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This needs careful consideration if you ever decide to do it. Depending on the local criminal culture they could exact revenge. Then also know where you live an

by rdtsc 8y ago

This needs careful consideration if you ever decide to do it. Depending on the local criminal culture they could exact revenge. Then also know where you live and can do a lot worse things than taking a package. Police might later be involved but it might not be worth it. You are dealing with people who have no qualms stealing so it's not too crazy to expect other rash and illegal acts from them. I can also see some intrepid crooks suing for glitter damaging their eyesight permanently or some other bullshit claim. Some attorney or DA might decide to get free publicity and see if they can swing a "injured by booby trap" case.

kgwxd 8y ago
Leave it on your enemies porch while they're away on vacation, then any revenge will be had on your enemy. Or your enemy opens the box.
- bena 8y ago
  This is another level of thinking
- dragonwriter 8y ago
  > Leave it on your enemies porch while they're away on vacation But hope your enemy doesn't have a porch camera...
move-on-by 8y ago
> You are dealing with people who have no qualms stealing, it's not too crazy to expect other rash and illegal acts from them. In more then one instance the thief opened the package at their house. So its fair to say he knows where they live too. Also, very clear HD video of their faces and vehicles. And there is no way all the glitter is going to get cleaned up - so more evidence of who they are. And home security cameras with more images of them. Not to say these idiots are smart enough to let things be at this point - but if they do retaliate, there is a very high chance they would be caught. As for your comments about liability. Yeah, that sounds entirely plausible.
- jboy55 8y ago
  Sadly, a video of a random figure with face obscured throwing a rock through your car window isn't going to get the police involved. Even with a GPS location of someone you pranked with a package, if there's no evidence directly tying the two incidents, the police aren't going to waste resources doing CSI on it. They'll just write you a police report so you can get your insurance paid.
  - EForEndeavour 8y ago
    Disturbingly, the accidental message of this glitterbomb booby-trap video is that you will probably not face legal consequences for stealing packages from peoples' property in broad daylight, so even the best security cameras are effectively useless.
    - dkonofalski 8y ago
      That was my takeaway from this. It just gives the package thieves more reason to do it because, even if they do get caught on video, there's nothing that's going to be done about it.
      - jboy55 8y ago
        Well, if someone goes and grabs 10 packages, and they have 15 random things, 14 of those won't be worth selling for $. If I think about the last 10 things I've ordered, and my thinking of my last garage sale. Nothing was really that valuable that there would be an easy sell.
        EForEndeavour 8y ago
        I would expect the fact that most packages are of low value to increase theft, not discourage it. Lower-value packages carry even less chance of repercussions, and incentivize thieves to steal even more packages to make sure their effort is worthwhile.
kitd 8y ago
On the one hand, I suspect this type of crime is more the realm of opportunists rather than hard-core criminals who would exact revenge. On the other, glitter is actually quite polluting, so my preference would be some means of spraying the thief with brightly coloured dye.
- dvtrn 8y ago
  I suspect this type of crime is more the realm of opportunists rather than hard-core criminals who would exact revenge. One could argue that so called 'hard-core' criminals were once and in some cases still are opportunists, even if the outcomes of their crimes might or might not be more severe than stealing an Amazon package from someone's door step. That aside though, I'm curious: What makes you think an opportunist who clearly has the time and means to swipe packages from someone's door while they're at work wouldn't take similar time and opportunity to conduct other forms of petty deviance like vandalizing the car of someone who blasted them with glitter? They clearly have no qualm or compunction with theft, is avenge-fueled-vandalism that far up the logic latter to next steps?
- robocat 8y ago
  > brightly coloured dye So that the unwitting landlord can be penalised as well?
  - usefulcat 8y ago
    That's what a deposit is for.
- electricslpnsld 8y ago
  > On the one hand, I suspect this type of crime is more the realm of opportunists rather than hard-core criminals who would exact revenge. Eh, somewhere in between. Back when I lived in Oakland (where there was/is a serious package theft problem) everyone in the neighborhood knew who stole folks’ deliveries (camera systems are basically free these days). It happened daily and the cops were too busy fending off corruption and sex trafficking scandals to give a damn. 20% of the time it was some high schooler and you would yell at their parents and get your shit back. 80% of the time it was semi-organized teams of people from a few towns over who would roll up to the end of the street in plate-less cars and drop a couple dudes off on foot. Dudes on foot would walk down the street and grab packages off people’s porches while the car would drive up to the next intersection. Dudes hop in the car, car hits the freeway and is in another city (and soon County) in no time. Definitely intentional crimes (these things take planning, including networks to fence the stolen goods), but if you yell at them they just move on the next house without retailiating. The second you start harrasing people and causing a ruckus the police have fewer excuses to ignore the issue, and your easy source of cash is gone.
kawfey 8y ago
I learned from Nextdoor, that a neighbor of mine put cat litter in an amazon box, and later found out her car's driver side window busted in and the litter dumped on the seat. I now just have packages sent to lockers and UPS/FedEX access points, and I know a few who have packages delivered to their office. The crappy part is that she captured clear detail of both events but police couldn't be bothered. Nest and Ring have been doing their part to fight back, allowing people to publicly post and set up neighborhood watches against porch pirates et al, but there's still a ways to go before security camera footage can be sent to the PD and automatically identify the offender via facial analysis.
- DickingAround 8y ago
  That is a real shame. If the police are not going to mediate property disputes between people, they take a lot of risk those disputes will escalate into violence. Perhaps really-good passive defense is enough (e.g. package lock boxes) but I also hope the police understand the deeper reasoning around their position and role.
  - netsharc 8y ago
    Having lived in a "3rd world" country, I know the police there is useless, but it's interesting how things like resource issues (not enough manpower) is slowly turning living standards of rich countries like the US and UK towards "3rd world" levels.
    - Jyaif 8y ago
      Robbers and burglers basically have immunity now because the police is busy with... I'm not sure what.
      - roseburg 8y ago
        Most departments are understaffed. Turns out all the negative press against police is having long term impacts on how many kids want to grow up and become a police officer. Also property crimes always take a backseat to more violent crimes.
quotha 8y ago
I think what needs more careful consideration is deciding whether or not to steal parcels!
- rdtsc 8y ago
  The point was that the package owner can make the situation worse for themselves by engaging in a revenge scheme. It highly depends on the local criminal culture. I some countries, I can see a gang deciding that the homeowner needs to be "taught a lesson". Police might catch them even, but the package owner might be in the hospital or morgue by then.
  - quotha 8y ago
    Yeah, in some countries the criminals are taught a lesson.
    - i_am_nomad 8y ago
      We call those countries Texas, Virginia and Florida.
  - CamperBob2 8y ago
    (Shrug) There are worse things than glitter. If I order a gympie gympie plant on eBay and someone steals it off my porch, for instance, I can hardly be held responsible for the outcome. The police will just laugh at the thief, the doctors and nurses will stifle a chuckle or two of their own, and the jury in a civil trial isn't likely to be sympathetic.
kevinmchugh 8y ago
You are dealing with people who have decided the expected value of a package on a porch is positive, even though they are not the legal owners of that package.
- rdtsc 8y ago
  > You are dealing with people who have decided the expected value of a package on a porch is positive, even though they are not the legal owners of that package Just not sure I'd trust them them to decide that exacting revenge on me for setting off a glitter and stink bomb in their car/house would have a negative expected value?
mmcwilliams 8y ago
Another thing that's risky about this approach is, depending on your jurisdiction, recording an individual (audio or video in some cases) without their consent is a felony.
- entity345 8y ago
  Where is it a felony to have a CCTV?
  - mmcwilliams 8y ago
    In California, New York and Rhode Island it's illegal to place a hidden video camera in a place where people have a reasonable expectation of privacy. These would be considered hidden video cameras. Not sure the severity of the charges in those states, but in other jurisdictions recording audio of conversations without all-party consent violates wiretapping laws and is a felony.
    - entity345 8y ago
      Well that's quite different from putting a CCTV on your front porch... which isn't a felony.
      - mmcwilliams 8y ago
        If your intention is for someone to take the CCTV into their private car or residence, that is also very different from putting a CCTV on your porch. I'm not saying the thieves are in the right here. Just that crimes don't usually cancel each other out.
        behringer 8y ago
        Considering thieves aren't being prosecuted for theft, I wouldn't worry much about it.
        arkades 8y ago
pvaldes 8y ago
> Then also know where you live And you know were they live also. One side has much more to lose than the other. The guy can exert devastating social damage in the life of the thieves just showing the videos in their street, to their landlord, or filtering it to a friend in the same school, not to mention uploading them to internet. Their faces are clearly seen on film stealing. Their address is known. In some cases even their cars are known also. The logical step for a smart thief would be to move to easier targets and avoid bothering a guy able to spend six entire months building a very complicated plot to seek exact revenge.
jacquesm 8y ago
Technically all true. I'd still do it. Screw them.
jiveturkey 8y ago
now that the video has gone viral, this guy is potentially in big trouble. booby traps are illegal per se. and if someone claims latent injury (eg glitter in tear duct) ... watch out. he has also inspired people to make their own booby traps.
- jboles 8y ago
  There seems to be a principle around that but it applies only to children and trespassing, not adults and theft. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Attractive_nuisance_doctrine https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Attractive_nuisance_doctrine
  - stordoff 8y ago
    It doesn't apply in the US, but I'd be cautious of a claim under the Occupiers' Liability Act under English Law. It covers all persons, including trespassers: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Occupiers%27_liability_in_English_law https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Occupiers%27_liability_in_Engl...

by rdtsc 8y ago

kgwxd 8y ago

Leave it on your enemies porch while they're away on vacation, then any revenge will be had on your enemy. Or your enemy opens the box.

bena 8y ago
This is another level of thinking
dragonwriter 8y ago
> Leave it on your enemies porch while they're away on vacation But hope your enemy doesn't have a porch camera...

move-on-by 8y ago

> You are dealing with people who have no qualms stealing, it's not too crazy to expect other rash and illegal acts from them. In more then one instance the thief opened the package at their house. So its fair to say he knows where they live too. Also, very clear HD video of their faces and vehicles. And there is no way all the glitter is going to get cleaned up - so more evidence of who they are. And home security cameras with more images of them. Not to say these idiots are smart enough to let things be at this point - but if they do retaliate, there is a very high chance they would be caught. As for your comments about liability. Yeah, that sounds entirely plausible.

jboy55 8y ago
Sadly, a video of a random figure with face obscured throwing a rock through your car window isn't going to get the police involved. Even with a GPS location of someone you pranked with a package, if there's no evidence directly tying the two incidents, the police aren't going to waste resources doing CSI on it. They'll just write you a police report so you can get your insurance paid.
- EForEndeavour 8y ago
  Disturbingly, the accidental message of this glitterbomb booby-trap video is that you will probably not face legal consequences for stealing packages from peoples' property in broad daylight, so even the best security cameras are effectively useless.
  - dkonofalski 8y ago
    That was my takeaway from this. It just gives the package thieves more reason to do it because, even if they do get caught on video, there's nothing that's going to be done about it.
    - jboy55 8y ago
      Well, if someone goes and grabs 10 packages, and they have 15 random things, 14 of those won't be worth selling for $. If I think about the last 10 things I've ordered, and my thinking of my last garage sale. Nothing was really that valuable that there would be an easy sell.
      - EForEndeavour 8y ago
        I would expect the fact that most packages are of low value to increase theft, not discourage it. Lower-value packages carry even less chance of repercussions, and incentivize thieves to steal even more packages to make sure their effort is worthwhile.

kitd 8y ago

On the one hand, I suspect this type of crime is more the realm of opportunists rather than hard-core criminals who would exact revenge. On the other, glitter is actually quite polluting, so my preference would be some means of spraying the thief with brightly coloured dye.

dvtrn 8y ago
I suspect this type of crime is more the realm of opportunists rather than hard-core criminals who would exact revenge. One could argue that so called 'hard-core' criminals were once and in some cases still are opportunists, even if the outcomes of their crimes might or might not be more severe than stealing an Amazon package from someone's door step. That aside though, I'm curious: What makes you think an opportunist who clearly has the time and means to swipe packages from someone's door while they're at work wouldn't take similar time and opportunity to conduct other forms of petty deviance like vandalizing the car of someone who blasted them with glitter? They clearly have no qualm or compunction with theft, is avenge-fueled-vandalism that far up the logic latter to next steps?
robocat 8y ago
> brightly coloured dye So that the unwitting landlord can be penalised as well?
- usefulcat 8y ago
  That's what a deposit is for.
electricslpnsld 8y ago
> On the one hand, I suspect this type of crime is more the realm of opportunists rather than hard-core criminals who would exact revenge. Eh, somewhere in between. Back when I lived in Oakland (where there was/is a serious package theft problem) everyone in the neighborhood knew who stole folks’ deliveries (camera systems are basically free these days). It happened daily and the cops were too busy fending off corruption and sex trafficking scandals to give a damn. 20% of the time it was some high schooler and you would yell at their parents and get your shit back. 80% of the time it was semi-organized teams of people from a few towns over who would roll up to the end of the street in plate-less cars and drop a couple dudes off on foot. Dudes on foot would walk down the street and grab packages off people’s porches while the car would drive up to the next intersection. Dudes hop in the car, car hits the freeway and is in another city (and soon County) in no time. Definitely intentional crimes (these things take planning, including networks to fence the stolen goods), but if you yell at them they just move on the next house without retailiating. The second you start harrasing people and causing a ruckus the police have fewer excuses to ignore the issue, and your easy source of cash is gone.

kawfey 8y ago

I learned from Nextdoor, that a neighbor of mine put cat litter in an amazon box, and later found out her car's driver side window busted in and the litter dumped on the seat. I now just have packages sent to lockers and UPS/FedEX access points, and I know a few who have packages delivered to their office. The crappy part is that she captured clear detail of both events but police couldn't be bothered. Nest and Ring have been doing their part to fight back, allowing people to publicly post and set up neighborhood watches against porch pirates et al, but there's still a ways to go before security camera footage can be sent to the PD and automatically identify the offender via facial analysis.

DickingAround 8y ago
That is a real shame. If the police are not going to mediate property disputes between people, they take a lot of risk those disputes will escalate into violence. Perhaps really-good passive defense is enough (e.g. package lock boxes) but I also hope the police understand the deeper reasoning around their position and role.
- netsharc 8y ago
  Having lived in a "3rd world" country, I know the police there is useless, but it's interesting how things like resource issues (not enough manpower) is slowly turning living standards of rich countries like the US and UK towards "3rd world" levels.
  - Jyaif 8y ago
    Robbers and burglers basically have immunity now because the police is busy with... I'm not sure what.
    - roseburg 8y ago
      Most departments are understaffed. Turns out all the negative press against police is having long term impacts on how many kids want to grow up and become a police officer. Also property crimes always take a backseat to more violent crimes.

quotha 8y ago

I think what needs more careful consideration is deciding whether or not to steal parcels!

rdtsc 8y ago
The point was that the package owner can make the situation worse for themselves by engaging in a revenge scheme. It highly depends on the local criminal culture. I some countries, I can see a gang deciding that the homeowner needs to be "taught a lesson". Police might catch them even, but the package owner might be in the hospital or morgue by then.
- quotha 8y ago
  Yeah, in some countries the criminals are taught a lesson.
  - i_am_nomad 8y ago
    We call those countries Texas, Virginia and Florida.
- CamperBob2 8y ago
  (Shrug) There are worse things than glitter. If I order a gympie gympie plant on eBay and someone steals it off my porch, for instance, I can hardly be held responsible for the outcome. The police will just laugh at the thief, the doctors and nurses will stifle a chuckle or two of their own, and the jury in a civil trial isn't likely to be sympathetic.

kevinmchugh 8y ago

You are dealing with people who have decided the expected value of a package on a porch is positive, even though they are not the legal owners of that package.

rdtsc 8y ago
> You are dealing with people who have decided the expected value of a package on a porch is positive, even though they are not the legal owners of that package Just not sure I'd trust them them to decide that exacting revenge on me for setting off a glitter and stink bomb in their car/house would have a negative expected value?

mmcwilliams 8y ago

Another thing that's risky about this approach is, depending on your jurisdiction, recording an individual (audio or video in some cases) without their consent is a felony.

entity345 8y ago
Where is it a felony to have a CCTV?
- mmcwilliams 8y ago
  In California, New York and Rhode Island it's illegal to place a hidden video camera in a place where people have a reasonable expectation of privacy. These would be considered hidden video cameras. Not sure the severity of the charges in those states, but in other jurisdictions recording audio of conversations without all-party consent violates wiretapping laws and is a felony.
  - entity345 8y ago
    Well that's quite different from putting a CCTV on your front porch... which isn't a felony.
    - mmcwilliams 8y ago
      If your intention is for someone to take the CCTV into their private car or residence, that is also very different from putting a CCTV on your porch. I'm not saying the thieves are in the right here. Just that crimes don't usually cancel each other out.
      - behringer 8y ago
        Considering thieves aren't being prosecuted for theft, I wouldn't worry much about it.
      - arkades 8y ago

pvaldes 8y ago

> Then also know where you live And you know were they live also. One side has much more to lose than the other. The guy can exert devastating social damage in the life of the thieves just showing the videos in their street, to their landlord, or filtering it to a friend in the same school, not to mention uploading them to internet. Their faces are clearly seen on film stealing. Their address is known. In some cases even their cars are known also. The logical step for a smart thief would be to move to easier targets and avoid bothering a guy able to spend six entire months building a very complicated plot to seek exact revenge.

jacquesm 8y ago

Technically all true. I'd still do it. Screw them.

jiveturkey 8y ago

now that the video has gone viral, this guy is potentially in big trouble. booby traps are illegal per se. and if someone claims latent injury (eg glitter in tear duct) ... watch out. he has also inspired people to make their own booby traps.

jboles 8y ago
There seems to be a principle around that but it applies only to children and trespassing, not adults and theft. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Attractive_nuisance_doctrine https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Attractive_nuisance_doctrine
- stordoff 8y ago
  It doesn't apply in the US, but I'd be cautious of a claim under the Occupiers' Liability Act under English Law. It covers all persons, including trespassers: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Occupiers%27_liability_in_English_law https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Occupiers%27_liability_in_Engl...