4 ms·

Companies want people that can come in and hit the ground running and are self-starters. It is always better to go into the interview, meeting, pitch with proj

Companies want people that can come in and hit the ground running and are self-starters. It is always better to go into the interview, meeting, pitch with projects that are shipped or working to demonstrate. For instance, if you want to get into the game industry, build games. Same with any field, when you create/build you can rise above education, experience and more competitive metrics. Created/functional projects, and especially shipped products, are the best qualifications.

technobabble 8y ago
Is this true outside of the SV bubble?
- solveit 8y ago
  Certainly it's true everywhere. It's also not necessary in most places (including many places in SV). But you still want to convince the company that you can learn quickly and well enough to be worth it. If you don't have any of the traditional ways of signalling that (fancy degree, reference from somebody already in the game, etc), then this is probably the best way to go.
- drawkbox 8y ago
  In addition to development, any creative field is this way including movies, writing, gaming, design etc. It is also true of vocational skills and probably even legal/accounting/executive and other corporate fields.
runeb 8y ago
I agree with you, but would argue that this doesn't rise above experience, this shows experience. The value of having shipped something, maybe even supported it and maintained it is invaluable experience as a software developer, and not something taught at school, at least not my university.
- drawkbox 8y ago
  > doesn't rise above experience, this shows experience. Experience is highly valuable but concrete examples of that which are done individually or completely self propelled, that is the way to be. Creating/shipping/projects to show does demonstrate experience and skills. There can be people that have experience that can't ship, but if you created/projects/shipped and have less experience it truly demonstrates that you do have experience enough to be worthwhile and improve the place you are going to. I'd argue even when I have had to interview or been on the hiring side, showing projects beats experience and education, it can also make interviews focused on your projects and what you bring rather than just whiteboard and talking about what you have done. For instance when I went into gaming I had multiple games made for every place I was aiming for, i.e. a racing game at a racing game company, promotional games at advertising/promotional jobs, and networking/multiplayer shooters/online for more hardcore gaming on console and mobile. Ultimately projects are the only way to get clients as a freelancer/small business pitching to clients, so that also works when going for full time employment and jobs.
pj_mukh 8y ago
Instead of the n-th Tutorial website, I would love a list of worthwhile projects one can build with increasingly tougher level of difficulty, start with MNIST and move up. You don't have to hand-hold me by providing a sandbox, but suggested frameworks are welcome. Ending the list with a couple of research/unsolved problems is perfect. To me, this is the perfect way to learn, almost like feel your way blind in a cave and reaching its extents.
- skosch 8y ago
  OpenAI has "Requests for Research" from easy to very difficult: https://openai.com/requests-for-research/ https://openai.com/requests-for-research/ https://blog.openai.com/requests-for-research-2/ https://blog.openai.com/requests-for-research-2/
  - pj_mukh 8y ago
    Woah. This is a good list, I just kinda assumed it was all unsolved problems (“request for research”) but it’s not!
- ryanstorm 8y ago
  Here's a collection of project ideas: http://nifty.stanford.edu/ http://nifty.stanford.edu/
everdev 8y ago
I've hired dozens of people in tech and building something that works and is related to the job you want is so important it's hard to overstate. IMO, it's far more important than what school you went to and maybe even your employment history. Tech moves so fast that if your portfolio is something you built 3+ years ago, it can be difficult to find a job other than at companies that can afford substantial training programs.
penetrarthur 8y ago
In the gamedev, I would not want to work with someone just because he has built a game on his own. Gamedev is notorious for having a low barrier of entry and then there is an exponential learning curve. I'd rather work with someone who has a deep understanding in some specific area or has worked on a library of some sort. I think there are a lot of other technical fields that work the same.
- drawkbox 8y ago
  Shipped games both on teams/companies and individually are game development gold. You will be in if you have shipped titles especially individually or with a small team that is a decent game. If you have no shipped titles, the second best way is at least game components, networking, game mechanics etc that you can demo. Personally I only like to work with people that can take a project to ship and are product focused. Gamedevs that don't know the depth and troubles of shipping a title will have to learn that on the company otherwise and usually don't know when to cut/scale correctly the gameplay/mechanic/product etc. A big problem with AAA development and broken systems is the heavy specialization, it is why games come out bugged as there is very little ownership or people that can ship a game solely and understand how all parts connect. Unless you are only working on triple-A titles, most game companies are small/medium and need shippers that aren't as specialized, especially mobile. Though most people that go into AAA games think they will get to make their game, but in actuality they work on such small parts that they eventually break out into their own smaller studios or indies to build games. Everyone at a game company wants to build their games, it is why people go into games. For success you have to have shippers who understand the whole shipping adventure that want to come together to get games out the door that each can have input on as a team, but also have the itch scratched that they already have shipped some of their own games and an outlet for creativity if specialization is too heavy on a project. The best game studios and games are developed by smaller teams and key individuals that understand this, especially during pre-production into early production/prototyping/game mechanics, during production and post-production that is where you want more specialization but even then you want people that have shipped.
  - penetrarthur 8y ago

technobabble 8y ago

Is this true outside of the SV bubble?

solveit 8y ago
Certainly it's true everywhere. It's also not necessary in most places (including many places in SV). But you still want to convince the company that you can learn quickly and well enough to be worth it. If you don't have any of the traditional ways of signalling that (fancy degree, reference from somebody already in the game, etc), then this is probably the best way to go.
drawkbox 8y ago
In addition to development, any creative field is this way including movies, writing, gaming, design etc. It is also true of vocational skills and probably even legal/accounting/executive and other corporate fields.

runeb 8y ago

I agree with you, but would argue that this doesn't rise above experience, this shows experience. The value of having shipped something, maybe even supported it and maintained it is invaluable experience as a software developer, and not something taught at school, at least not my university.

drawkbox 8y ago
> doesn't rise above experience, this shows experience. Experience is highly valuable but concrete examples of that which are done individually or completely self propelled, that is the way to be. Creating/shipping/projects to show does demonstrate experience and skills. There can be people that have experience that can't ship, but if you created/projects/shipped and have less experience it truly demonstrates that you do have experience enough to be worthwhile and improve the place you are going to. I'd argue even when I have had to interview or been on the hiring side, showing projects beats experience and education, it can also make interviews focused on your projects and what you bring rather than just whiteboard and talking about what you have done. For instance when I went into gaming I had multiple games made for every place I was aiming for, i.e. a racing game at a racing game company, promotional games at advertising/promotional jobs, and networking/multiplayer shooters/online for more hardcore gaming on console and mobile. Ultimately projects are the only way to get clients as a freelancer/small business pitching to clients, so that also works when going for full time employment and jobs.

pj_mukh 8y ago

Instead of the n-th Tutorial website, I would love a list of worthwhile projects one can build with increasingly tougher level of difficulty, start with MNIST and move up. You don't have to hand-hold me by providing a sandbox, but suggested frameworks are welcome. Ending the list with a couple of research/unsolved problems is perfect. To me, this is the perfect way to learn, almost like feel your way blind in a cave and reaching its extents.

skosch 8y ago
OpenAI has "Requests for Research" from easy to very difficult: https://openai.com/requests-for-research/ https://openai.com/requests-for-research/ https://blog.openai.com/requests-for-research-2/ https://blog.openai.com/requests-for-research-2/
- pj_mukh 8y ago
  Woah. This is a good list, I just kinda assumed it was all unsolved problems (“request for research”) but it’s not!
ryanstorm 8y ago
Here's a collection of project ideas: http://nifty.stanford.edu/ http://nifty.stanford.edu/

everdev 8y ago

I've hired dozens of people in tech and building something that works and is related to the job you want is so important it's hard to overstate. IMO, it's far more important than what school you went to and maybe even your employment history. Tech moves so fast that if your portfolio is something you built 3+ years ago, it can be difficult to find a job other than at companies that can afford substantial training programs.

penetrarthur 8y ago

In the gamedev, I would not want to work with someone just because he has built a game on his own. Gamedev is notorious for having a low barrier of entry and then there is an exponential learning curve. I'd rather work with someone who has a deep understanding in some specific area or has worked on a library of some sort. I think there are a lot of other technical fields that work the same.

drawkbox 8y ago
Shipped games both on teams/companies and individually are game development gold. You will be in if you have shipped titles especially individually or with a small team that is a decent game. If you have no shipped titles, the second best way is at least game components, networking, game mechanics etc that you can demo. Personally I only like to work with people that can take a project to ship and are product focused. Gamedevs that don't know the depth and troubles of shipping a title will have to learn that on the company otherwise and usually don't know when to cut/scale correctly the gameplay/mechanic/product etc. A big problem with AAA development and broken systems is the heavy specialization, it is why games come out bugged as there is very little ownership or people that can ship a game solely and understand how all parts connect. Unless you are only working on triple-A titles, most game companies are small/medium and need shippers that aren't as specialized, especially mobile. Though most people that go into AAA games think they will get to make their game, but in actuality they work on such small parts that they eventually break out into their own smaller studios or indies to build games. Everyone at a game company wants to build their games, it is why people go into games. For success you have to have shippers who understand the whole shipping adventure that want to come together to get games out the door that each can have input on as a team, but also have the itch scratched that they already have shipped some of their own games and an outlet for creativity if specialization is too heavy on a project. The best game studios and games are developed by smaller teams and key individuals that understand this, especially during pre-production into early production/prototyping/game mechanics, during production and post-production that is where you want more specialization but even then you want people that have shipped.
- penetrarthur 8y ago