3 ms·

We used to call this "critical thinking"

by kylek 8y ago

mc32 8y ago
I think you’re right but also it’s become more pervassive and more nuanced and less detectable and sime so overt we don’t even care anymore. I think the magnitude has changed, for the worse.
mdpopescu 8y ago
Yep, and unfortunately schools have been teaching its opposite for decades - unthinkingly accepting authority just because it's authority.
deleted 8y ago
[deleted]
will_brown 8y ago
No amount of “critical thinking” expose some of the tactics corporations employ to market products, especially in the internet era of fake positive reviews, fake negative reviews and just simply fake (counterfeit products). For example, in the real world I did some independent marketing jobs in undergrad and while some marketing is obvious (ex. red bull team giving free red bull or handing free packs of gum out on the beach)...ever see a good looking couple driving a new car (yeah in my day driver was paid $25/hour to drive around a model in the passenger seat who got $50/hour. And it’s dozens in every major city), ever have someone at a bar casually engage you in conversation and buy you a drink/beer (yeah good chance that was paid marketing, and we aren’t talking bud light girls).
- nkrisc 8y ago
  Those methods also sound wildly inefficient and ineffective. I think the "critical thinking" part is knowing that a new car is not going to make you young and have an attractive partner.
  - will_brown 8y ago
    Well if you read a number of case studies on google/Facebook advertising I think it’s also easy to conclude those methods are not very effective either. And don’t think for a minute part of the car set up is not placing a significantly more attractive female with a less attractive male. And if people are really looking at that set up and thinking oh if I buy that car I’ll be young too (which I never mentioned anything about young), they may need more than critical thinking skills. Anyway it’s the same concept as social media influencers...people actually do buy the things other people buy that they envy. As to the bar thing...it’s pretty effective, 1. Go to where people are drinking already, 2. Chat them up in a social environment, 3. Buy them the drink/beer they wouldn’t have ever otherwise tried...it leaves an overall good experience in the mind of the consumers they relate to the drink...and trust me it works.
  - InitialLastName 8y ago
    The goal isn't for you to think that explicitly. The goal is for you to subtly associate Product B with feelings related to "young and attractive partner" so that next time you're making a decision between Product B and the competitor's Product C, you are emotionally tilted in their direction. It's probably not enough of a tilt to overcome many logistical factors, but it might also not be something you notice when making the decision.
jancsika 8y ago
Suppose you can use your critical thinking skills to convince 1 member of an anti-vaxxer group to consult experts and discover they don't know what they're talking about. If the group consists of two members, then you just decreased its size by half. Great job! Now suppose a influence campaign sponsored by a nation state helps an anti-vaccination group grow from 2 members to 20 members. Now your critical thinking skills only decrease the group's size by 5%. Your impact is an order of magnitude smaller without your skills having decreased. So I don't think this is a matter of "critical thinking."

We used to call this "critical thinking"

by kylek 8y ago

We used to call this "critical thinking"

mc32 8y ago

I think you’re right but also it’s become more pervassive and more nuanced and less detectable and sime so overt we don’t even care anymore. I think the magnitude has changed, for the worse.

mdpopescu 8y ago

Yep, and unfortunately schools have been teaching its opposite for decades - unthinkingly accepting authority just because it's authority.

deleted 8y ago

[deleted]

will_brown 8y ago

No amount of “critical thinking” expose some of the tactics corporations employ to market products, especially in the internet era of fake positive reviews, fake negative reviews and just simply fake (counterfeit products). For example, in the real world I did some independent marketing jobs in undergrad and while some marketing is obvious (ex. red bull team giving free red bull or handing free packs of gum out on the beach)...ever see a good looking couple driving a new car (yeah in my day driver was paid $25/hour to drive around a model in the passenger seat who got $50/hour. And it’s dozens in every major city), ever have someone at a bar casually engage you in conversation and buy you a drink/beer (yeah good chance that was paid marketing, and we aren’t talking bud light girls).

nkrisc 8y ago
Those methods also sound wildly inefficient and ineffective. I think the "critical thinking" part is knowing that a new car is not going to make you young and have an attractive partner.
- will_brown 8y ago
  Well if you read a number of case studies on google/Facebook advertising I think it’s also easy to conclude those methods are not very effective either. And don’t think for a minute part of the car set up is not placing a significantly more attractive female with a less attractive male. And if people are really looking at that set up and thinking oh if I buy that car I’ll be young too (which I never mentioned anything about young), they may need more than critical thinking skills. Anyway it’s the same concept as social media influencers...people actually do buy the things other people buy that they envy. As to the bar thing...it’s pretty effective, 1. Go to where people are drinking already, 2. Chat them up in a social environment, 3. Buy them the drink/beer they wouldn’t have ever otherwise tried...it leaves an overall good experience in the mind of the consumers they relate to the drink...and trust me it works.
- InitialLastName 8y ago
  The goal isn't for you to think that explicitly. The goal is for you to subtly associate Product B with feelings related to "young and attractive partner" so that next time you're making a decision between Product B and the competitor's Product C, you are emotionally tilted in their direction. It's probably not enough of a tilt to overcome many logistical factors, but it might also not be something you notice when making the decision.

jancsika 8y ago

Suppose you can use your critical thinking skills to convince 1 member of an anti-vaxxer group to consult experts and discover they don't know what they're talking about. If the group consists of two members, then you just decreased its size by half. Great job! Now suppose a influence campaign sponsored by a nation state helps an anti-vaccination group grow from 2 members to 20 members. Now your critical thinking skills only decrease the group's size by 5%. Your impact is an order of magnitude smaller without your skills having decreased. So I don't think this is a matter of "critical thinking."