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I mean, where do we think the functions are executing now? It's not like Ubuntu Server is running Xorg, or has libinput installed, nor have any of those things

I mean, where do we think the functions are executing now? It's not like Ubuntu Server is running Xorg, or has libinput installed, nor have any of those things ever been operational or developmental considerations on any "non-serverless" app. Or maybe you're in a super cutting edge functions deployment where you're actually deploying microkernels? Seems orthogonal to me, and doesn't seem to address the data locality, etc issues brought up in this article. There are so many people in this thread saying stuff like "PaaS doesn't allow auto-scaling" and I just don't really know what's going on. It's baffling to me. I guess if all you know is an archaic build process and manual deployment, then it looks great. But I'm willing to bet most of these function platforms bottom out on containers-on-k8s-on-vms anyway. I am increasingly, increasingly convinced that people don't really need or want "serverless". They want the final step in the build/development process that they thought they were going to get with Docker -- they want to write code and have it running somewhere. I really don't buy that Serverless/Lockin are the right or best way to that future.

SlowRobotAhead 8y ago
>They want the final step in the build/development process that they thought they were going to get with Docker This isn’t my area, so I don’t know - but why didn’t people get that with Docker?
- DATACOMMANDER 8y ago
  They didn’t get the magic functionality they wanted because magic isn’t real. Coming from a devops background with more of an emphasis on “ops” than “dev”, my (admittedly biased) opinion is that a lot of developers believe three things simultaneously: 1) Ops people are bitter, power-tripping killjoys who couldn’t make it as developers and do nothing but click buttons and think up ways to make the lives of developers difficult. 2) Ops/infra really isn’t as difficult as ops people would have you believe, and some day very soon all the ops people will be replaced by code. 3) Someone else should write the code that’s going to automate the ops people out of existence. These developers are like highly specialized scientists who think that their PhDs make them experts on everything. They have no idea what happens to their code once they commit it and they don’t care to learn, but they’re pretty sure that it can’t be all that complicated. Ops will—like everything else—eventually be eaten by software, but the people who drive that transformation sure as fuck won’t be JavaScript specialists who can’t troubleshoot their inability to connect to the VPN. They’ll either be systems/infra people who can code, or well-rounded coders who understand that infra is actually nontrivial (or a group comprised of both). If it seems like I have a problem with devs, it’s honestly only because a vocal minority of devs have a big problem with me.
  - deleted 8y ago
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SlowRobotAhead 8y ago

>They want the final step in the build/development process that they thought they were going to get with Docker This isn’t my area, so I don’t know - but why didn’t people get that with Docker?

DATACOMMANDER 8y ago
They didn’t get the magic functionality they wanted because magic isn’t real. Coming from a devops background with more of an emphasis on “ops” than “dev”, my (admittedly biased) opinion is that a lot of developers believe three things simultaneously: 1) Ops people are bitter, power-tripping killjoys who couldn’t make it as developers and do nothing but click buttons and think up ways to make the lives of developers difficult. 2) Ops/infra really isn’t as difficult as ops people would have you believe, and some day very soon all the ops people will be replaced by code. 3) Someone else should write the code that’s going to automate the ops people out of existence. These developers are like highly specialized scientists who think that their PhDs make them experts on everything. They have no idea what happens to their code once they commit it and they don’t care to learn, but they’re pretty sure that it can’t be all that complicated. Ops will—like everything else—eventually be eaten by software, but the people who drive that transformation sure as fuck won’t be JavaScript specialists who can’t troubleshoot their inability to connect to the VPN. They’ll either be systems/infra people who can code, or well-rounded coders who understand that infra is actually nontrivial (or a group comprised of both). If it seems like I have a problem with devs, it’s honestly only because a vocal minority of devs have a big problem with me.
- deleted 8y ago
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