      > while a synthesizer just emits a note Well, maybe a crap one, or one not designed for that. Trumpets have some convenient physics that are (comparatively) simple to model, the problem you're thinking of may have more to do with the control system (i.e. not based on actuation of valves, but skipping right to the oscillators) than some inherent weakness of synthesis.
      - WalterBright 8y ago
        I've heard a lot of synthetic trumpet sounds on various popular songs. None sound much like a trumpet, so I am skeptical it is a "simple to model" problem. (I played a trumpet as a kid, so I suppose my ear for it is more discerning than most. My talent proved elusive, but the lasting value was I can appreciate how incredibly good Herb Alpert was. He could play like Fred Astaire could dance and Ernst Udet could fly.)
- pjc5e 8y ago
  The problem of synthesizing a believable trumpet sound is way harder than creating a believable tube distortion. The trumpet is a complex system consisting of the the interplay between the horn and the lips, tongue, throat and lungs of player. Also, the way you interact with the trumpet is widely different from the way you play a piano, resulting in different musical expression. Compared to that, the dynamic of a tube are pretty simple, though creating a truthful emulation of a full amplifier is still a hard.
- dharma1 8y ago
  I don't think tubes will help much for synthesising a trumpet. You can get pretty good results with physical modeling, though. https://youtu.be/nRkT2PyH3kg https://youtu.be/nRkT2PyH3kg

WalterBright 8y ago

I don't know about the dynamics of tubes, but I have yet to hear a credible replication of the sound of a trumpet with a synthesizer.

Applejinx 8y ago
Hell, you're not going to get a credible replication of the sound of a trumpet off a CD… not compared to real life. Trumpets are among the few sorts of instruments that produce an overtone sequence going WAY beyond human hearing. It might not take that much more to cover those bases (I personally think 24/96 is more than enough and as such ought to be considered the baseline) and the heavy lifting will definitely be done by the amplification and speakers, but even a compact disc is going to fall short, much less a synthesizer.
- WalterBright 8y ago
  I well know that any playback of recorded sound is hopelessly inadequate compared to live sound (I don't know why). But listen to any Herb Alpert recording, and then listen to any synthesized trumpet. The gulf is as wide as the Atlantic. (Part of the reason is that Alpert plays with the notes and the transitions, while a synthesizer just emits a note.)
  - microcolonel 8y ago
    > while a synthesizer just emits a note Well, maybe a crap one, or one not designed for that. Trumpets have some convenient physics that are (comparatively) simple to model, the problem you're thinking of may have more to do with the control system (i.e. not based on actuation of valves, but skipping right to the oscillators) than some inherent weakness of synthesis.
    - WalterBright 8y ago
      I've heard a lot of synthetic trumpet sounds on various popular songs. None sound much like a trumpet, so I am skeptical it is a "simple to model" problem. (I played a trumpet as a kid, so I suppose my ear for it is more discerning than most. My talent proved elusive, but the lasting value was I can appreciate how incredibly good Herb Alpert was. He could play like Fred Astaire could dance and Ernst Udet could fly.)
pjc5e 8y ago
The problem of synthesizing a believable trumpet sound is way harder than creating a believable tube distortion. The trumpet is a complex system consisting of the the interplay between the horn and the lips, tongue, throat and lungs of player. Also, the way you interact with the trumpet is widely different from the way you play a piano, resulting in different musical expression. Compared to that, the dynamic of a tube are pretty simple, though creating a truthful emulation of a full amplifier is still a hard.
dharma1 8y ago
I don't think tubes will help much for synthesising a trumpet. You can get pretty good results with physical modeling, though. https://youtu.be/nRkT2PyH3kg https://youtu.be/nRkT2PyH3kg