5 ms·

How can you not see a big ship coming towards you even at night? I mean don't you see it's lights. Furthermore, they were warned repeatedly by radio. I'm sorry

by spanxx 8y ago

How can you not see a big ship coming towards you even at night? I mean don't you see it's lights. Furthermore, they were warned repeatedly by radio. I'm sorry if I sound harsh but I can't help but think how they can be so incompetent? I'm afraid there is a worrying trend in these kind of accidents to deflect the blame to the electronics/software. Isn't your job to keep the car/ship/vehicle intact? Technology is there to help you but not to do your job.

oh_sigh 8y ago
Apparently, because the docks have a bunch of lights on them as well, obscuring the ship lights.
- varjag 8y ago
  It's a 2009 commissioned stealth frigate, with every navigational aid you can think of (AIS, a range of radars, visible light and FLIR cameras) on the bridge. They also had repeated warnings over the radio.
  - tremon 8y ago
    I'm not sure if the radio transmission from https://www.vg.no/spesial/2018/helge-ingstad-ulykken/ https://www.vg.no/spesial/2018/helge-ingstad-ulykken/ (linked already in various comments) is accurate, but if so, there were no warnings over the radio. Instead, they were directed to change heading but not informed why. I don't speak Norsk, but it seems like the first time "collision course" is mentioned is at 04:01:08, ten seconds before impact.
    - varjag 8y ago
      The first call to the warship was 03:10, some 1:20 before the collision. Followed by two warnings they are on collision course. Let's see it from a different perspective too. The oil tanker captain was able to identify an unknown vessel (with disabled transponder) as warship, guess its type and infer its name, determine the collision is imminent and warn them multiple times. This suggests absolutely inept crew on the frigate's bridge.
varjag 8y ago
It does appear to be the case of gross incompetence. In Norwegian newspapers comments section, most seamen and former Navy tend to suggest just that. This is Norway though. In many other places the captain would be court martialed for that. Here he'd have his promotion delayed a few years at worst.
- Tor3 8y ago
  The captain was not at the bridge during the situation though. He was off shift. He came to the bridge after the collision, and took over the radio communication. Very apparent in the way the communication was handled (after the crash).
  - varjag 8y ago
    The captain runs the ship and is in charge of the crew. It's the ultimate authority that comes with ultimate responsibility. If the crew was not seaworthy, letting it sail out if the port is the captain's fault.
    - Tor3 8y ago
      Oh, absolutely. The captain has responsibility. It's just that they're not that often on the bridge anymore. That demands a certain level of competence and trust as far as the bridge crew is concerned, of course.
dagw 8y ago
I mean don't you see it's lights. One problem in this case appears (among other things) to have been too many lights. The Sola TS apparently had full deck lights on, something you're only supposed to have while docked, and which made the boat blend in with the background lights from the terminal.
spiralx 8y ago
You say that, but then again there's this book with all its amusing reviews: https://www.amazon.co.uk/Avoid-Huge-Ships-John-Trimmer/dp/0870334336 https://www.amazon.co.uk/Avoid-Huge-Ships-John-Trimmer/dp/08...

by spanxx 8y ago

oh_sigh 8y ago

Apparently, because the docks have a bunch of lights on them as well, obscuring the ship lights.

varjag 8y ago
It's a 2009 commissioned stealth frigate, with every navigational aid you can think of (AIS, a range of radars, visible light and FLIR cameras) on the bridge. They also had repeated warnings over the radio.
- tremon 8y ago
  I'm not sure if the radio transmission from https://www.vg.no/spesial/2018/helge-ingstad-ulykken/ https://www.vg.no/spesial/2018/helge-ingstad-ulykken/ (linked already in various comments) is accurate, but if so, there were no warnings over the radio. Instead, they were directed to change heading but not informed why. I don't speak Norsk, but it seems like the first time "collision course" is mentioned is at 04:01:08, ten seconds before impact.
  - varjag 8y ago
    The first call to the warship was 03:10, some 1:20 before the collision. Followed by two warnings they are on collision course. Let's see it from a different perspective too. The oil tanker captain was able to identify an unknown vessel (with disabled transponder) as warship, guess its type and infer its name, determine the collision is imminent and warn them multiple times. This suggests absolutely inept crew on the frigate's bridge.

varjag 8y ago

It does appear to be the case of gross incompetence. In Norwegian newspapers comments section, most seamen and former Navy tend to suggest just that. This is Norway though. In many other places the captain would be court martialed for that. Here he'd have his promotion delayed a few years at worst.

Tor3 8y ago
The captain was not at the bridge during the situation though. He was off shift. He came to the bridge after the collision, and took over the radio communication. Very apparent in the way the communication was handled (after the crash).
- varjag 8y ago
  The captain runs the ship and is in charge of the crew. It's the ultimate authority that comes with ultimate responsibility. If the crew was not seaworthy, letting it sail out if the port is the captain's fault.
  - Tor3 8y ago
    Oh, absolutely. The captain has responsibility. It's just that they're not that often on the bridge anymore. That demands a certain level of competence and trust as far as the bridge crew is concerned, of course.

dagw 8y ago

I mean don't you see it's lights. One problem in this case appears (among other things) to have been too many lights. The Sola TS apparently had full deck lights on, something you're only supposed to have while docked, and which made the boat blend in with the background lights from the terminal.

spiralx 8y ago

You say that, but then again there's this book with all its amusing reviews: https://www.amazon.co.uk/Avoid-Huge-Ships-John-Trimmer/dp/0870334336 https://www.amazon.co.uk/Avoid-Huge-Ships-John-Trimmer/dp/08...