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The dreaded "zombie". Profitable enough that the investors can't pull the plug by force. Not growing enough that anyone will make any money out of it. It is

The dreaded "zombie". Profitable enough that the investors can't pull the plug by force. Not growing enough that anyone will make any money out of it. It is my observation that because of "natural attrition" often both the management and employees tend to get replaced with B-players over time. The investors lose interest, their money is gone, their incentive to care a whit is gone, so they apply their attention where it has the chance to make a difference.

TeMPOraL 8y ago
Dreaded by everyone except the users/customers, who come to depend on the service the startup provides.
- rightbyte 8y ago
  ... and the people it employs? I see alot of winners in "zombie" startups. I wonder what the ROI of the average business is. Pizza places, AI shops alike.
  - lotsofpulp 8y ago
    Problem is when someone bigger comes and puts you out of business. Like a fancy new pizza place with modern decor or a Costco or amazon or Uber. You need the ROI to keep placing other bets to increase your chances of survival.
    - Zombiethrowaway 8y ago
      If you care for your pizza, your customers and employees, you will stay in business for a long time, regardless of who opens a shop next door. Staying power, habits: those are huge positive factors for businesses.
      - lotsofpulp 8y ago
        “Mom and pop” businesses around the country show otherwise. A few restaurants with a very loyal customer base or outlier popularity might do well, but certainly not most. Same with hotels, rental cars, airlines, retailers, etc. There’s just advantages to scale that can’t be matched, and if there’s margin, someone is going to want a piece of it.
  - Zombiethrowaway 8y ago
    So many people running small businesses make very good money. I hear 20% a lot for normal businesses. Mine is more computer oriented, and old school too, and it is around 45%, several hundred $K a year. Nobody advertises around those because there is no rewards to do so. If you want to start a business and make money, do not rule out old economy, and bootstrapping. Whatever VCs say.
cyborgx7 8y ago
Only in the insane world of "startup" culture, a sustainable business that meets enough customer demand to pay their employees and make some profit, is a bad thing.
- dbcurtis 8y ago
  If you take money from VC’s and compensate employees with stock options then you need to show VC returns. If the company can’t provide VC returns, don’t take VC money, find another source of funding.

TeMPOraL 8y ago

Dreaded by everyone except the users/customers, who come to depend on the service the startup provides.

rightbyte 8y ago
... and the people it employs? I see alot of winners in "zombie" startups. I wonder what the ROI of the average business is. Pizza places, AI shops alike.
- lotsofpulp 8y ago
  Problem is when someone bigger comes and puts you out of business. Like a fancy new pizza place with modern decor or a Costco or amazon or Uber. You need the ROI to keep placing other bets to increase your chances of survival.
  - Zombiethrowaway 8y ago
    If you care for your pizza, your customers and employees, you will stay in business for a long time, regardless of who opens a shop next door. Staying power, habits: those are huge positive factors for businesses.
    - lotsofpulp 8y ago
      “Mom and pop” businesses around the country show otherwise. A few restaurants with a very loyal customer base or outlier popularity might do well, but certainly not most. Same with hotels, rental cars, airlines, retailers, etc. There’s just advantages to scale that can’t be matched, and if there’s margin, someone is going to want a piece of it.
- Zombiethrowaway 8y ago
  So many people running small businesses make very good money. I hear 20% a lot for normal businesses. Mine is more computer oriented, and old school too, and it is around 45%, several hundred $K a year. Nobody advertises around those because there is no rewards to do so. If you want to start a business and make money, do not rule out old economy, and bootstrapping. Whatever VCs say.

cyborgx7 8y ago

Only in the insane world of "startup" culture, a sustainable business that meets enough customer demand to pay their employees and make some profit, is a bad thing.

dbcurtis 8y ago
If you take money from VC’s and compensate employees with stock options then you need to show VC returns. If the company can’t provide VC returns, don’t take VC money, find another source of funding.