4 ms·

A company choosing to expand in New York without billions in incentives? Could it be? The municipal government didn't think it was possible...

CobrastanJorji 8y ago
On the contrary, the municipal government very loudly believed that it would have been possible. Unfortunately it appears that, for some reason I don't understand, New York City's Council doesn't have any input into those sort of incentive programs.
- bilbo0s 8y ago
  Yep. The State officials can run roughshod over you whenever they like. We just need a nation wide system where politicians can make these Foxconn type deals, but the deals would be null and void until voters actually signaled approval in some kind of referendum.
  - Kalium 8y ago
    As someone living in California, my advice is to be very cautious about how much direct democracy you ask for. It can very easily go very badly.
    - ericd 8y ago
      This doesn't deserve downvotes. Some of the products of the referendums (prop 13, for example) have had disastrous long term consequences.
      - FreakyT 8y ago
        And let's not forget everyone's favorite: > This [literally any object imaginable] contains materials known to the State of California to cause cancer.
        ericd 8y ago
        Oh yeah, that one's great. My two favorite uses of this sign - first, on the jetway, when you're stuck in line, and second, in the baby food aisle at our local grocery store. I guess you could think of it like a memento mori, though: "Everything is killing you, slowly".
    - eeeeeeeeeeeee 8y ago
      Colorado is another state where the ballot initiatives are getting out of hand. Very conflicted because there are some decisions I believe should go directly to the people. My ballot this year was pages long. Took me over half an hour to fill it all out. The wording on some of the initiatives are so confusing you have to read them numerous times to decipher.
  - peteretep 8y ago
    > until voters actually signaled approval in some kind of referendum Worked so well with Brexit
- bobthepanda 8y ago
  For historical reasons, the State and City have never gotten along well. If you read the State constitution, you will see a lot of (now unconstitutional) clauses that target the City in all but name only. The state has arcane mechanisms to override city home rule because home rule is generously interpreted by state courts to mean nothing at all. I think the most surprising thing is that Bill De Blasio agreed to this at all, but he can't politick his way out of a paper bag.
puzzle 8y ago
Not only that, but soon after Google bought the main NYC building, the tax bill went up for a small number of the largest properties in the city, which of course included Google's. The valuation has since fluctuated a number of times because of byzantine rules in how properties are assessed, especially when the owner is also a tenant.
- bdhess 8y ago
  Well in fairness, tax bills are based on market values, and ought to respond to events in the market. In competitive markets with lots of supply and demand, you'd expect many transactions, and the effect of any one comparable transaction on the price of a given property would be quite small. In niche markets where transactions are rare (like, say, “commercial properties in mid to lower Manhattan with >2.5mm sq ft of floor space”), individual transactions involving comparable properties can be expected to have an outsized effect.
akhilcacharya 8y ago
The net impact is going to be different. Amazon wanted to move to a part of town most tech companies aren't already and announced a significantly larger headcount.

CobrastanJorji 8y ago

On the contrary, the municipal government very loudly believed that it would have been possible. Unfortunately it appears that, for some reason I don't understand, New York City's Council doesn't have any input into those sort of incentive programs.

bilbo0s 8y ago
Yep. The State officials can run roughshod over you whenever they like. We just need a nation wide system where politicians can make these Foxconn type deals, but the deals would be null and void until voters actually signaled approval in some kind of referendum.
- Kalium 8y ago
  As someone living in California, my advice is to be very cautious about how much direct democracy you ask for. It can very easily go very badly.
  - ericd 8y ago
    This doesn't deserve downvotes. Some of the products of the referendums (prop 13, for example) have had disastrous long term consequences.
    - FreakyT 8y ago
      And let's not forget everyone's favorite: > This [literally any object imaginable] contains materials known to the State of California to cause cancer.
      - ericd 8y ago
        Oh yeah, that one's great. My two favorite uses of this sign - first, on the jetway, when you're stuck in line, and second, in the baby food aisle at our local grocery store. I guess you could think of it like a memento mori, though: "Everything is killing you, slowly".
  - eeeeeeeeeeeee 8y ago
    Colorado is another state where the ballot initiatives are getting out of hand. Very conflicted because there are some decisions I believe should go directly to the people. My ballot this year was pages long. Took me over half an hour to fill it all out. The wording on some of the initiatives are so confusing you have to read them numerous times to decipher.
- peteretep 8y ago
  > until voters actually signaled approval in some kind of referendum Worked so well with Brexit
bobthepanda 8y ago
For historical reasons, the State and City have never gotten along well. If you read the State constitution, you will see a lot of (now unconstitutional) clauses that target the City in all but name only. The state has arcane mechanisms to override city home rule because home rule is generously interpreted by state courts to mean nothing at all. I think the most surprising thing is that Bill De Blasio agreed to this at all, but he can't politick his way out of a paper bag.

puzzle 8y ago

Not only that, but soon after Google bought the main NYC building, the tax bill went up for a small number of the largest properties in the city, which of course included Google's. The valuation has since fluctuated a number of times because of byzantine rules in how properties are assessed, especially when the owner is also a tenant.

bdhess 8y ago
Well in fairness, tax bills are based on market values, and ought to respond to events in the market. In competitive markets with lots of supply and demand, you'd expect many transactions, and the effect of any one comparable transaction on the price of a given property would be quite small. In niche markets where transactions are rare (like, say, “commercial properties in mid to lower Manhattan with >2.5mm sq ft of floor space”), individual transactions involving comparable properties can be expected to have an outsized effect.

akhilcacharya 8y ago

The net impact is going to be different. Amazon wanted to move to a part of town most tech companies aren't already and announced a significantly larger headcount.