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In the Netherlands, when I order a package and no one's at home when it's delivered, it either gets delivered to my neighbors or to the post office, with a note

In the Netherlands, when I order a package and no one's at home when it's delivered, it either gets delivered to my neighbors or to the post office, with a note of where to pick it up. It's never left at my door AFAIK. How is this not an option in the US?

johnlp 8y ago
It is depending on your location and which carrier is delivering the package. In a city you wouldn't typically see the package left on the doorstep. However out in the suburbs they get left as there is still a peculiar notion of wholesomeness.
- learc83 8y ago
  >there is still a peculiar notion of wholesomeness It's less to do with wholesomeness than it is with a lower population density (there's also a lower crime rate in general in the suburbs, though it's less of a difference than it was 25 years ago). In the suburbs you have far fewer people walking past your doorstep--fewer crimes of opportunity. You're also much more likely to be noticed as being out of place if you're driving around a quiet neighborhood looking for packages.
mcphage 8y ago
Generally because people don't want it. Shipping used to be a lot stricter about signatures, etc, but people usually aren't home when the packages get delivered, and package theft isn't a significant enough problem to make the extra security worth the inconvenience.
- chrisseaton 8y ago
  > package theft isn't a significant enough problem This guy had his package stolen many times in a short space of time. Seems like the problem is pretty bad?
  - ionforce 8y ago
    One data point does not suddenly disprove the OP's overall statement.
    - deleted 8y ago
      [deleted]
  - CPLX 8y ago
    He left a bright white box out that looked like it contained electronics in a very exposed spot easily visible from the street. Typically it's a more subdued brown box and the delivery guys will try to tuck it in a little so it's not quite as visible. He was hoping for this outcome and that affected the results.
    - VonGallifrey 8y ago
      He did this after he got his normal deliveries stolen as well. Which where presumably packaged in a subdued brown box and then delivered in that same easily visible spot.
  - dec0dedab0de 8y ago
    The United States is big, with many different areas that have different levels of crime. Sometimes with affluent areas in walking distance of destitute areas, which is a whole other problem. One location being robbed repeatedly is not surprising, and not significant. If it were, Amazon would be requiring signatures instead of just sending you another one when something goes missing.
    - derefr 8y ago
      Amazon requiring signatures wouldn’t much help in preventing the problem. They’d just get a signature from the thief “just returning home” in the front yard, find out later that it wasn’t a match, and then... nothing, really. They’d know the buyer wasn’t liable, I guess? Doesn’t do anything for them, loss-prevention-wise; they still owe the buyer the thing they ordered. What Amazon is doing is much more clever: whenever possible, they’re now recording the serial number of the product they ship to you. This way, if the police find it when busting a fence, they can (hopefully) get the fence’s providers out of them and then actually bust them, too (because now they have real physical evidence—along with testimony—that that particular person stole a particular thing.)
- vhodges 8y ago
  I am home during the day (yay remote work!) but they (UPS) give a quick knock and set the package down and go to leave. Genuinely shocked when I open the door.
  - jimmaswell 8y ago
    They didn't even knock when they came to collect a return, so I had to take the sticker they left and go find a UPS box.
- dingaling 8y ago
  > but people usually aren't home when the packages get delivered I still don't understand why this hasn't been 'disrupted' by a company providing evening deliveries. They could do business delivery during the afternoon and then switch to residential. Nightcall! I'll even throw a name in for free.
  - jakobegger 8y ago
    Because then they would have only 2 or 3 hours to deliver all their packages? (I'm assuming most people would want to get their packages between 8pm and 10pm)?
  - dwighttk 8y ago
    Amazon is renting vans from Uhaul here to get all their packages out to houses. They are delivering (probably) 12 hrs a day not even including the Fedex, UPS, and USPS deliveries (I'm not sure how they decide which option to ship with). There is way too much volume to fit deliveries into times when people are home.
wil421 8y ago
Remember a lot of people in the US are in single family homes detached from another home. When I lived in a condo or apartment they could other leave a special key for big boxes in your normal mailbox. You would leave the key in the special mailbox for later. Or they would put it in your rental office. Large condos will have a concierge that will handle it for you. Usually UPS will put it somewhere out of sight if they think it will be an issue.
- ryanmercer 8y ago
  >When I lived in a condo or apartment they could other leave a special key for big boxes in your normal mailbox. You would leave the key in the special mailbox for later. Or they would put it in your rental office. Exactly this. I sorta hate it, we have 2 boxes for like 12 units and one of the boxes keys was lost before I moved in so we have 1 box for 12 units with people getting packages almost daily it means I have to rush home and rush to the office to get my packages. Since moving in it's considerably cut down my Amazon purchases, unless I can time them to arrive on Saturdays or Sundays when I'm home. I'll actually delete my cart sometimes if something isn't going to come on a Saturday or Sunday haha.
  - karanke 8y ago
    Check if Amazon Day is an option, you can choose a day as your Amazon Day and Amazon will deliver packages on that day. https://www.theverge.com/2018/11/2/18057034/amazon-day-prime-choose-package-arrival-date https://www.theverge.com/2018/11/2/18057034/amazon-day-prime...
jessriedel 8y ago
Requiring the package to be signed for is an option; most people don't want it because going to the post office to pick up your package is a huge pain, and thefts are pretty rare.
- magic_beans 8y ago
  Why IS post-office pickup such a pain? I wish Amazon would just set up reception in post-offices across the US. :|
  - jessriedel 8y ago
    The real solution would be a simple box on your porch that only opens once without a key, of has a one-way mechanism, or that the delivery guy has a one-time code for. These have been tried in various forms, but they never catch one.
  - swebs 8y ago
    They do have Amazon lockers all over the place. Most 7-11s that I've seen seem to have them.
- pavon 8y ago
  I've had bad experiences with packages that require signatures. UPS drivers consistently leave the package on the porch without a signature even if one is required. DHL tries to deliver 3 times then returns the package to sender, ignoring the online form you can submit to request they deliver on a specific day or hold at warehouse. Haven't tried Fedex. USPS is pretty good about about getting signatures or holding at the post office, and have more convenient locations compared to the private services.
jartelt 8y ago
That type of delivery is an option for more expensive goods. You can also sometimes pay more to require a signature for delivery. Overall the rate of package theft is low though, so people prefer the convenience and low cost of normal package delivery. The US is big and diverse. Most areas have little to no package theft. However, if your home has a very exposed front porch and you live in an affluent area very near a not so affluent area, theft can be more of an issue.
gnopgnip 8y ago
This also happens in the US if the delivery person feels the package is not secure(or because signature confirmation is needed) they will leave a note and you can pick it up at the depot. But many people would rather avoid the inconvenience of picking it up and have the package left on the door because package theft is relatively rare. If you live in an area where package theft is a problem you probably live in an apartment building with a secure space for packages, or you can have packages delivered to your work, or delivered straight to the post office to pick up.
codezero 8y ago
In a lot of places in the US, people don't know their neighbors, or at least, not well enough to trust them to care for their belongings. Kind of depressing to say, but still true.
tivert 8y ago
> In the Netherlands, when I order a package and no one's at home when it's delivered, it either gets delivered to my neighbors or to the post office, with a note of where to pick it up. It's never left at my door AFAIK. > How is this not an option in the US? In the US, there are at least four major carriers and in my experience only the official postal service does a decent job automatically delivering to nearby location (the local post office) if they can't hand-deliver to a person or a secure location. Some apartments complexes also have locked drop boxes that only the postal service can use. UPS lets you set your default drop off to a nearby shop (but then you never get anything at your home), Fedex makes you manually change the delivery location while the package is in transit if you won't be at home. If the latter two attempt a delivery at your door and don't want to leave it, you have to wait until the next day for redelivery or drive to their inconveniently-located distribution warehouse to pick it up. Amazon has their own delivery service that they use preferentially, and they rely on nonprofessional gig-economy labor, so you're lucky if your package isn't literally tossed at your door. They'll always leave the package at your home if that's the destination. If you don't want that, you have to set your delivery location to a locker, if one is available nearby.
sotojuan 8y ago
I forward all my UPS packages to a local grocery store and pick up from there. If I don't do this, UPS will try to deliver up to 3 times and then leave it in a remote warehouse for me to pick up. I think if you have get the note, you can do this for that one package but for all you need to create a UPS account.
woolvalley 8y ago
Since the USA is a car culture, you can safely ship to work and put the packages in your car trunk after you commute. You can ship to home the low value packages and if theft isn't common enough for you and amazon will just reship you on the rare case that it gets stolen. This breaks down if you don't do car commutes although, in urban places like NYC & SF or can't ship to work.
- DanBC 8y ago
  I used to work in goods in and I would have done everything in my power to get that stopped. It was a shitty minimum wage job and my responsibilities definitely didn't stretch to doing unpaid work for multiple people on top of my shitty job. EDIT: Maybe this is just a lack of understanding of what happens in goods-in? Or working some place where your deliveries don't add much burden?
  - omegaham 8y ago
    Where I work, being able to ship to the business is explicitly advertised as a job perk. "Ship to us, and here's how to get automatic email notifications of when your package is here!"
  - woolvalley 8y ago
    What is a goods-in? Google doesn't show anything that makes sense in this context. At work, there are people who work at the shipping department and then deliver the packages to people's desks. AFAIK they are paid to do this job and seem somewhat peppy compared to other similar staff in the company.
- baroffoos 8y ago
  Don't need a car to move boxes. I have never had a package I couldn't fit on my bike.

johnlp 8y ago

It is depending on your location and which carrier is delivering the package. In a city you wouldn't typically see the package left on the doorstep. However out in the suburbs they get left as there is still a peculiar notion of wholesomeness.

learc83 8y ago
>there is still a peculiar notion of wholesomeness It's less to do with wholesomeness than it is with a lower population density (there's also a lower crime rate in general in the suburbs, though it's less of a difference than it was 25 years ago). In the suburbs you have far fewer people walking past your doorstep--fewer crimes of opportunity. You're also much more likely to be noticed as being out of place if you're driving around a quiet neighborhood looking for packages.

mcphage 8y ago

Generally because people don't want it. Shipping used to be a lot stricter about signatures, etc, but people usually aren't home when the packages get delivered, and package theft isn't a significant enough problem to make the extra security worth the inconvenience.

chrisseaton 8y ago
> package theft isn't a significant enough problem This guy had his package stolen many times in a short space of time. Seems like the problem is pretty bad?
- ionforce 8y ago
  One data point does not suddenly disprove the OP's overall statement.
  - deleted 8y ago
    [deleted]
- CPLX 8y ago
  He left a bright white box out that looked like it contained electronics in a very exposed spot easily visible from the street. Typically it's a more subdued brown box and the delivery guys will try to tuck it in a little so it's not quite as visible. He was hoping for this outcome and that affected the results.
  - VonGallifrey 8y ago
    He did this after he got his normal deliveries stolen as well. Which where presumably packaged in a subdued brown box and then delivered in that same easily visible spot.
- dec0dedab0de 8y ago
  The United States is big, with many different areas that have different levels of crime. Sometimes with affluent areas in walking distance of destitute areas, which is a whole other problem. One location being robbed repeatedly is not surprising, and not significant. If it were, Amazon would be requiring signatures instead of just sending you another one when something goes missing.
  - derefr 8y ago
    Amazon requiring signatures wouldn’t much help in preventing the problem. They’d just get a signature from the thief “just returning home” in the front yard, find out later that it wasn’t a match, and then... nothing, really. They’d know the buyer wasn’t liable, I guess? Doesn’t do anything for them, loss-prevention-wise; they still owe the buyer the thing they ordered. What Amazon is doing is much more clever: whenever possible, they’re now recording the serial number of the product they ship to you. This way, if the police find it when busting a fence, they can (hopefully) get the fence’s providers out of them and then actually bust them, too (because now they have real physical evidence—along with testimony—that that particular person stole a particular thing.)
vhodges 8y ago
I am home during the day (yay remote work!) but they (UPS) give a quick knock and set the package down and go to leave. Genuinely shocked when I open the door.
- jimmaswell 8y ago
  They didn't even knock when they came to collect a return, so I had to take the sticker they left and go find a UPS box.
dingaling 8y ago
> but people usually aren't home when the packages get delivered I still don't understand why this hasn't been 'disrupted' by a company providing evening deliveries. They could do business delivery during the afternoon and then switch to residential. Nightcall! I'll even throw a name in for free.
- jakobegger 8y ago
  Because then they would have only 2 or 3 hours to deliver all their packages? (I'm assuming most people would want to get their packages between 8pm and 10pm)?
- dwighttk 8y ago
  Amazon is renting vans from Uhaul here to get all their packages out to houses. They are delivering (probably) 12 hrs a day not even including the Fedex, UPS, and USPS deliveries (I'm not sure how they decide which option to ship with). There is way too much volume to fit deliveries into times when people are home.

wil421 8y ago

Remember a lot of people in the US are in single family homes detached from another home. When I lived in a condo or apartment they could other leave a special key for big boxes in your normal mailbox. You would leave the key in the special mailbox for later. Or they would put it in your rental office. Large condos will have a concierge that will handle it for you. Usually UPS will put it somewhere out of sight if they think it will be an issue.

ryanmercer 8y ago
>When I lived in a condo or apartment they could other leave a special key for big boxes in your normal mailbox. You would leave the key in the special mailbox for later. Or they would put it in your rental office. Exactly this. I sorta hate it, we have 2 boxes for like 12 units and one of the boxes keys was lost before I moved in so we have 1 box for 12 units with people getting packages almost daily it means I have to rush home and rush to the office to get my packages. Since moving in it's considerably cut down my Amazon purchases, unless I can time them to arrive on Saturdays or Sundays when I'm home. I'll actually delete my cart sometimes if something isn't going to come on a Saturday or Sunday haha.
- karanke 8y ago
  Check if Amazon Day is an option, you can choose a day as your Amazon Day and Amazon will deliver packages on that day. https://www.theverge.com/2018/11/2/18057034/amazon-day-prime-choose-package-arrival-date https://www.theverge.com/2018/11/2/18057034/amazon-day-prime...

jessriedel 8y ago

Requiring the package to be signed for is an option; most people don't want it because going to the post office to pick up your package is a huge pain, and thefts are pretty rare.

magic_beans 8y ago
Why IS post-office pickup such a pain? I wish Amazon would just set up reception in post-offices across the US. :|
- jessriedel 8y ago
  The real solution would be a simple box on your porch that only opens once without a key, of has a one-way mechanism, or that the delivery guy has a one-time code for. These have been tried in various forms, but they never catch one.
- swebs 8y ago
  They do have Amazon lockers all over the place. Most 7-11s that I've seen seem to have them.
pavon 8y ago
I've had bad experiences with packages that require signatures. UPS drivers consistently leave the package on the porch without a signature even if one is required. DHL tries to deliver 3 times then returns the package to sender, ignoring the online form you can submit to request they deliver on a specific day or hold at warehouse. Haven't tried Fedex. USPS is pretty good about about getting signatures or holding at the post office, and have more convenient locations compared to the private services.

jartelt 8y ago

That type of delivery is an option for more expensive goods. You can also sometimes pay more to require a signature for delivery. Overall the rate of package theft is low though, so people prefer the convenience and low cost of normal package delivery. The US is big and diverse. Most areas have little to no package theft. However, if your home has a very exposed front porch and you live in an affluent area very near a not so affluent area, theft can be more of an issue.

gnopgnip 8y ago

This also happens in the US if the delivery person feels the package is not secure(or because signature confirmation is needed) they will leave a note and you can pick it up at the depot. But many people would rather avoid the inconvenience of picking it up and have the package left on the door because package theft is relatively rare. If you live in an area where package theft is a problem you probably live in an apartment building with a secure space for packages, or you can have packages delivered to your work, or delivered straight to the post office to pick up.

codezero 8y ago

In a lot of places in the US, people don't know their neighbors, or at least, not well enough to trust them to care for their belongings. Kind of depressing to say, but still true.

tivert 8y ago

> In the Netherlands, when I order a package and no one's at home when it's delivered, it either gets delivered to my neighbors or to the post office, with a note of where to pick it up. It's never left at my door AFAIK. > How is this not an option in the US? In the US, there are at least four major carriers and in my experience only the official postal service does a decent job automatically delivering to nearby location (the local post office) if they can't hand-deliver to a person or a secure location. Some apartments complexes also have locked drop boxes that only the postal service can use. UPS lets you set your default drop off to a nearby shop (but then you never get anything at your home), Fedex makes you manually change the delivery location while the package is in transit if you won't be at home. If the latter two attempt a delivery at your door and don't want to leave it, you have to wait until the next day for redelivery or drive to their inconveniently-located distribution warehouse to pick it up. Amazon has their own delivery service that they use preferentially, and they rely on nonprofessional gig-economy labor, so you're lucky if your package isn't literally tossed at your door. They'll always leave the package at your home if that's the destination. If you don't want that, you have to set your delivery location to a locker, if one is available nearby.

sotojuan 8y ago

I forward all my UPS packages to a local grocery store and pick up from there. If I don't do this, UPS will try to deliver up to 3 times and then leave it in a remote warehouse for me to pick up. I think if you have get the note, you can do this for that one package but for all you need to create a UPS account.

woolvalley 8y ago

Since the USA is a car culture, you can safely ship to work and put the packages in your car trunk after you commute. You can ship to home the low value packages and if theft isn't common enough for you and amazon will just reship you on the rare case that it gets stolen. This breaks down if you don't do car commutes although, in urban places like NYC & SF or can't ship to work.

DanBC 8y ago
I used to work in goods in and I would have done everything in my power to get that stopped. It was a shitty minimum wage job and my responsibilities definitely didn't stretch to doing unpaid work for multiple people on top of my shitty job. EDIT: Maybe this is just a lack of understanding of what happens in goods-in? Or working some place where your deliveries don't add much burden?
- omegaham 8y ago
  Where I work, being able to ship to the business is explicitly advertised as a job perk. "Ship to us, and here's how to get automatic email notifications of when your package is here!"
- woolvalley 8y ago
  What is a goods-in? Google doesn't show anything that makes sense in this context. At work, there are people who work at the shipping department and then deliver the packages to people's desks. AFAIK they are paid to do this job and seem somewhat peppy compared to other similar staff in the company.
baroffoos 8y ago
Don't need a car to move boxes. I have never had a package I couldn't fit on my bike.